Totaldac versus Rockna Wavedream?

lordcloud

Well-Known Member
Jul 5, 2016
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Round Rock, Texas
Has anyone gotten significant listening time with both of these dacs (any model of the Totaldac, though I'm looking at possibly purchasing the Dual) and can help me out with their thoughts on the differences?

I've read that the Rockna excels in detail and information retrieval but doesn't sound harsh, and that the Totaldacs excel at texture, space, and just sounding like real music.

I'm wanting a DAC that gives me an much of the truth as possible (within budget), and doesn't add much of itself.

Thanks.
 

Dthagerty@aol.com

VIP/Donor
Dec 31, 2015
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Solana Beach, CA
I haven’t heard the Rockna, but there are no responses, so...

I own the d1-seven and Dual. The Dual is used as the only source in a 2nd system. When I listen to music in the 2nd system, which is often, I’m not thinking about what is missing compared to my main system. I’m just deeply engaged and enjoying the heck out of the music. It all starts with the totaldac dual. I think the Dual sounds wonderfully real. For me, that’s what I look for in a music system. Highly, highly recommended.
 

lordcloud

Well-Known Member
Jul 5, 2016
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Round Rock, Texas
I haven’t heard the Rockna, but there are no responses, so...

I own the d1-seven and Dual. The Dual is used as the only source in a 2nd system. When I listen to music in the 2nd system, which is often, I’m not thinking about what is missing compared to my main system. I’m just deeply engaged and enjoying the heck out of the music. It all starts with the totaldac dual. I think the Dual sounds wonderfully real. For me, that’s what I look for in a music system. Highly, highly recommended.

Thanks for your response.

What, in your experience, does the Dual lack that the Seven possess? Or maybe it's easier to answer what the Seven has over the Dual.

Thanks.

Henri
 

CKKeung

Well-Known Member
Jun 17, 2011
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I like the Totaldac Dual, Six, Direct and Twelve Mk2, particularly the latter two, bscause of their purity/transparency/agility.

IMHO the Seven has got a new buffer stage and has excellent macrodynamics but there are compromises.
I would choose the similarly priced Direct instead, if its lower output can match the system.
 

Saleh84

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Jul 26, 2019
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No one has answered the original question )) How do they fair vs the rockna wavedream signature XLR?
 

worldwide

Well-Known Member
Sep 10, 2019
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I have owned both DACs and both manufacturers are exceptional. We are the North American distributor for Rockna and we feel that the combination of the Rockna Signature DAC and the Rockna Wavedream net server is really what makes Rockna one of the top digital manufacturers in the world. We have A/B tested 79 different digital front ends and our reference digital front end for the past two years has been the Rockna Signature DAC and the Rockna Wavedream net server.

In regards to differences between the two DACs, you start splitting hairs at some point. The two DACs are actually more similar than different and this is highly unusual when comparing dacs. We just felt that Rockna as a combination server and dac was easier to use and is super reliable versus some of the other server/DAC combinations that we auditioned. The Rockna server and DAC are also designed from the ground up and are designed to work together with their matching clocks via i2S cable. Truth be told Vincent at Total DAC is also an excellent designer and I have zero bad things to say about Total DAC.

Rockna and Total Dac would be my top two favorite digital front ends.

Cheers;

Bob; info@worldwidewholesales.com
 

Saleh84

Well-Known Member
Jul 26, 2019
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thanks worldwide. I actually have a Rockna wavedream signature XLR on the way. I was just curios and craving more information. not as much as I hoped about this Dac sound can be found online.
have you compared vs Aries Cerat Kassandra ref ii among those "79" different digital fronts? would you care to mention some dacs by name rather than just a number if its okay? you have the freedom to do that I believe! some description of the sound would be appricated as well, not just by me, but other people who might be reading this post.
I would love to hear an end user experience though as well. rockna owner seems not to be NOT posting much which could be a good sign! busy enjoying their music rather than writing about it!
 

worldwide

Well-Known Member
Sep 10, 2019
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Hi,
We actually have not heard the Aries Cerat Kassandra ref ii but it is definitely a manufacture that has been on my radar for a few years. We contacted the company directly in regards to purchasing one of their DACs but we received zero response. There's a long list of very good DACs that we've heard including the BA Labo that was just traded in about two weeks ago. We had the Nagra HD traded in at the end of last year and it was also an excellent DAC. As I said in my previous e-mail there are some very good DACs but it is a combination of the DAC and the server, seeing each other as perfect as possible, that in my opinion makes the magic or allows you to get closer to the soul of the music.

