How satisfied?
- Thread starter GallantListener
- Start date
I just got a new cartridge. I can not be completely satisfied realizing that it continues to improve as it breaks in. Perhaps I'll be satisfied at the 100 hour mark.
Hi Ish
Long time no read from you.
Nice to see/read you here
Hi Chris, how are you?
Ish, I'm pretty sure I heard 2 iterations of Apogees over 3 separate visits. As I recall, one was a bastardized hybrid system that may have been Divas with a tweeter borrowed from another model, and other was the full range Apogees with TR amps.
In any case, your last post was a genuine treat. It summarizes exactly why many of us do what we do. For me, it's a learning/sharing experience for audio and music with like-minded people. I only wish I will be able to get to the "100% satisfied" level as often as you have managed to do.
I guess I am happy as I always take my time with listening to equipment at home with the rest of my kit before I buy, hence I make very few mistakes.
Since I buy new and my dealers are very good at lending me kit to try at home. Once I buy kit I tend to keep it for a long time.
I don’t feel the need to change kit, I have friends that do that all the time. For me mostly it’s all about the music, hence I am always buying more and more records.
Since I buy new and my dealers are very good at lending me kit to try at home. Once I buy kit I tend to keep it for a long time.
I don’t feel the need to change kit, I have friends that do that all the time. For me mostly it’s all about the music, hence I am always buying more and more records.
Fine, thank you.
And to answer to the (excellent) original posting:
Very content with my Systems and also with my marriage/wife
i could live the rest of my life with the current system.
Audio equipment has come and gone many times but not my wife of 46 years. There will never be an upgrade possible, she is the top of the line.
Audio equipment has come and gone many times but not my wife of 46 years. There will never be an upgrade possible, she is the top of the line.
I like what I have, I enjoy life as much as I can, hopefully for many years to come. To say I'm finished...nah, but I'm spending more time on listening rather than frantically trying to improve. I'm quite satisfied with the equipment I own, but need to work on the room. Don't like the lower bass, so may opt for a DBA solution, as many mention that that works in almost all cases.
CD Transport CH Precision D1: 100% (still, upgrade to D1.1 in house, however not yet installed)
DAC CH Precision C1: 100% (still upgrade to C1.1 in house, however not yet installed)
Pre-amp CH Precision L1: 100%
Power supply: CH Precision X1.
Power amp CH Precision M1.1 Mono: 100%
Gryphon Pendragon speakers: 100% (previously -many years ago- Apogee Full Range, followed by Apogee Grands).
Room 72M2 : 70%
Cables: IC Gryphon VIP : Satisfactory
Cables: Speaker Kharma top of the line: didn't compare to other cables, where I live not much available.
Dedicated power supply, 5 individual lines, directly from the main distribution panel.
Dedicated grounding.
Granite equipment rack. (650 kg)
Many other little things
All in all, quite happy indeed, but need to work on the Lower Frequencies. Can't change the room anymore, so need to think of something else. On the other hand, that is also an exiting part of the hobby I think. Don't mind doing some work, as long as I have enough time left to enjoy the music as well.
Next years' plans: Improve the lower frequencies, add a CH Precision T1 clock, and add more separate CH Precision power supplies (X1). Other than that.... no real plans, so nothing special. Sit back with a good glass of wine in hand, and smile whilst listening...that's how I spend most of the time.
Cheers,
Han
CD Transport CH Precision D1: 100% (still, upgrade to D1.1 in house, however not yet installed)
DAC CH Precision C1: 100% (still upgrade to C1.1 in house, however not yet installed)
Pre-amp CH Precision L1: 100%
Power supply: CH Precision X1.
Power amp CH Precision M1.1 Mono: 100%
Gryphon Pendragon speakers: 100% (previously -many years ago- Apogee Full Range, followed by Apogee Grands).
Room 72M2 : 70%
Cables: IC Gryphon VIP : Satisfactory
Cables: Speaker Kharma top of the line: didn't compare to other cables, where I live not much available.
Dedicated power supply, 5 individual lines, directly from the main distribution panel.
Dedicated grounding.
Granite equipment rack. (650 kg
)Many other little things
All in all, quite happy indeed, but need to work on the Lower Frequencies. Can't change the room anymore, so need to think of something else. On the other hand, that is also an exiting part of the hobby I think. Don't mind doing some work, as long as I have enough time left to enjoy the music as well.
Next years' plans: Improve the lower frequencies, add a CH Precision T1 clock, and add more separate CH Precision power supplies (X1). Other than that.... no real plans, so nothing special. Sit back with a good glass of wine in hand, and smile whilst listening...that's how I spend most of the time.
Cheers,
Han
I am happy but itches never go away. This is my hobby it will continue until I turn vegetarian.
I haven't eaten meat in 49 years and you can do both, trust me. Then again as a child I never liked the texture of meat so it was no big deal.
My wife might possibly trade me for a good veal chop given the right situation. :-o
New system is coming very soon. So, I'm finished. And if you believe that let me tell you about this large fish I once caught ... There will always be tweaking to do, esp as the audio industry continues to make advancements, et. al.
