The Vivaldi + Upsampler will beat it-but I would miss the clock. More weight on each note, ability to unravel the music a bit better, more air/resolution vs Rossini+clock. However the Rossini+clock is no slouch. In fact if you heard the Rossini + Clock I'd wonder why you needed more (until you hear the Vivaldi side by side). The clock will add sense of flow/pace, space, resolution, bass control and even better unraveling...so for a price, the Vivaldi keeps upping its performance level vs Rossini.
DCS Rossini
- Thread starter Barry2013
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The Vivaldi + Upsampler will beat it-but I would miss the clock. More weight on each note, ability to unravel the music a bit better, more air/resolution vs Rossini+clock. However the Rossini+clock is no slouch. In fact if you heard the Rossini + Clock I'd wonder why you needed more (until you hear the Vivaldi side by side). The clock will add sense of flow/pace, space, resolution, bass control and even better unraveling...so for a price, the Vivaldi keeps upping its performance level vs Rossini.
I do. Like a LOT more digital. Used to be always 80% vinyl...now I find it's about 80% digital. It's been that big of a flip...but mostly it's what music I want to listen to dictates the source. I've also really slowed buying lps. Mostly buying downloads or redbook cds (filling in titles I don't have on vinyl). I'm amazed that I listen to redbook...I've bought maybe 25 redbook cd's in last 6 months, the upsampler really helps here.
each format has it's strength and weaknesses...but I now find each equally enjoyable.
Well, I'm not surprised. Al M. and I were extremely impressed when we heard the Vivaldi and subsequently, the Rossini DAC, at Goodwin's High End. Both were in Spectral/Magico/MIT systems which really revealed what the sources were capable of producing.
Your last sentence is interesting. Al M. only has digital, and I only listen to analog. And yet, our systems exhibit similar strengths, namely, dynamics and presence. Tone, degree of resolution and extension and soundstaging are different; the former two more dependent on source and the latter two more dependent on speakers and room.
The latest generation of dCS is truly impressive.
Jfrech,
Nice thread! Thank you for sharing your experiences!!!!
One of the things I am unclear about in the dcs product line is the value of the upsampler. Is the purpose of this box to make everything "smooth" like dsd?
I may be in the minority here- and I am not a format warrior like so many bored audiophiles, but in MOST cases I find I enjoy pcm more than dsd. DSD is just overly harmonic rich and too smooth, blah, and boring, as it fails to capture the dynamic snap of music that I perceive as a realism trigger... obviously not on all recordings...
My favorite format is an original vinyl record ripped to high resolution pcm. Considering my preferences, would the upsampler help or hurt in this case?
Hi you're welcome
To me, the value of the upsampler is 2 fold. #1 makes redbook physical cd's incredibly enjoyable and nearly equal to hi rez formats and vinyl (yes I said that). The recording quality still matters on redbook it's not going to make a compressed pop music cd sound good. #2 the upsampler now becomes a "source" for hi rez formats via USB/USB key or ethernet Network Attached Storage (best). So you can listen to any sampling rate and up sample to any higher rez rate. So #2 is the key here...the upsampler is a source component for hi rez.
I do not share your point that it makes things "smooth". After all it can output PCM 16-44 up to 24-384 (DXD). If you're not a DSD fan (hey some aren't) you can always stick with PCM. DXD sounds fantastic btw - to me more incisive (to your smoothing point maybe?) where DSD unravels things a bit better. However dCS DSD is a bit of a different animal if you haven't heard it at home with a dCS component. Some of my best sound in my system is 24/88 files up sampled to 24/352 pcm. Again recording quality seems to be the key. Also directly recorded to DSD is pretty amazing.
The up sampler would be a immense value to your vinyl to pcm rips. Again, if your not a dsd fan (and some aren't !) stay in PCM but go to a higher rez.
Hope this helps. Trying to stay away from the DSD or PCM debate as best I can
This is also happening to me - almost all new music I am interested comes in CD I am now listening to 90% digital. I currently feel obliged to optimize my system for digital, particularly as new quality vinyl is becoming very expensive in Europe, due to high shipping costs and taxes.