There has been a ton of DACs out of the 79 that were average sounding and we certainly are not going to go on a form and trash somebody else's DAC because what I consider average could sound completely different in somebody else's listening room. There are far too many variables for me to sit down and tell you that everything I hear in my listening room is right and everything else in someone else's listening room is wrong. IMHO audio is 80% personal preference.

I have contacted a few stores and end-users in regards to this form and we'll see if anybody response. I hope this helps and I understand you were looking for a more concrete conclusions but as the North American distributor it will only sound like sales coming from my company.

Cheers,
 

jianming

New Member
Feb 13, 2020
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I have had Rockna Wavedream DAC ( not signaure ) XLR and Rockna NET music server since Jan 2019. Never own a total dac. Sound is amazingly super detailed, with weight yet natural. Going with XLR is definitely the right choice, sounded better than RCA. Matches with it's music server and going with I2S connection, playing high rez music files sounded really analog. I have coaxial connection from my OPPO BDP-203 into wavedream dac, and it tells me how inferior my OPPO unit is, compared to the Rockna NET music server. My OPPO unit has been modded with VanityHD + Furutech IEC + LPS + solid core internal wires + Hifi Tuning fuse which someone said sounded very close to his Nagra dac which cost $24k! But the honest dac tells me the sound of my modded OPPO unit is no where near the Rockna music server. When playing Roon and using high rez music files, it is so musical, vocals sounded sweet and full of emotions, highs are delicately extended, bass was tight and fast and deep. Soundstage is wide, layered, deep (depth is beyond the front wall) and highs reaches to the ceiling. It sounded live in my room. While playing movies, i got scared out of my chair few times. Whatever you throws at it, if it is high quality, you will not be disappointed. Jimmy
311 Pair.jpg
 

Aries Cerat

Industry Expert
May 30, 2015
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Hi,
We actually have not heard the Aries Cerat Kassandra ref ii but it is definitely a manufacture that has been on my radar for a few years. We contacted the company directly in regards to purchasing one of their DACs but we received zero response. ,

Apologies for "hijacking" the thread, but please allow me for a second.
We have received an email with your company name back in July,and replied,but this is no surprise to me you did not receive it as we do have some reoccuring email server issues that we try to solve ,problem with bouncing outcoming emails.We are now using parallel email accounts,until we resolve it.
Thank you for allowing to clarify,please proceed :)

Cheers
Stavros
 
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Saleh84

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Jul 26, 2019
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thanks Jianming,
I plan initially to use the wavedream with my aurender N10 server/streamer via AES (AQ wel sig), then moving forward I might consider the wavedream NET. I do believe in cables, and I haven't heard of an HDMI cable that was made purely for audio yet. maybe an audioquest diamond HDMI would do, but I have heard the difference between AQ diamond AES and wel signature AES, and they made me pay for the wel even its triple the price... anyhow lets see. need to put my hands on the DAC first and listen for myself!

Stavros, its not my thread but at least for me, you are always welcome!! you make great stuff man, I still can't get over the sound of Genus + kassandra at omar's place. if money was not an issue, and If I haven't already committed to the LM 845 amp I currently have (which is awesome but I believe genus is better), I would have certainly purchased the same combination - the handshake is unbeatable. it a "SYSTEM". I was contemplating to get a kassandra myself but ended up ordering a Rockna WD signature DAC as I heard excellent stuff about it, then I managed to get a good deal which helped a lot (yes kassandra was out of my budget...), plus many other small factors for my own setup which the rockna will work with better probably. I was also curious to see how it compares vs your beast of a dac :)
 
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lordcloud

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Jul 5, 2016
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If it were within my budget, the Kassandra would likely be at the top of my list.
 
