Advice on hifi system around 25-30k euro

[robje24b]

Hi, i'm looking for a new hifi system. Currently i have nothing, i've owned different brands of speakers (amphion, vivid, magico) and equipment (naim, linn, spectral, dcs) in the past but planning to start over. What i really want is to enjoy music my music. With afore mentioned brands of speakers/equipment i was always looking for the next upgrade to get even more resolution (that's not the equipments fault but the way it worked for me). So i'm thinking to do it a bit different this time. I would like to keep the box count as low as possible and i want to set myself a budget of 25-30k euro max (including cables) and for this i would like:
- a pair of speakers
- a turntable
- an integrated amplifier with phono stage (with or without a dac)
- a (streaming) dac (if the integrated doesn't have one)
- cables
So it's kind of a tight budget compared to the equipment i've owned before. Buying second hand would be ok. I will buy a roon nucleus to serve as a roon core. I will listen mostly to tidal streams and will occasionally play an lp. I listen mostly to electronic music, 80's pop, singer songwriter and some indie music. I've never listened to tube gear but i'm very open to suggestions. Presentation of vocals is very important to me. Some lesser quality recordings also have to sound ok. And overall is has to sound fun and engaging. For the speakers the appearance has to be acceptable.

Any ideas on speaker/equipment combinations that would be worthwhile to listen too? Which have great synergy? Thanks in advance.

 

[Golum]

To keep it really simple and if you don't plan to change gear often you might think about Devialet Expert series (140, 220,...).
With that thing, you nail down amp, DAC, phono & streamer in one device. Pick a speakers which you find that pair with Devi well and you like and I'm sure you'll have left for a very nice TT on top.
BTW i have in my home country in apartment there exactly what i said. Super convenient, high WAF, and if you don't want to get crazy with gear swaps something you can live happily ever after and be super happy with the sound quality.
Just my two cents...

PS And you minimize the expense on cables

 

[robje24b]

Hi Golum,

Thank you for the suggestion. I forgot, i also owned a Devialet D-premier, later upgraded to 240 and 250 pro. It was indeed very convenient and that's why i've kept it for many years, but looking back it wasn't very engaging. It could be the (mis)match with my speakers at that time (vivid s1.5 and later magico s1mk1) making it too neutral / over detailed.

 

[Golum]

Might be due to speakers - i run mine with Sonus Faber Electa Amator 2 and its not the case.
Are you in Europe? If yes might give it a go with Vienna Acoustics Imperial Liszt...also very musical speaker...
If Dev is not an option, I heard Hegel has something with DAC/Streamer inside which will not break the bank..

 

[Hear Here]

Hi, i'm looking for a new hifi system. Currently i have nothing, i've owned different brands of speakers (amphion, vivid, magico) and equipment (naim, linn, spectral, dcs) in the past but planning to start over. What i really want is to enjoy music my music. With afore mentioned brands of speakers/equipment i was always looking for the next upgrade to get even more resolution (that's not the equipments fault but the way it worked for me). So i'm thinking to do it a bit different this time. I would like to keep the box count as low as possible and i want to set myself a budget of 25-30k euro max (including cables) and for this i would like:
- a pair of speakers
- a turntable
- an integrated amplifier with phono stage (with or without a dac)
- a (streaming) dac (if the integrated doesn't have one)
- cables
So it's kind of a tight budget compared to the equipment i've owned before. Buying second hand would be ok. I will buy a roon nucleus to serve as a roon core. I will listen mostly to tidal streams and will occasionally play an lp. I listen mostly to electronic music, 80's pop, singer songwriter and some indie music. I've never listened to tube gear but i'm very open to suggestions. Presentation of vocals is very important to me. Some lesser quality recordings also have to sound ok. And overall is has to sound fun and engaging. For the speakers the appearance has to be acceptable.

Any ideas on speaker/equipment combinations that would be worthwhile to listen too? Which have great synergy? Thanks in advance.

