Hiring an external professional to tweak/optimize our audio systems?

[CKKeung]

There is a very interesting thread on the Audioexotics Forum recently :
http://audioexotics.vanillacommunit...-the-world-renowned-audio-system-optimiser/p1
Worth reading definitely!

Mr. Sterling Trayle and his expert service had been mentioned/reported on WBF and some webzines before :
http://www.theaudiobeat.com/equipment/audio_systems_optimized.htm
https://www.hifiplus.com/articles/meet-your-expert-stirling-trayle-of-audio-systems-optimzed/
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/stirling-trayle-visit-to-uk.27786/

May the WBF members who had enjoyed Mr. Sterling's service please share with us your experience?
Thanks!

And what's WBF members' view on hiring a expert to do the task instead of by ourselves/with our audiophile friends?

 

[MtnHam]

I'm not the poster mentioned, but I did hire Stirling about 10 years ago, and I can highly recommend his service. Doing it yourself is great if you are qualified, but he comes with a lot of knowledge, experience and a great set of ears. He is often hired by major exhibitors at audio shows to set up their rooms.

 

[JackD201]

I think it is a great idea most especially if the professional hired is one that explains the causes and effects of the methods employed. I believe even people like us who have been in the hobby for decades will invariably see something new and ultimately, useful. As far as the end results, it would be great if thee professional were to specifically tailor to your tastes, even better open up aspects of performance previously not given weight.

The optimist in me is fascinated by potential. For me, the greatest pleasure being a hobbyist is being able to explore just how good you can make the gear you already have. Not only could hiring a good professional be fruittful, heck, it just might be a lot of fun!

 

[Elliot G.]

I would go a lot farther than that Jack. I personally believe and experience has shown me that I am correct that the overwhelming number of systems out there are INCORRECTLY set up!
Yes that is a bold statement but its sadly true. If you invest big cash in the gear why wouldn't you hire a pro to make it sing? This takes expertise and a lot of time to do. I think the set up is more important than the gear for if the speakers aren't positioned correctly you will NEVER get the system right.
to quote Dirty Harry
" a man's got to know his limitations"

 

[Empirical Audio]

Most Audiophiles don't set-up systems in strange hotel rooms every year and try to make them sound excellent. The ones who can do this successfully and get best of show despite the poor rooms should be sought out. Because manufacturers and dealers can get equipment for cost usually, they can experiment with more things than most audiophiles can afford. They also get free samples of player software, so they can compare these to each other. Many times, manufacturers and distributors know other manufacturers and distributors who get together to compare their products or others products. This gives them an extensive experience of the performance of products and how to optimize room setups. Some even mod products, so they get to experience even more products.

The people that do this can be very helpful to audiophiles in optimizing their systems, assuming they are willing to do so.

Steve N.

 

[CKKeung]

Reading the above-mentioned thread on Audioexotics Forum, I am fascinated by the meticulousness of Mr Trayle, particularly his setting up of the loudspeakers.
And I believe that he got golden ears too.

 

[JackD201]

I would go a lot farther than that Jack. I personally believe and experience has shown me that I am correct that the overwhelming number of systems out there are INCORRECTLY set up!
Yes that is a bold statement but its sadly true. If you invest big cash in the gear why wouldn't you hire a pro to make it sing? This takes expertise and a lot of time to do. I think the set up is more important than the gear for if the speakers aren't positioned correctly you will NEVER get the system right.
to quote Dirty Harry
" a man's got to know his limitations"

It is amazing how so many systems are set up to be "visually" right but are as a result, sonically compromised. I totally agree with you about speaker placement. There are well established rules and some popular set up procedures. I have found that these provide great starting points but really, so much depends on how a particular speaker radiates its energy output. What I find a pity is when owners are afraid to try positions that stray too far from what we've been made accustomed to seeing as correct. The most basic example is toe in. Some speakers need a little, some need a lot. The most common mistake I come across is too much toe in. The second most common is having speakers pulled out too far into a room.

I must say that I fall into these very traps myself even now when my energy is low and I just want to accomplish no more than a thorough delivery inspection. When one goes on to set up a full display whether at the shop or in a show the expectations and thus the standards are much, much higher as Steve N says. For me however, setting up for clients is much easier. It's not easier because the procedure is any different. It's easier because I am trying tp please just one person. Commercial displays need to satisfy a much wider swathe. It becomes a challenge to straddle being flat out boring and ending up sounding impressive but engaging only on an intellectual level. With a single client you're after moving that client's soul.

 

[microstrip]

Just to point that a very interesting aspect of Sterling Trayle tuning technique is that he just positions and optimizes one speaker and than puts the other is an exact symmetrical condition. I do it many times for laziness, I do not feel guilty any more!

 

[Bobvin]

I have no problem hiring professional help. After having my room acoustics designed by Bonnie of SoundSense, and paying for the resulting remodel, I had no problem with having the fellow from up in Seattle who had previously setup my Alexias come down and do it again in the new space. I have no problem admitting I don't have the patience or skill to setup a pair of speakers. Oh, sure, I can get them sounding pretty good on my own, but getting the balance of dynamics, imaging, bass extension, and tonality just right? I get lost, e.g. which of those characteristics was impacted the most by my moving the speaker 1/4" in any direction. Its more art than science, though the science informs the art in this case, to a point.

