That's what I thought too. An important statistical question:. Are enough samples taken to measure the average of the random variable? I doubt it. If not, the measurement is meaningless.
I think it was AnalogMagic who made the remark that phase in crosstalks measurements is meaningless, but without elaboration. So I decided to do some further investigation by measuring crosstalks traces at different times. The outcome is summarized in the attached photo. What are your thoughts...
Thank you for the very enlightening reply.
First I am in total agreement about the complexity of how the different adjustable parameters are intertwined and can affect what many could hear. Not dissimilar to how the stock market can be affected by the web of correlated economic factors Greed...
Hi JR
With your sophisticated equipment, I hope you can shed some light on:
When a particular tonearm height is changed by say, 2 mm and other values, how much is the height of the rear end of the cantilever has changed for a particular cartridge? That will be an interesting academic exercise...
Me too. The entire purpose of my post was to alert people not to religiously follow that 4mm is equivalent to 1 deg, especially when they think they have measured SRA "precisely" using a microscope. It's been repeated by many others that all adjustable parameters are inter-related and changing...
The only point I was trying to make is only geometrical: changing tonearm height by 4 mm does not mean SRA changes by 1 deg. I totally agree that the difference we hear is due to change in VTF, azimuth, zenith, etc. But the exact explanation probably is too complex an issue for all of us to...
To address your first point. When the tonearm height changes and the stylus remains in contact with the record surface, the cantilever must rotate somewhat when the suspension is not a RIGID point. If it were rigid, the rotation of the tonearm about its pivot will have to totally accomodate that...
Since my post above, few friends expressed they had difficulty to understand the math involved. It is actutally quite simple, but I did not do a good job explaining it. So I decided to tidy up the write-up. Here it goes:
Tonearm Height and SRA
It’s been widely accepted that changing a 9”...
I did a quantitive ESTIMATE, as guideline only, on the quantitive relationship between SRA and tonearm height. Please see:
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/tonearm-height-sra-misconception.35324/
First, we need to get one fact straight. As long as there is an overhang beyond the spindle, there are TWO null points. If the spindle to pivot distance is slightly "off" from manufacturer's specification, we get just one null point using HIS protractor. However, you still have another null...
It’s been widely accepted that changing a 9” tonearm’s height by 4 mm will approximately alter the SRA by 1 degree. This contradicts valid – to me - claims by audiophiles that they can hear the difference when the aforementioned height changes by a fraction of a mm.
Bear in mind the tonearm +...
The day that AI can take over should not be too far away: we will then get perfect coils alignment, stylus mounting on cantilever, and precise attachment of the latter to the body. Audio Technica, Ortofon, .. should have the resources to go that way. Maybe already.
The reason why you could only get the cartridge body aligned at A and not ta B is that the pivot-spindle distance is off. The null points on your protractor are not those for the pivot-spindle distance you've got. This is straightforward trigonometry.
One way to overcome this without drilling a...
One thing I never understood is the phase difference measured by Adjust+ ranges from 0-180. Why not 0-360 or -180 to +180 deg? Traces shown on an oscilloscope are definitive.
JB:
Here is the link: https://www.audioasylum.com/messages/vinyl/919668/an-oscilloscope-is-simply-a-measurement-tool.
I'm not sure what you mean by "this"? Is it why signal and crosstalk are almost in phase for some cartridges and almost out of phase for others (minority).
I did a rough...
Thanks for bringing out the importance of that horizontal line. I always have difficulty determining exactly where that line is even if I place a toothpick lined up (?) with the long edge of the cartridge body.
Above is the Shibata datasheet. Based on the angle (24+-1 deg, i.e. 23-25 deg) circled in red, your cantilever should be at an angle of 25-27 degrees with the record surface for SRA = 92 deg. While it is extremely difficult to measure SRA accurately for any stylus profile, it is much easier to...
Thanks again J.R. You clarified my lingering doubt quantitatively that 4 mm is not quite equivalent to 1 deg and how much it is off for the cartridge on which your figures are based. I assume the figures in the rightmost column are from calculations for particular values of compliance...
This estimate is probably correct. But this brings out the doubt on the validity of another common belief: raising a 9" tonearm by 4 mm results in a change in SRA of 1 deg. This is true if the cantilever were RIGIDLY attached to the tonearm, i.e. no flexing when the tonearm height is altered...
J.R. Thanks for the detailed exposition. I do have a question to raise with regard to Fremer's method of measuring SRA using a CD as the platform. A CD has much finer grooves vs a record. When a stylus rests on either CD or LP, the point(s) of the stylus in contact with the grooves in each is...
The phase measurement provided by Adjust+ has always been a conundrum for me. One can show via electromagnetic theory that the phase between main signal and its crosstalk depends only on the ratio L/R, where L is the inductance of the cartridge coil and R = (its DC resistance + load seen by the...
"a TINY 0.15mm change in cartridge height will cause a relatively large 1.4 degree change in VTA/SRA. " Can't agree with that more. I have long been a non-believer that a change of arm height by 4 mm results in a change of 1 deg change in SRA for a 9" arm. This is true only if the point/line of...
Above photo from Namiki site. Could be certain they got things right when it was taken. Now let's see photos I took and note how different the results are. I had to taken the average of the outcomes to match that from Namiki photo.
This shows how inaccurate amateur setups could be. Try...
Measuring SRA using a microscope is not an easy undertaking if one thinks carefully how one has to align its axis absolutely perpendicular to the plane of the cartridge, as well as centering the stylus in the field of view. However measuring the cantilever angle is a lot easier. The correct...
The way that phases in crosstalks are measured motivated me to dwell further into the issue. I'll use my experience using Visual Analyzer (VA) as an illustration of what I found.
VA provides two ways to do it: from captured scope or captured spectrum. For the former, read zero crossings of...
Perhaps we should clarify whether we are talking about the same phase angles. The numerical values of phase angles in my VA plots are of no significance. It is the difference between those of the two channels that matters, and it is given by tan ? = ?L/R. Your are absolutely correct that this...
I made crosstalks measurements on two cartridges using Visual Analyzer software, which can double up as an oscilloscope and a spectrum analyzer. The latter can display frequency spectrum, as well as phase spectrum.
First, the cartridge with quite normal phase relationship shown in the bottom...
I am in complete agreement with your last paragraph. Just let your ears be YOUR final arbiter. I have had the experience that often I still have to fine tune the azimuth after I think I have the best setting from measurements. After fine tuning, I would get smoother vocals, be that male or...