We don't know the size of your room, but I'm in the process of replacing my entire system and will be sticking with familiar brands as I've done tons of experimenting over the last 2 years and have decided to upgrade to latest versions.

And what I'm buying will fit in nicely with your budget.

Speakers - I've had Avantgarde horn speakers since 2003 but dabbled with other brands such as ATC50 (Active), KEF 107R and more recently Quad 2905/2912, Martin Logan 13A and Quadral. At first Unos, but now 2006-vintage Duos. I've been delighted with the AGs in both my present (975 sq ft) and previous (320 sq ft) listening rooms, so I've ordered the latest Duo XD speakers

Amp, etc - After buying or home trialing a dozen amps in the 7-12K price range, I settled on the NAD M32 integrated. However its replacement M33 is just about to be released and this is an integrated with phono stage, DAC, streamer and Dirac room correction - all in one box so a massive saving on cables. I don't use vinyl so can't comment on its phono stage performance but the M32 is a great amp at a bargain price. I've no doubt the Purifi-based M33 will be an improvement over the already very good M32.

I can't offer suggestions for a player but I'm sure others can.

So my new system will be simple and effective and one perhaps you should consider too - Avantgarde Duo XD plus NAD M33. That's all I need and if bought carefully by twisting dealer's arms, within your budget even with a modest player and one pair of phono interconnects and speaker cables. Peter

 

[bonzo75]

Hi, i'm looking for a new hifi system. Currently i have nothing, i've owned different brands of speakers (amphion, vivid, magico) and equipment (naim, linn, spectral, dcs) in the past but planning to start over. What i really want is to enjoy music my music. With afore mentioned brands of speakers/equipment i was always looking for the next upgrade to get even more resolution (that's not the equipments fault but the way it worked for me). So i'm thinking to do it a bit different this time. I would like to keep the box count as low as possible and i want to set myself a budget of 25-30k euro max (including cables) and for this i would like:
- a pair of speakers
- a turntable
- an integrated amplifier with phono stage (with or without a dac)
- a (streaming) dac (if the integrated doesn't have one)
- cables
So it's kind of a tight budget compared to the equipment i've owned before. Buying second hand would be ok. I will buy a roon nucleus to serve as a roon core. I will listen mostly to tidal streams and will occasionally play an lp. I listen mostly to electronic music, 80's pop, singer songwriter and some indie music. I've never listened to tube gear but i'm very open to suggestions. Presentation of vocals is very important to me. Some lesser quality recordings also have to sound ok. And overall is has to sound fun and engaging. For the speakers the appearance has to be acceptable.

Any ideas on speaker/equipment combinations that would be worthwhile to listen too? Which have great synergy? Thanks in advance.

Vintage tannoy 15 inch gold in Lockwood cabinets or custom made cabinets in the UK, modded crossovers, a low priced musical integrated amp like Luxman 590, Lampi TRP dac. The analog can be managed to keep the total within 30k with various choices but before that what kind of music do you prefer.

 

[microstrip]

If you are considering buying second hand 30k euros can result in a very good system. But then you must also consider availability around you. What is your usual channel for used high-end? Remember that buying an exceptional item at a fabulous price can be a financial disaster if you do not manage to get the complements at the same discount level!

For people appreciating electronic music and vocals used ProAc speakers usually represent great value for money in Europe. I have listened to them with Audio Research , Mark Levinson or an integrated Dartzeel sounding great - as far as I remember they excel with Klaus Schultze and Xenakis ...

 

[andromedaaudio]

Second hand off course .

Okay here we go my take :

Magico V 3 10 k
CAT JL 5 9 K
CAT RENAISSANCE incl phono 7 K.
For integrated :
A second hand vitus class A seems to be good value to many people

Buy this first so you can distinguish the differences in carts / turntables
Dacs cables etc .
.

Ps Do it the other way around and you re doomed to keep swapping cables the rest of your life .
Lol

Ps i saw you ve already tried magico , these sound different from the alu enclosure ones though.

 

[Folsom]

If the word is purely "enjoy" then I think that's easy.

Speakers: Either Tannoy's like Ked suggests or JBL's (desirable ones with xxxx number or L100 for example)
Integrated: Have Sam's Audio Labs do up your choice of vintage receiver he works on.
Turntable: Should be able to get a Micro Seiki 5000 or higher.
Tonearm: A few SME3012R's or FR64's or whatever.
Cables: Use some tinned copper speaker wire and Radioshack RCA's for the streamer. (and if for the tonearm)
Digital: Whatever Cheap setup, Allo or something. Save the rest for carts and LPs.

That'll take about $30k total. And no none of what I said is a joke in any way. Very serious, many recommendations like Radioshack RCA's are from the tippy-top of some preferences.

That's what I would consider if I wanted to just be sure I enjoyed the music.

 

[Hear Here]

Hi Golum,

Thank you for the suggestion. I forgot, i also owned a Devialet D-premier, later upgraded to 240 and 250 pro. It was indeed very convenient and that's why i've kept it for many years, but looking back it wasn't very engaging. It could be the (mis)match with my speakers at that time (vivid s1.5 and later magico s1mk1) making it too neutral / over detailed.

I suggested the NAD M32 or M33 that I believe would better the Diavelet. The latter was all the rage a few years ago, but I wonder if they've kept up.

An alternative if you don''t like the idea of Class D is the Micromega M150 (or even M100). Despite its slim appearance it is AB and does all the NAD or Diavelet does. Both include MM/MC and the M150 also includes room correction and it's an option with the M100. Chosen as Best Sound in Show matched with Focal Sopra speakers at a recent big US show - ?AXPONA.

Simple, single box solution with minimal cable count - always a bonus as no cable has ever improved sound quality - the fewer the better for sound and wallet! Incidentally, Focal and Micromega work together and offer their speakers and amps in the same range of fancy colours. Peter

 

[microstrip]

I suggested the NAD M32 or M33 that I believe would better the Diavelet. The latter was all the rage a few years ago, but I wonder if they've kept up. (...)

The Infinity core version of Devialet is significantly better than the versions that were so much praised a few years ago. Still did not have the occasion to listen to it connected to the Extreme, but will not miss it if one shows in the neighborhood ... As far as I see it, they are selling regularly to music lovers. However it is a question of preference - even properly matched Devialet does not sound like tubes or DartZeels!

 

[Solypsa]

Ditto what Folsom and Ked said, with one caveat: Tannoy and (most) JBL despite being high-efficiency overall tend to like amps with power into them, hard for most integrated to do. If you have room for Keds favorite Altec clones or other (large by necessity) full range horn speaker the integrated amp search might be easier...

Given cost restraints this would likely still be modified vintage.

 

[bonzo75]

Ditto what Folsom and Ked said, with one caveat: Tannoy and (most) JBL despite being high-efficiency overall tend to like amps with power into them, hard for most integrated to do. If you have room for Keds favorite Altec clones or other (large by necessity) full range horn speaker the integrated amp search might be easier...

Given cost restraints this would likely still be modified vintage.

Hi I didn't say use less power for tannoy. I recommended a 30 watt class A Luxman integrated.

Also black, silver, red, were 16 ohms, reducing in efficiency, gold and later was 8. Gold you can still drive with 833c 20 watts as well as HPD 315a. Or with kronzilla, Nat, Allnic 6000.

These are very different to modern day tannoys.

For full range Altec he should be ready to DIY or work with custom builders

 

[Folsom]

Ditto what Folsom and Ked said, with one caveat: Tannoy and (most) JBL despite being high-efficiency overall tend to like amps with power into them, hard for most integrated to do. If you have room for Keds favorite Altec clones or other (large by necessity) full range horn speaker the integrated amp search might be easier...

Given cost restraints this would likely still be modified vintage.

I've found 15w to be sufficient for not large rooms on a tube amp. But sure, some speakers would be a no-go. Sorry I haven't tested every JBL, but I imagine a minor amount of homework would reveal that situation.

