The Mysterious Case of the Listening Window! By Jeff Day, Positive Feedback

[tima]

With all due respect and I've said this before, some folks are obsessive / compulsive about their gear. As a result, they can become neurotic and negate the very reason that they began this hobby (to enjoy listening to music) in the first place.

I don't think that is unique to the audio hobby. Some find enjoyment in 'the journey'. There's nothing that says one does not continue enjoying music while trying to improve their sound. For those content with their system and/or its sound, that's fine too. No need to chide others if you're happy where you are.

 

[tima]

Unfortunately a comparison needs a lot of work - listening to many types of recordings using different techniques, and long explanations that are not compatible with the short reviews.

True. Most reviews are about the product under review - which is expected. It takes a fair amount of time and effort to swap reasonably comparable components in and out of a system several times. (Try swapping audio racks for comparison.) It takes time to write comparisons which can over-lengthen reviews. Most manufacturers will not lend a component for the purpose it being compared to another component that is the primary object of a review. I almost always have to do a comparison with something I already have, either that I own or that is visiting for its own review.

Bonzo's notion in #532 is not generally true for non-self-published reviews.

Nonetheless people want comparisons. For much of the hobby that is about gear it is about comparisons. Standalone reviews with no relative compare or contrast are less interesting and less helpful.

I have still to find a comparative (X/Y) section of a review that is really helpful and not misleading

Well ... maybe you're not reading reviews that have them Many (not all) of mine do. Pulling a fairly recent one out of the hat ... here.

 

[tima]

View attachment 70045
So what can you do ...

What can you do Bo-Peep?

LAMMSLIDE !

 

[the sound of Tao]

What can you do Bo-Peep?

LAMMSLIDE !

View attachment 70059

Awesome!! That’s a proper Lammslide baby... lovin that!!! enjoy in much good health

Where to from here Tim... Crank up some Shosty?? Sibelius?? or the one whose name we can no longer utter... clue: his 5th starts with four notes and fate itself is knocking at the door

 

[tima]

Awesome!! That’s a proper Lammslide baby... lovin that!!! enjoy in much good health

The LL1.1 - my goal is first a review. To give credit where it's due, that's Steve's gear (and photo.)

 

[the sound of Tao]

Throwing the listening window wide open with an all Beethoven evening ... a completely apolitical protest against all musical repression...sing it out loud and with love and joy!!!

Starting the night at Beethoven‘s Violin Concerto Op. 61 - Leonidas Kavakos and the BRSO... so much greatness and goodness to explore.

 

[the sound of Tao]

The LL1.1 - my goal is first a review. To give credit where it's due, that's Steve's gear (and photo.)

Tough job Tim you’ll have to struggle through am very much looking forward to your review.

 

[the sound of Tao]

Throwing the listening window wide open with an all Beethoven evening ... a completely apolitical protest against all musical repression...sing it out loud and with love and joy!!!

Starting the night at Beethoven‘s Violin Concerto Op. 61 - Leonidas Kavakos and the BRSO... so much greatness and goodness to explore.

I wonder how anyone could hear this violin concerto and hear anything other than breathtaking humanity.

 

[tima]

Tough job Tim you’ll have to struggle through am very much looking forward to your review.

Thanks! Could be next year. Hope to have the LP1 Sig covered before that. Now? I"m backlogged.

 

[morricab]

Hello Morricab

I agree with your definition of a serious listener except for a Set and Forget system.

What do you mean by that??

If you are constantly changing your set up to accomdate specific recordings as an example I see that as the tail wagging the dog and will lead to much confusion and anxiety

Once my system is setup unless I am changing something it stays as is regardless of the recording fidelity

Rob

Hi Rob,
What I mean is the guy who likes music, has some money (maybe rich maybe not) and goes into a shop and buys up what is recommended by the dealer without doing a lot of critical research and/or listening to a wide range of gear. He/she just knows he wants something "good" (translate as expensive by his/her standards and/or what the dealer recommends) and once he/she gets that they set it up as per dealer's instructions and listen to music with it. No tinkering, no upgrading, fussing over sonics and noise floor etc. It might be completely incorrectly setup in order to fit into that families (read the wife's ) "lifestyle", which is not centered around music. Maybe over time they get dissatisfied with the sound and then do a wholesale change to another (possibly more expensive) system that is set up and then left alone.

