Oh jeez - M6, another super-speaker from Magico

Al M.

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It's the sound. I've also bashed Wilson here so please add me to that list also. Thanks in advance.

You're very welcome.
 
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Mr Rickz

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As JA stated in his review of the new M2, the speaker will appeal to the well heeled guy who wants a well made product. One that has some bragging rights. Now whether or not the particular Magico can easily be bested by another design/brand at a fraction of the price is irrelevant to this consumer. Sound quality isn't necessarily what is first on their shopping list. Exclusivity and bragging rights are ...and therefore the higher the price, the better the speaker!~ Something that Alon Wolf has understood from the beginning. Something that maybe the folks at Magnepan should take heed of.

I told the guys at Schiit Audio that they would sell a lot more of their two channel gear if they doubled their prices. They weren't interested. :mad:
 

Bodhi

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I was at Magico a while ago and compared the S5 Mk II to the S7. While the S7 was a bit better, it didn’t strike me as $25K more than the S5 better.
My friend owns S7's, so I'm quite familiar with their sound. The S7's need a large room, whereas the S5 Mk2's can be placed in either a medium or medium-large room, so it's relative. That said, I agree the S7's are more enjoyable overall with better dynamics and an easier on the ear balance. However, the S5 Mk2's are not far behind, a lot less money as you noted, and I think the soundstaging from the S5's is a little better. That is due to their machined 3D convex top plate which breaks up vertical standing waves.
 
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Gregadd

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I told the guys at Schiit Audio that they would sell a lot more of their two channel gear if they doubled their prices. They weren't interested. :mad:
I gave Salk similar advice.
It is not just price,there is a whole game to be played. If you been around you have seen it before.
 

Al M.

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I told the guys at Schiit Audio that they would sell a lot more of their two channel gear if they doubled their prices. They weren't interested. :mad:

I suppose you're joking, but wouldn't happen anyway. The prestige audiophiles wouldn't care bothering with an Yggdrasil DAC also if it were double the price. Still too cheap to be taken seriously. Oh well, they don't know what they're missing. And the more budget oriented audiophiles who are serious about sound but couldn't afford the double price wouldn't buy it either.

No, I love what Schiit is doing. They are one of those companies that save the high end for the younger generations.
 

Mr Rickz

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I gave Salk similar advice.
It is not just price,there is a whole game to be played. If you been around you have seen it before.

You know what speakers Schiit uses at the shows?? Salk!
 
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Mr Rickz

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I suppose you're joking, but wouldn't happen anyway. The prestige audiophiles wouldn't care bothering with an Yggdrasil DAC also if it were double the price. Still too cheap to be taken seriously. