KeithR's "Dream Speaker" Search

[spiritofmusic]

One for sale in UK...are they multi-voltage.
Maybe Keith'll snap 'em up before I get those Apogees Lol.

 

[Folsom]

I have a far left field idea... Find someone who's built a Neurochrome 686 amp with speaker protection in your area. They're better built than literally anything you've tested so far, for safety. Invite them over. If you like it, there are some very good builders out there.

The Jeff Rowland has input transformers, funny that the preamp was so problematic but the input transformers aren't.

 

[KeithR]

The Jeff Rowland has input transformers, funny that the preamp was so problematic but the input transformers aren't.

Good point. Weird indeed. We also checked that the MF carried ground throughout the input/output process and indeed it did. There is nothing anyone can figure out why the two pieces are incompatible, but yet we are here.

 

[Barry2013]

Thank you for the update Keith and commiserations on all the challenges you have had to contend with.
It will be interesting to see what combination finally does the trick.

 

[PeterA]

Thanks for the update, Keith. It is nice to have a challenging project during this time of lockdowns and home confinement. Good luck in your continuing search. If someone does not point a gun to your head, will you keep looking for an amp, or are you focusing your efforts now on a preamp?

 

[KeithR]

Thanks for the update, Keith. It is nice to have a challenging project during this time of lockdowns and home confinement. Good luck in your continuing search. If someone does not point a gun to your head, will you keep looking for an amp, or are you focusing your efforts now on a preamp?

If a tube preamp solves my issues with the Ampzilla, that could be the final path. There just aren't many amps remaining in my $15k-ish price range that I'm interested in.

 

[morricab]

Have you thought about a BAT VK 600se?

 

[DaveC]

Good point. Weird indeed. We also checked that the MF carried ground throughout the input/output process and indeed it did. There is nothing anyone can figure out why the two pieces are incompatible, but yet we are here.

It's the inductive surge caused by the AC, if you can put it on the opposite phase that may solve your problem, if it's 240V it uses both phases and there may not be an easy solution, but given your investment already maybe a Taurus BPT with surge and emi filters would be possible, it may both solve the problem and be an improvement...

 

[DaveC]

Symphonic line Kraft, used.

I agree, if it's similar to Odyssey it may be a good match with YG.

 

[KeithR]

It's the inductive surge caused by the AC, if you can put it on the opposite phase that may solve your problem, if it's 240V it uses both phases and there may not be an easy solution, but given your investment already maybe a Taurus BPT with surge and emi filters would be possible, it may both solve the problem and be an improvement...

It happens even on my Torus AVR-15

 

[DaveC]

It happens even on my Torus AVR-15

Hmm, AC could be dumping surge energy to ground, if you can check the ground voltage on an o-scope as the AC cycles you can see if that's what's going on. Just a guess, but it's an odd problem , would be interesting to know wth is going on!

 

[microstrip]

(...) I can run the MSB direct to the amps with no issues, but stick the preamplifier in and can get a blown fuse when my air conditioner comes on. I've had multiple discussions with MSB and SST and they've never heard of anything like it in 15 years. (...)

IMHO you should have an anti-surge device fitted in the air conditioner system. Much better solving the problem at the source than putting band-aid in the system. When I need to operate high power machines with high surges at home they always go through one of the VTL Mpods that come with the VTL MB750's!

 

[KeithR]

Update: A Linear Tube Audio MicroZOTL preamplifier should arrive in a week. The last amp to try is going to be a Pass Labs X350.8. So hopefully by the end of the summer, I will have procured the best YG preamp/amp combination!

 

[morricab]

Update: A Linear Tube Audio MicroZOTL preamplifier should arrive in a week. The last amp to try is going to be a Pass Labs X350.8. So hopefully by the end of the summer, I will have procured the best YG preamp/amp combination!

Why not something like XA160 monos? I think the Class A Pass amps have a higher potential for good sound...YMMV.

 

[PeterA]

Why not something like XA160 monos? I think the Class A Pass amps have a higher potential for good sound...YMMV.

My XA160.5, if you can find them anywhere used, are around $10,000. Some people prefer the sound of the .8 series. I don’t know how much an X350.8 costs.

 

[KeithR]

Why not something like XA160 monos? I think the Class A Pass amps have a higher potential for good sound...YMMV.

1) heat
2) X-series probably a better match for this kind of speaker unless I could swing 200s

 

[tobiasrankin]

I wish YG would add more bass woofers to the Hailey and Sonja. Similar to the Magico A5 with its 3x 9". A single bass woofer I just think doesn't cut it. Even the sonja 1.3 with i believe dual 10s felt bass light.

 

[KeithR]

I wish YG would add more bass woofers to the Hailey and Sonja. Similar to the Magico A5 with its 3x 9". A single bass woofer I just think doesn't cut it. Even the sonja 1.3 with i believe dual 10s felt bass light.

Magico sells a $65k speaker that has no bass in the M2. I've heard that speaker on 3 amps so that's not it either.

I find the bass on my Haileys excellent in my 22' x 16' medium room. Its tight, yet appropriate in output. However, I'll let folks on the forum comment who have visited my room.

I think Rockport has the best bass if that's a main criterion for you.

 

[KeithR]

update:

I've had the Linear Tube Audio MicroZOTL preamplifier in for demo since Tuesday. After a rather short break-in (24 hours), have been putting it through its paces on the Ampzillas and Rowland 625s2. In 10 minutes, could confirm its a poor match with the Rowland - it was a warm, creamy mess. Swapping out the 12AT7s provided significant benefit and took away some cloudiness, glare, and overt smoothness I initially heard. The LTA on the Ampzilla is alive and present sounding, but not traditional tubey and therefore provides a more liquid expression. The bass is a little softer than the Music First if memory serves me right, but not poor or undefined.

So really I've been going back and forth on two setups since - the LTA/Ampzilla and my Music First/Rowland system. At this point the LTA/Ampzilla combo has taken the lead. It now has better flow and decay, which was my lingering concern with the Music First as preamp (and the incompatibility which led to blown fuses). Yet, the Ampzilla still retains its holistic qualities top to bottom. A good example is on Mozart's "Jupiter" where the 3rd movement is heavily string oriented. On the Zilla combo, the cello creates quite the force with the violins while on the Rowland I just don't get that feeling. The violins are more detached.

The Music First/Rowland does imaging and resolution a little better - which isn't terribly surprising since a magnetic passive transformer volume control is quite transparent to begin with. On Julie London and Lyle Lovett, you can definitely hear a bit more on the lips, and a *very* sultry version at that. However, detail really isn't a big criterion of mine and by simply owning a YG speaker to begin you are getting more resolution than other loudspeakers. I'd also say the MF/Rowland combo is a bit warmer which might surprise some folks.

What the Ampzilla does better is soundstage width/depth, upper bass/kick, and tighter lower bass. It is still a very musical, even natured, 3-dimensional amp without grain (both are on the last point for SS). We will see if my opinion changes over the last few demo days, but for now the LTA/Ampzilla combo is winning the fight. A tube preamp is more complementary to the Ampzilla than the Rowland.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Very interesting, Keith!

"Swapping out the 12AT7s provided significant benefit and took away some cloudiness, glare, and overt smoothness I initially heard."

Can you please elaborate on how you heard "glare" at the same time you heard "overt smoothness"? Does this mean that the sound overall was smooth, but that there was a bright-sounding and narrow frequency rise somewhere?

Are you reporting that you hear the LTA/Ampzilla combination as having greater soundstage depth than the Music First/Rowland combination?