 

[cjfrbw]

"Proper" or "Correct" setup are loaded terms in audiophilia and entirely relative.

A lot of guys actually have spent their time and lives making a living instead of obsessing on audio, so setting up an expensive audio system for them with a pro establishes a good beginning point to start wandering around the audio carnival.

I would bet that over 90 percent have an entirely different setup in a few years from using the service, though, just through nervosa. The blogosphere through time have been riddled with audio fussie-budgets who spent large sums on experts and sound architects and such and did not like the results.

I think the guy who asked Astrotoy if the tubed component was solid state would be a good candidate.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

i'm the poster boy for having a super room, lots of shiny toys, but being clue-less about what to do next. and......not realizing i was clue less. but that is how life goes. and over time i did get humbled, and listen to feedback, and get lots of good guidance.

but really; where the clouds parted for me was in really getting a reference in my head of what i wanted......where i was going. at that point, 10 years into the new room, the room and gear became assets. that was 4 years ago.

and now i do have what i wanted to have. not that it is what anyone else wants.

what a pro has is a clear reference. and if he listens to you the room owner about your desires, he can then adjust his reference to yours and get you to that point assuming he has the pieces to work with.

my opinion is that if you do know how you want things to sound, a clear reference. then dive in and make it happen. if you are not sure how you want it to sound, that is when you bring in some help.

 

[Folsom]

My friend who got the DEBRA setup had Stirling come over. There’s no doubt he’s a total expert at getting speakers set just right. If you are going buy a pair of speakers that costs as much as a luxury car, you may as well make sure they’re optimal.

*he does lots of other stuff, but I’ll let him and his website speak to that

 

[arnies]

I have had the pleasure of having Stirling perform his services on my modest system this past October, 2018. I would say that everything that is being described in that audioexotics thread (which I have previously read) is spot on. Both as to the methodology that Stirling uses as well as the results that Stirling is able to achieve. I was quite surprised at the sonic improvement in my system after he completed his work. When you hire Stirling you definitely get your money’s worth - he works 15 hour days, doesn’t stop for lunch - only dinner - and is a perfectionist.

Thanks, Arnie

 

[Ron Resnick]

I have no direct experience with Stirling, but I’ve heard only 100% good things about him and his services from manufacturers and dealers.

I am looking forward to spending a long time experimenting with speak positioning and listening chair location and acoustic treatments. That I have the patience for.

Plus in Southern California I am fortunate to have locally very experienced friends and reviewers and dealers whose critiques and assistance I look forward to receiving.

I don’t have the patience for, or the inclination to learn, the black art of tonearm set-up and cartridge alignment. If I were not as lucky as I am to be able to rely totally on DDK for this (for which I am very grateful) I totally could see myself hiring Stirling or Jim Smith sooner rather than later.

 

[CKKeung]

Other than Mr. Trayle, are there other reliable/competant professional tweakers?
Please share.
Thanks!

 

[Empirical Audio]

"Proper" or "Correct" setup are loaded terms in audiophilia and entirely relative.

A lot of guys actually have spent their time and lives making a living instead of obsessing on audio, so setting up an expensive audio system for them with a pro establishes a good beginning point to start wandering around the audio carnival.

I would bet that over 90 percent have an entirely different setup in a few years from using the service, though, just through nervosa. The blogosphere through time have been riddled with audio fussie-budgets who spent large sums on experts and sound architects and such and did not like the results.

I think the guy who asked Astrotoy if the tubed component was solid state would be a good candidate.

There are fundamental things like side-wall reflections and diffusers behind the speakers that work 100% of the time. Pointing a system into a corner works 100% of the time. Picking the right components and cables that do not require "synergy" with specific other components works 100% of the time.

 

[Empirical Audio]

Other than Mr. Trayle, are there other reliable/competant professional tweakers?
Please share.
Thanks!

I do a lot of tweaking for my customers, particularly local ones.

Let me ask you a question: If you change the coax cable from your MSB transport to your MSB DAC (assuming you use the coax), does it change the sound quality?

Steve N.

 

[VPN]

Other than Mr. Trayle, are there other reliable/competant professional tweakers?
Please share.
Thanks!

CKKeung,

There is Jim Smith.
He has a book, Get Better Sound, full of useful info, and performs room setup (his Roomplay service). I have not used his service.
http://getbettersound.com/index.php
http://getbettersound.com/rp.html
Cheers,

VPN

 

[Elliot G.]

I just spent three days with Stirling in a clients of his home.
I can only say 1). "A man needs to know his limitations" Dirty Harry
2). You don't know what you don't know!
After 40 years of being in this Industry and having my own particular set of skills it was truly "ear opening" to see his effort, expertise and dedication to making this client's system soar!

 

[stsxerses]

I engaged Stirling to set up my system in London...the results are beyond my expectations. I have Magico S7s in a smallish room and they now almost disappear. The improvements Stirling has wrought from my system exceed what I have been able to achieve from (expensive) component upgrades...quite simply if you have invested significantly in a system you owe it to yourself to engage a professional like Stirling to ensure it is properly set up...I wish I had come across him years ago