Hi you're welcome
To me, the value of the upsampler is 2 fold. #1 makes redbook physical cd's incredibly enjoyable and nearly equal to hi rez formats and vinyl (yes I said that). The recording quality still matters on redbook it's not going to make a compressed pop music cd sound good. #2 the upsampler now becomes a "source" for hi rez formats via USB/USB key or ethernet Network Attached Storage (best). So you can listen to any sampling rate and up sample to any higher rez rate. So #2 is the key here...the upsampler is a source component for hi rez. (...)
Just one detail - when you are playing a CD in the Vivaldi transport it goes through the upsampler? Redbook is then upsampled three times - at the palyer, at the upsampler and at the DAC?
Lately I've been enjoying digital much more than my analog. Making me wonder how difference the Rossini would make... Does the clock make that much of a difference?
Yes on the clock in my opinion. It's substantive-better weight on the notes, better resolution and portrayal of space. It's also one of those things easy to A/B. Just a BNC cable to engage or disengage.
Hi, no, if you're using the upsampler, the up sampling stuff in the Transport is skipped. The DAC isn't up sampling...it's playing what ever bit rate the Trans or UPS is feeding it...so just once in all cases. The up sampling via upsampler is better than up sampling via transport. But up sampling via trans better than nothing in a dCS set up...
Given the digital you both have...i am not surprised! Vivaldi and Metronome Kalista! I listen to digital 100% of the time!
(for those who havent checked my signature, i am digital only)...and i have to admit, i have heard and truly admire great LP...i would love to hear tape. But i feel incredibly satisfied with digital after digital after digital...but it was not always this way....for years i could never listen to orchestral or piano solo...it took years to get the system right and the digital. Sadly, i have hit that point again because of our recent move and new setup...but with some help from the professionals, we hope to get us back to that point again...with all the benefits of the new room which are already showing themselves.
But coming back to this thread, i have found some digital besides Zanden which i feel like i could easily easily live with (and Vivaldi and Metronome Kalista are 2)...and i suspect Rossini is the same. i have yet to hear, but may make an effort to do so.
Hi MadFloyd, in digital, jitter is the enemy. As one of few absolutes in audio - along with a better room, a better clock always makes a BIG difference. As I mentioned in another thread, you have one of the most transparent DACs in the market today, despite an average clock inside it. Even if it's not your flavor, you should still hear your DAC with a good clock, such as an Esoteric, before you move it out. It could make such a substantial difference, including better timing, rightness of the music, as well as "...better weight on the notes, better resolution and portrayal of space..." that Jfrech mentioned above, that you may keep it with your Magicos.
Yes, as long as we call jitter everything we do not know about ...
If jitter was the only enemy digital would be perfect since long, jitter is perfectly understandable and solvable.
Thanks - what type of cable and brand do you use to connect your Transport to the Upsampler?
I've tried a couple. Stock (which was van den hul) Purist, Cardas but bought and love Transparent Reference XL. Trans to Ups is a single AES/EBU cable...
I sort of gamve up as it's very hard to find much info on the concept of adding a separate clock (apart from dCS). I see a G-02 on Esoteric's website. Is that compatible with my NADAC? No idea. NADAC have a very proprietary networking scheme. I did find a review for an Esoteric G-01 master clock for $23k which is basically the price of the Rossini.
I think the uber-priced clock is for their $60K dacs. If you can have a dealer loan you the junior clock, you may like it better than the dcs - or not. In my experiences, it changes the nadac sound pretty dramatically. But if you already really like the Rossini, go for it (and their clock).
Correct. I am sure either the Nadac dealer or the Esoteric dealer can explain it and tell you the specs of the clock and what cable you need. (Other branded clocks work also.) So if getting one is not a big pain in the a$$, try it. It will be a learning experience, one way or another. Or if it's too much hassle, go with dcs. Good Luck!
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