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xcowdoc

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Feb 19, 2020
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I have not listened to the Total Dac. However, I went from Bricasti to PS Audio Directstream to Denafrips Terminator to the Rockna Wavedream Signature SE. Each one of these changes resulted in an easily heard improvements. While I had the PS Audio, I switched from usb to HDMI I2S. That was a big improvement. I would not even consider a sever that does not have the HDMI I2S connection. USB just does not compare. I now have the Wavedream NET server connected via HDMI I2S to my Wavedream NET. This is a superb combination which easily outperforms the Denafrips Termi with the NET server. This very well may be my last server and dac combination. The system has never sounded so good!
 

Saleh84

Well-Known Member
Jul 26, 2019
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I have not listened to the Total Dac. However, I went from Bricasti to PS Audio Directstream to Denafrips Terminator to the Rockna Wavedream Signature SE. Each one of these changes resulted in an easily heard improvements. While I had the PS Audio, I switched from usb to HDMI I2S. That was a big improvement. I would not even consider a sever that does not have the HDMI I2S connection. USB just does not compare. I now have the Wavedream NET server connected via HDMI I2S to my Wavedream NET. This is a superb combination which easily outperforms the Denafrips Termi with the NET server. This very well may be my last server and dac combination. The system has never sounded so good!
Thanks for your input)
I have opted for XLR version as it will be two r2r modules per side, which makes a difference according to what i read.
I share the same views about USB in general (not all implementations are equal), it just sounds flatter to my ear, details which are supposed to be in background are more forward vs spdif/AES presentation. This can be perceived as more details or more resultion for USB, but i think its not.
Never tried a server which can output I2s, i guess that might be the next step for me. For now, the rockna will be fed a signal with my trusty AES cable. Rockna is replacing a denafrips terminator which has got a lot better after the new DSP. I believe rockna will be better, soon will find out myself by how much. craving more performance is endless i guess!
 

xcowdoc

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2020
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I was turned on to the I2S by the designer of the server which I have had for several years before the NET. It was the Musica Pristina ACappella. The designer of that piece convinced me to try the HDMI connection when I got the PS Audio saying that it was markedly superior to usb. I was using the Curious usb cable at the time. So I hooked up a cheap HDMI cable. I was immediately convinced that I2S was the way to go. The Musica Pristina that I had had a 1 TB ssd holding all of my music. I also like that about the NET. I believe that music this way sounds superior to streaming. I believe that Ted Smith, the designer of PS Audio dacs has said the same thing. I have over 1300 albums on my NET. I do not even bother with streaming. The Wavedream combo is just superb. It has an advantage with the I2S requiring no conversion at the server nor dac to do usb.
 

CKKeung

Well-Known Member
Jun 17, 2011
3,053
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1,410
Hong Kong
Thanks for your input)
I have opted for XLR version as it will be two r2r modules per side, which makes a difference according to what i read.
I share the same views about USB in general (not all implementations are equal), it just sounds flatter to my ear, details which are supposed to be in background are more forward vs spdif/AES presentation. This can be perceived as more details or more resultion for USB, but i think its not.
Never tried a server which can output I2s, i guess that might be the next step for me. For now, the rockna will be fed a signal with my trusty AES cable. Rockna is replacing a denafrips terminator which has got a lot better after the new DSP. I believe rockna will be better, soon will find out myself by how much. craving more performance is endless i guess!
Must try the Rockna servers with your Wavedream DAC.
https://www.rockna-audio.com/products/wavedream-net

Both of them have I2S outputs and are perfect partners for Wavedream DAC.
 

Saleh84

Well-Known Member
Jul 26, 2019
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I'm indeed intrigued by Rockna streamers/servers, mainly for the I2s connection. possibly later on in future i will do something about that!

