Lampizator SPDIF question

[abeidrov]

I’ve noticed that when I use the AES output for playback of 192 kHz material, the music gets interrupted. Then I found this paragraph in the Pacific manual:
“The DAC is capable of automatic recognition of all sampling rates from 44 to 192 kHz and bit rates from 16 to 24. Since few if any transports offering SPDIF format of the 192 kHz exist in the consumer market, it is hard to guarantee the operation but on the professional ones which we tried – it worked. From our experience the transmitters of SPDIF are incapable of making good square wave over 48 kHz, so if you play a 192 kHz file, be aware that on one hand you “play” more detailed data, but at the same time your signal is waaay more distorted so at the end of the day for this reason alone it may not be worth it to chase the hi-rez rabbit”.
Quite disappointing as I thought I could use my new AES cable for the hires playback of up to 192 kHz. Do any of you use SPDIF for hires playback of files over 48 kHz?

 

[heihei]

I use SPDIF for file sizes up to 192. I only use USB for DSD files.

 

[Beckola66]

What are you chaps using for connection via SPDIF? Standard RCA interconnects?

 

[Tam Lin]

I use 192K SPDIF with a twisted pair stripped from a CAT5 cable and RCA plugs feeding an Audio Note DAC 1.2 kit in which a CS8415A replaced the stock CS8412.

 

[Willgolf]

In my system, going from my Lucas Audio LDMS to the H, I have both Sternklang RCA plug SPDIF cable and an FTA Sinope USB. The level of detail on the Sternklang is better than USB. I have not had any problems with SPDIF. I much prefer SPDIF .

 

[Beckola66]

In my system, going from my Lucas Audio LDMS to the H, I have both Sternklang RCA plug SPDIF cable and an FTA Sinope USB. The level of detail on the Sternklang is better than USB. I have not had any problems with SPDIF. I much prefer SPDIF .

Fabulous, I know from my chats with Lucas that he prefers SPDIF also, very interesting

 

[abeidrov]

It must be an issue with my setup that I have difficulties with 192 files playback. Maybe it’s Aurender related?

 

[heihei]

Same experience here - LDMS to Horizon via a Z-Axis BNC -> RCA SPDIF cable compared to USB also via a Z-Axis cable, then much prefer SPDIF. The sound is meatier, more organic, more musical. At the margin USB has more detail, but the other factors outweigh that. I just use USB for DSD listening. Great to have both tho, esp as I can switch between the two without leaving my listening chair.

 

[abeidrov]

To my shame, I do not hear much difference between AES/EBU and USB, if any. Maybe USB sounds a little softer, maybe a bit more bass with AES, I am no sure. I wouldn’t be able to tell which is which in a blind test. What is wrong with me?

 

[Willgolf]

Nothing, just enjoy the music. Everyone hears differently and there is no right or wrong answer.

 

[Willgolf]

It must be an issue with my setup that I have difficulties with 192 files playback. Maybe it’s Aurender related?

I am now in the same boat as you are with regard to music files utilizing 192 playbacks. I notice intermittent skipping. This is very frustrating. I have asked NA Lampi for help.

 

[Tuckia]

To my shame, I do not hear much difference between AES/EBU and USB, if any. Maybe USB sounds a little softer, maybe a bit more bass with AES, I am no sure. I wouldn’t be able to tell which is which in a blind test. What is wrong with me?

Your Aurender has an optimized USB output, LDMS does not. At this level, it’s a lot about the streamer, then the cable.

For example, my former Antipodes K50 was optimized for spdif, not USB. I mean not a bad USB, just not to the level of my Extreme and others with a dedicated output card.

However, I still found the K50 usb through a Shunyata Omega USB to be superior to the spdif output with an average cable. But when using an Omega spdif cable, the spdif was clearly superior. All into a Lampi Pacific at the time.

My Extreme with optimized usb output card (no spdif to try) is just better than anything else.

With the Extreme into my Horizon, format doesn’t matter. I cannot tell the difference between the DSD, hi rez PCM, and redbook on some albums. Others redbook is better. Mastering matters. Format does not.

I never experienced playback issues at 192. Sorry.

 

[ronfint]

Your Aurender has an optimized USB output, LDMS does not. At this level, it’s a lot about the streamer, then the cable.

For example, my former Antipodes K50 was optimized for spdif, not USB. I mean not a bad USB, just not to the level of my Extreme and others with a dedicated output card.

However, I still found the K50 usb through a Shunyata Omega USB to be superior to the spdif output with an average cable. But when using an Omega spdif cable, the spdif was clearly superior. All into a Lampi Pacific at the time.

My Extreme with optimized usb output card (no spdif to try) is just better than anything else.

With the Extreme into my Horizon, format doesn’t matter. I cannot tell the difference between the DSD, hi rez PCM, and redbook on some albums. Others redbook is better. Mastering matters. Format does not.

I never experienced playback issues at 192. Sorry.

Not sure what you mean by “optimized”. My LDMS came with an internal Stage2 Master Time USB reclocker. USB to my TRP sounds great.

 

[Tuckia]

Not sure what you mean by “optimized”. My LDMS came with an internal Stage2 Master Time USB reclocker. USB to my TRP sounds great.

In this case optimized means having a dedicated card with drivers developed just for audio. To the best of my knowledge, because the goal posts are always moving, both LDMS and Antipodes just pull the usb signal off of the main board. Antipodes takes this signal in the K50 and then runs it to the internal reclocker to feed the other outputs.

A reclocker does not mean optimized usb. I tried an Ideon Mastertime 3R reclocker with dual FTA Callisto usb cables from my Antipodes into my Pacific. It dried the sound a little. It was not an improvement. I think Antipodes does a good job with their usb for what it is, but it doesn't compare sonically to the Extreme optimized usb. Not exactly an apples to apples compare, but it's the best I can offer.

For a while LDMS was big on reclockers for usb. That is whom I bought mine from. Again, not sure if he is still recommending this, but IMO, reclockers sometimes help, sometimes not. It depends on the situation. If a reclocker helps, it seems likely that that server needed the help.

If ever these server developers could get into one room to combine efforts, there would be a superior product. Each does some aspect well.

 

[abeidrov]

I would like to give SPDIF input another chance, but this 192 issue is really annoying. It does not happen immediately. Maybe after half an hour or one hour after I start listening. If I quickly turn the dac off and on, it goes away, the music plays fine for some time, and then the skipping starts again. Some sort of buffering issue? Any ideas?

Thanks in advance,
Aziz

 

[msimanyi]

@abeidrov I finally had time to install my new Atlantic 3 TRP DAC into my rack, and just fired it up about 30 minutes ago... so no long term history on my end.

I'm feeding it from a Grimm MU1, which converts all signals to PCM and I believe reclocks, upsamples if so configured, and *only* outputs via AES.

I'm using a Shunyata Omega AES cable.

No drops or skips yet. I suspect it's something with your source hardware, or much less likely might be your AES cable. Have you contacted Aurender about it? Given that your N30SA supports higher bandwidth on USB, what has you considering SPDIF for the connection?

 

[abeidrov]

@abeidrov I finally had time to install my new Atlantic 3 TRP DAC into my rack, and just fired it up about 30 minutes ago... so no long term history on my end.

I'm feeding it from a Grimm MU1, which converts all signals to PCM and I believe reclocks, upsamples if so configured, and *only* outputs via AES.

I'm using a Shunyata Omega AES cable.

No drops or skips yet. I suspect it's something with your source hardware, or much less likely might be your AES cable. Have you contacted Aurender about it? Given that your N30SA supports higher bandwidth on USB, what has you considering SPDIF for the connection?

You should try 24/192 files, skipping only happens while playing files with this specific bit rate. Also, since both Will and myself have this issue, and we have different servers (LDMS and Aurender), it is unlikely, that this is a server specific problem.

 

[msimanyi]

I'm streaming a mix including 24/192 from Qobuz over Roon, without any issues, but I'm firing up a local 24/192 album too and I'll report back if there are any issues. I would've expected changing file formats to be more disruptive, but I agree that it's best to test straight 24/192 playback to see if it replicates here.

The system has been playing all night for break-in. The first few songs of the album have been fine so far (HDTT's Ben Webster, Sunday Morning at the Montmartre.)

Edit: no problems there. I moved on to another local 24/192 album - Octave Records' Audiophile Masters, Volume 3 - and it's also playing without any glitches.

Edit 2: Second album completed without any issues as well.

Do you have any specific albums that cause the problem? Perhaps I can buy one to test as a local resource or try streaming from Qobuz if they have it in their library.

 

[Alrainbow]

A word on spidif cables this will piss some off
a made to spec spidif cable non exotic is a must to own for anyone.
Blue jeans or any company who makes a real made to spec cable. I know many feel the exotic makers know and maybe they do. but ask any of these makers if it’s made to spec and can be tested to prove it is.
be it rca or bnc and each are not the same spec and imp.
I agree exotic cables can change the sound
but most all don’t know why or it’s effects on if they work all the time.
Now don’t get mad at me when you read this and look at your 5k 2 feet long cable hahahaha

 

[plasmod3]

I would like to give SPDIF input another chance, but this 192 issue is really annoying. It does not happen immediately. Maybe after half an hour or one hour after I start listening. If I quickly turn the dac off and on, it goes away, the music plays fine for some time, and then the skipping starts again. Some sort of buffering issue? Any ideas?

Thanks in advance,
Aziz

I don't have a problem running my n30sa via spdif into my lampizator Horizon if that helps