 

[andromedaaudio]

I must honestly say the couple of times i have heard devialet it sounded quite okay .
And for somebody who likes the gadgets that come with it and who wants a simple all out solution i can see the attraction

 

[Solypsa]

Just to be clear I'm not saying there aren't good integrated amps for Tannoy/JBL as clearly they exist. Just that selection widens out with less power requirements.

For new I wonder how the Lampi Amber Amp (dac + 12wpc tubes) into Cornwall IV would sound? Thats like €10k, leaving a nice chunk for the phono side and still well under budget. Never heard either myself so its just curiosity...

 

[Folsom]

I couldn't say on those either, except that I would hesitate to use new Cornwalls. There's a number of cheaper/ish speakers I wouldn't hesitate to use.

 

[stehno]

Hi, i'm looking for a new hifi system. Currently i have nothing, i've owned different brands of speakers (amphion, vivid, magico) and equipment (naim, linn, spectral, dcs) in the past but planning to start over. What i really want is to enjoy music my music. With afore mentioned brands of speakers/equipment i was always looking for the next upgrade to get even more resolution (that's not the equipments fault but the way it worked for me). So i'm thinking to do it a bit different this time. I would like to keep the box count as low as possible and i want to set myself a budget of 25-30k euro max (including cables) and for this i would like:
- a pair of speakers
- a turntable
- an integrated amplifier with phono stage (with or without a dac)
- a (streaming) dac (if the integrated doesn't have one)
- cables
So it's kind of a tight budget compared to the equipment i've owned before. Buying second hand would be ok. I will buy a roon nucleus to serve as a roon core. I will listen mostly to tidal streams and will occasionally play an lp. I listen mostly to electronic music, 80's pop, singer songwriter and some indie music. I've never listened to tube gear but i'm very open to suggestions. Presentation of vocals is very important to me. Some lesser quality recordings also have to sound ok. And overall is has to sound fun and engaging. For the speakers the appearance has to be acceptable.

Any ideas on speaker/equipment combinations that would be worthwhile to listen too? Which have great synergy? Thanks in advance.

You said you wanted to do things differently this time. I'm curious how this might be different than your previoius endeavors.

But your OP is excellent. Even if it's just to see what others may suggest or perceive as different.

 

[robje24b]

Thank you for all the replies so far. I’ve never looked into Tannoy. How is the heritage line-up ( Arden, cheviot, eaton). I quite like the retro look. I’ve been considering JBL L100 classics for the same reason.

Should these speakers be paired with tube gear for best results? And are there Tube amplifiers with DAC and phono stage integrated you know of that would pair well?

As i wrote in my original post, most music has to sound enjoyable. Ultra-resolution is not the most important. But i don’t want a sloppy bass when listening to Electronic music or a thin sound when listening to 80’s recordings.

 

[christoph]

For new I wonder how the Lampi Amber Amp (dac + 12wpc tubes) into Cornwall IV would sound? Thats like €10k, leaving a nice chunk for the phono side and still well under budget. Never heard either myself so its just curiosity...

The Lampizator Amber3Amp sounds absolutely awesome and bested some higly regarded much more expensive pure integrated as well as power amps, while the Amber3Amp additionally incorporates the astonishingly good sounding Amber3 DAC.

When you order it, just make sure you order it WITH remote volume control as this is not an official option.

I tried the Amber3Amp on the following speakers and the 12 Watts have never been the slightest issue:

hORNS Universum 3 (in my humungous living room), Heil Kithara, Living Voice Air Scout, Live Act Audio 110, Tobian Coax 12, Odeon No. 28/3, Odeon Midas and if I find the time, I will get cheeky and hook it up to the Apogee Studio Grands as well

The Lampi Amber3Amp does get rather hot and is quite a heavy and big beast. Especially the depth (Big7 chassis) is considerable

If one can live with the heat, the size and the 12 Watts (sounds like A LOT more!), this is an extremely good sounding all-in-one piece of gear that gets a BIG thumbs up from (picky) me