This said, I desire simply to listen to great music. I don't desire my mind to be cluttered with constantly thinking of system improvements while I'm already supposed to be enjoying a marvelous system.
So, any improvements will be compartmentalized and placed upon a very high shelf only to be accessed at a given date that I have yet to set. This gives me time to make a list and examine it multiple times and revise it as needed. This allows me to actually enjoy what I already have and will at the same time give me something to "possibly" look forward to in the future.
So, I'm finished. And if you believe that let me tell you about this large fish I once caught ... There will always be tweaking to do, esp as the audio industry continues to make advancements, et. al. This said, I desire simply to listen to great music. I don't desire my mind to be cluttered with constantly thinking of system improvements while I'm already supposed to be enjoying a marvelous system.
So, any improvements will be compartmentalized and placed upon a very high shelf only to be accessed at a given date that I have yet to set. This gives me time to make a list and examine it multiple times and revise it as needed. This allows me to actually enjoy what I already have and will at the same time give me something to "possibly" look forward to in the future.
How satisfied? Very much for both Audio and spouse . Its been a ten year journey to arrive at the system I listen to (and 28 years of my wife putting up with me and my various toys). That said, I'm always exploring new ways to improve on what I have (its the engineer in me) and perhaps continuously learning about my preferences in sound.
. Its been a ten year journey to arrive at the system I listen to (and 28 years of my wife putting up with me and my various toys). That said, I'm always exploring new ways to improve on what I have (its the engineer in me) and perhaps continuously learning about my preferences in sound.
Wow, many of you guys have terrific systems. But I do not see many of you have posted pictures in "media"
han-n: It looks awesome. I have not heard the speakers but have heard old model of Gryphon amps and they were fantastic.
As noted before, I come from owning the Apogee Full range model, after which I had moved up to the Apogee Grands. Love the Apogee sound, however many years ago due to many reasons I had to part with them, they needed service, and I couldn't do it myself. I even believe that at that time we were in contact, as you had expressed some interest as well. Eventually they have moved to Europe, have been restored to "better than new" and must still be a fantastic pair of speakers. I always kept the love for large ribbons, so when I finally was in a position to buy my new "ultimate" speakers again, I was a bit biased, and purposely was looking for a ribbon tower with separate woofer towers. Not too much choice, so the Gryphon Pendragon system filled in just nicely. Have not regretted that choice for a single day. With regard to the CH Precision equipment...all I can say to whoever is in the market for high end amps, cd-transport and dac, you HAVE to include the CH Precision equipment during your search. It is just absolutely and stunningly good. I'm not saying "the best", as that is still personnel as well, but at least you need to hear it. For me (my ears) it is the best I have ever heard/owned.
Nevertheless, I can kind of imagine how it will sound in your room, and I also believe that it must still be amongst the very best available, regardless of price level. Enjoy as long and as much as you can.
Cheers,
Han
Nevertheless, I can kind of imagine how it will sound in your room, and I also believe that it must still be amongst the very best available, regardless of price level. Enjoy as long and as much as you can.
Cheers,
Han
GallantListener: Welcome to WBF. I'm really looking forward to seeing the details about your newly built room when you have a chance to share them (especially since you indicate that you are 100% satisfied with it). I'm somewhat familiar with your previous room from reading your posts about it on other forums. I'll be interested in hearing how the new one is different.
Best regards,
Kevin
(btw, I'm also in the Dallas area)
Best regards,
Kevin
(btw, I'm also in the Dallas area)
Han, you are nice my friend.
1. I cannot just take any component and make it fit because I view my system as a synergistic and tightly integrated entity that has evolved through macro and micro adjustments and improvements with my own hands over two decades. That did take over 200 components of ultra-high end quality.
When I say system it means it means everything in the system, ranging from speakers to shelves -- even the room color and carpet color (well, that might be a bit of a stretch though).
2. I am not pre- or for-biased against brand -- unlike most audiophiles who look for finding something lacking in other people's system, I try to find something positive from other people's systems to see if I can learn something new.
3. I have owned and experimented over 15 Apogees models, which I ripped apart, moded, tweaked, repaired by myself or by others, and even combined different ones to create new speakers, experimented with their crossover, and impedance. I even drove the FR with one amp by making a new passive crossover myself (only to go back to the original specs designed by Leo Spiegel that were the most correct; people on audio forums were just posting nonsense with new crossovers ideas). But I often ignore what the manufacturer recommends and I usually dissect a component to see the inside and figure if I can make improvements in it. If it confirms the recommendations of the manufacturer, fine, otherwise I discover everything myself. Paul of TRL told me again and again not to use the bias level on tubes more then his recommendation but I have been doing that for ten years and the sound and amps are fine. the same goes for the cartridge tracking force, speaker placement and subwoofers (it is a necessary evil for home theater).
4. It took me 15 years before I actually figured (thanks to Ivan Lee of Hong Kong) how to place the big Apogee speakers in the room. In over 90% of the 100 plus Apogee systems that I have seen or heard have placed them wrong. When I posted an article on it several people were dismissive of it, not because they disliked it but they just did not want to try -- I was happy to let them continue to spend money on useless tweaks
5. Everything in my system is made *for each other*. For example, the amps were moded with transformer that took two years to build, the power supply was moded for more current. The preamp was moded by myself with help from a friend, in which I added the circuit of the line level crossover of the Apogee FR.