I don't want to change the thread topic, but since Xcowdoc mentioned using local files, I wanted to mention that my setup is Streaming based mainly, and I feel it's more than adequate. what I discovered, is by switching to a WIFI-less router, like this one:
https://www.ui.com/edgemax/edgerouter-x-sfp/
which is relatively very cheap, then have something like uptone etherregen switch (or sotm 10g) right before your streamer, with decent Ethernet cables to connect all this (AQ Vodka and one AQ diamond for last connection to streamer in my case), decent power supplies on router and switch (currently using IFI ipower bricks, soon to be replaced by an LPS from paul hynes), the streaming SQ from Qobus/Tidal goes through the roof!
you can connect your old router to the edgerouter as DHCP slave to get your WIFI which is needed for the control software. and if you are skeptical about doing any of this, just try the edgerouter as first step of tests. it actually has the biggest impact!
with these in place, I've compared with local files on Aurender N10, its very hard to tell a difference or even a preference! if streaming is lagging behind local files in your case, look upstream: the things right before your streamer will make a substantial difference.
even upgrading the power supply on your service provider main modem can improve things a notch!
anyhow, I shall mention my impressions once I receive my Rockna signature!
 

xcowdoc

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2020
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I am looking forward to your impressions of the Rockna DAC. I think you may have proved my point about what I believe is the best sound. My music goes from the internal ssd in my NET server via native I2S to the DAC with native I2S with nothing else in between. This is a very simple albeit expensive way to get what I believe is the very best sound. YMMV of course. I also am not smart enough to put together all the router, switches, power supplies, and cables, etc.
 

Saleh84

Well-Known Member
Jul 26, 2019
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well, after a quite some wait (thanks Corona virus for few extra weeks of that!), I have finally received my Rockna Wavedream signature balanced DAC. I have used it for almost a week and a half now, in order to get a good idea of whats going on and allow some break in. worth noting, I have sold my Aurender N10 before its arrival. certainly going for a Rockna wavelight streamer when its available (don't need the CD in the NET, wavelight would cheaper). so, I didn't get to have the exact same source to play with which is not ideal. at the moment, I've got to use it with a borrowed singxer SU-1 + laptop. and just today, I managed to borrow an Auralic Aries G1.

Ok, I honestly don't know where to start with my compliments! I'm not expert in describing sound, nor an expert in music, but I will try to summarize my impressions:
this DAC is another level compared to anything I have used in my system before, which are chord Dave (used for one week, borrowed) and Denafrips terminator (was my main DAC for a year and half). my temporary DAC which is a questyle CMA600i does not even count here.
-extreme purity jumped at me first. Dave had that over Terminator, but it was clinical/mechanical/thin sounding dac over all, (at least in my setup/cables), which made me accept slight grain in favor of full fat sound of the denafrips, kept it for that long. here with Rockna, I don't have to live with either or. pure sound, while having a delicious, just right amount of body.
-dynamics and dynamic range. did everything I hear before was getting compressed? the level between lowest level portions of a track and higher ones is mind blowing. if its in the recording, you will get it. it can clearly show you the difference between internet radio being mp3 and CD/High res.
-musicality and sheer speed. its very fast. PRAT at its finest.
-imaging and 3d, just went through the roof. its a tangible, realistic presentation, just life-like. with layers and further depth than I have ever had before.
-its very true to the track. I couldn't put my fingers on a general color or a description of the DAC sound flavour. I read that somewhere earlier at another forum, now I can understand such statement. some recordings show that there is unbelievable amount of information that was not rendered at full potential before, others tracks didn't show that. this is new to me!
I was afraid before I receive the dac of sibilance or sharp highs. oh, how wrong was I. the best highs rendering I ever heard. never gets annoying to your ears while extended and full of information. same applies for bass information.

my thoughts were, this is awesome, delicious and certainly deserves more recognition/ exposure. I wonder why there is not much of a chatter or information around this DAC and that company? they rock! could be the price point? or they don't care much for marketing? I wonder!

have to add that using Singxer Su-1, yes HDMI I2s is better that AES, even that I have a very high end AES cable. there is more details, there is sparkle, sound stage is larger, its just better, donno how to explain. I cant wait for a true I2s source to see the results!

if not for quarantine, I would have tried to put the wavedream vs the Aries Cerat kassandra ref 2. from memory, the kassandra is more euphoric for sure. it has some slight but very attractive coloration to its sound. the Rockna doesn't. is it the kassandra tube output, or older chips sound, I have no idea. anyhow, that's just from memory which is not totally dependable. once I'm able to put them against each other, will follow up.

yes, I recommend for a friend. I haven't that many DACs in my life to make any claims, but this is a super DAC for sure.
 

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