Now while that might not be the majority of audiophiles on this site, it is probably the majority of customers to dealers. It also fits a very large number of systems I have seen in apartments and homes here in Switzerland. The guy has money and some idea that he wants "good" sound...so he buys something like a B&O active speaker system (like this crazy flying saucer speakers they make), which isn't cheap, and put them willy nilly in the room. Or they get a Devialet and some box speakers that all fit nicely into a modern decor and sounds...ok as long as one is not too critical.

I think changing a system or items within a system is fine as long as you have a specific goal in mind on what to improve and not just because it "doesn't sound good". Those in pursuit of their ideal of "perfect" sound are not "set it and forget it", guys.

 

[microstrip]

True. Most reviews are about the product under review - which is expected. It takes a fair amount of time and effort to swap reasonably comparable components in and out of a system several times. (Try swapping audio racks for comparison.) It takes time to write comparisons which can over-lengthen reviews. Most manufacturers will not lend a component for the purpose it being compared to another component that is the primary object of a review. I almost always have to do a comparison with something I already have, either that I own or that is visiting for its own review.

Bonzo's notion in #532 is not generally true for non-self-published reviews.

Nonetheless people want comparisons. For much of the hobby that is about gear it is about comparisons. Standalone reviews with no relative compare or contrast are less interesting and less helpful.

Well ... maybe you're not reading reviews that have them Many (not all) of mine do. Pulling a fairly recent one out of the hat ... here.

Yes, I read and enjoy your reviews. They are very informative, something I praise in reviews. Fortunately what you call contrasts with the previous version are not exactly comparisons and you explain the conditioning conditions. I have a complete set of Crystal gold/silver cables (Dreamline) and know what they can do to a system.

IMHO to get any benefit of a review we must read a significant number of previous reviews of the reviewer, know his system, preferences and biases. For example, I would like if you could also use good digital in your amplifier reviews ...

 

[Robh3606]

Hello Morricab

Oh OK thanks I understand now. Just set it up like a sonus system. No optimization for placement or anything else just a shoe fit in the room decor rules! No effort from the owner.

Rob

 

[PeterA]

Hello Morricab

Oh OK thanks I understand now. Just set it up like a sonus system. No optimization for placement or anything else just a shoe fit in the room decor rules! No effort from the owner.

Rob

I never thought of such a system owner as an “audiophile”. Perhaps it’s just me. But if these types of owners are considered the herd and the vast majority of audiophiles, I guess I have been mistaken.

 

[Robh3606]

Hello Peter

You bring up a good point. You may not but I have seen some who personally do based on their dollar investment with a heavy lean on the dealer for advice and setup. After that?

Not all are that committed to take the time to go beyond that. Not everyone has the option or the space for a dedicated listen room as an example. So there are going to be compromises in set up that are unavoidable under those circumstances

I would have to agree that doesn't fit most of the people here. The real question is what defines an audiophile but that seems like another topic. Where do you draw the line between the "pretenders" and the committed not to be confused with mental heath issues although sometimes I wonder!

Rob

 

[thedudeabides]

Hello Morricab

Oh OK thanks I understand now. Just set it up like a sonus system. No optimization for placement or anything else just a shoe fit in the room decor rules! No effort from the owner.

Rob

Sounds like you don't understand what he meant either. He does explain in a later post. That's very helpful for those that can't read minds.

 

[microstrip]

(...) so he buys something like a B&O active speaker system (like this crazy flying saucer speakers they make), (...)

These speakers are something I would like to listen. Bang & Olufsen is a company with extensive research facilities and an excellent acoustics team. Their high priced A90 active speaker got an enthusiastic review by our member Kalman Rubinson in Stereophile https://www.stereophile.com/content/bang-olufsen-beolab-90-loudspeaker

 

[morricab]

Sounds like you don't understand what he meant either. He does explain in a later post. That's very helpful for those that can't read minds.

I guess you didn't when you consider "set and forget" to be a 30 year quest (or however long you have been going through gear) followed by a 6-8 months "optimization" .

 

[morricab]

These speakers are something I would like to listen. Bang & Olufsen is a company with extensive research facilities and an excellent acoustics team. Their high priced A90 active speaker got an enthusiastic review by our member Kalman Rubinson in Stereophile https://www.stereophile.com/content/bang-olufsen-beolab-90-loudspeaker

They soundEd like crap...especially because they were setup on opposite ends of the room! . But the guy is a hedge fund manager so what does he care about 25k...

 

[christoph]

They soundEd like crap...especially because they were setup on opposite ends of the room! . But the guy is a hedge fund manager so what does he care about 25k...

85k

 

[morricab]

85k

They weren’t the 90s. The predecessor to the 50 I think.