7. My new room is designed (I am thinking of posting a thread with details so that I can share some experience with friend) for my whole system and for the sound the way I envisioned it to sound.
8. Han, I do not think you experimented enough or squeezed the maximum capability out of the Apogee FR, as I have, before determining "the ultimate speaker" firstly because the ultimate is only in your own head or in your wallet -- which by the way is perfectly fine, and secondly I do not think the Apogee Grand is better than the Apogee FR because subwoofers do not mix with the ribbon panels -- if you think they do then good for you but wait until you hear a better system and then you will learn that they do not integrate. For my taste they do not integrate, I tried that for 10 years with smaller Apogees – the FR does not need any sub (although I am still gonna continue to experiment). In fact I hate woofer based subwoofers. That is why I declined your offer to buy the Grand. And no I am not interested in any speaker including the Gryphon for buying or "upgrading" but I might be interested in hearing it as another friend's system. The important thing is you are happy so that is what matters but I do not think I wish to consider your speaker – in fact I will not consider any speaker. And mind you I was always dissatisfied until I achieved the current system.
Let me try to explain in other words, see the two diagrams below, the first one is a typical audiophile who looks for upgrades. The second one is mine, it is a complex integration that *collectively* has turned into a machine that gives me the sound of paradise. If I go to heavens after I die I will take the same system but with a better vinyl and tape an any other angelic source
Let me use the following figure to explain a typical audiophile philosophy.
And now my philosophy.
1. I cannot just take any component and make it fit because I view my system as a synergistic and tightly integrated entity that has evolved through macro and micro adjustments and improvements with my own hands over two decades. That did take over 200 components of ultra-high end quality.
When I say system it means it means everything in the system, ranging from speakers to shelves -- even the room color and carpet color (well, that might be a bit of a stretch though).
2. I am not pre- or for-biased against brand -- unlike most audiophiles who look for finding something lacking in other people's system, I try to find something positive from other people's systems to see if I can learn something new.
3. I have owned and experimented over 15 Apogees models, which I ripped apart, moded, tweaked, repaired by myself or by others, and even combined different ones to create new speakers, experimented with their crossover, and impedance. I even drove the FR with one amp by making a new passive crossover myself (only to go back to the original specs designed by Leo Spiegel that were the most correct; people on audio forums were just posting nonsense with new crossovers ideas). But I often ignore what the manufacturer recommends and I usually dissect a component to see the inside and figure if I can make improvements in it. If it confirms the recommendations of the manufacturer, fine, otherwise I discover everything myself. Paul of TRL told me again and again not to use the bias level on tubes more then his recommendation but I have been doing that for ten years and the sound and amps are fine. the same goes for the cartridge tracking force, speaker placement and subwoofers (it is a necessary evil for home theater).
4. It took me 15 years before I actually figured (thanks to Ivan Lee of Hong Kong) how to place the big Apogee speakers in the room. In over 90% of the 100 plus Apogee systems that I have seen or heard have placed them wrong. When I posted an article on it several people were dismissive of it, not because they disliked it but they just did not want to try -- I was happy to let them continue to spend money on useless tweaks
5. Everything in my system is made *for each other*. For example, the amps were moded with transformer that took two years to build, the power supply was moded for more current. The preamp was moded by myself with help from a friend, in which I added the circuit of the line level crossover of the Apogee FR.
7. My new room is designed (I am thinking of posting a thread with details so that I can share some experience with friend) for my whole system and for the sound the way I envisioned it to sound.
8. Han, I do not think you experimented enough or squeezed the maximum capability out of the Apogee FR, as I have, before determining "the ultimate speaker" firstly because the ultimate is only in your own head or in your wallet -- which by the way is perfectly fine, and secondly I do not think the Apogee Grand is better than the Apogee FR because subwoofers do not mix with the ribbon panels -- if you think they do then good for you but wait until you hear a better system and then you will learn that they do not integrate. For my taste they do not integrate, I tried that for 10 years with smaller Apogees – the FR does not need any sub (although I am still gonna continue to experiment). In fact I hate woofer based subwoofers. That is why I declined your offer to buy the Grand. And no I am not interested in any speaker including the Gryphon for buying or "upgrading" but I might be interested in hearing it as another friend's system. The important thing is you are happy so that is what matters but I do not think I wish to consider your speaker – in fact I will not consider any speaker. And mind you I was always dissatisfied until I achieved the current system.
Let me try to explain in other words, see the two diagrams below, the first one is a typical audiophile who looks for upgrades. The second one is mine, it is a complex integration that *collectively* has turned into a machine that gives me the sound of paradise. If I go to heavens after I die I will take the same system but with a better vinyl and tape an any other angelic source
Let me use the following figure to explain a typical audiophile philosophy.
And now my philosophy.
I will post it to share the experience. Nice to meet you Kevin. We should listen to each others systems.
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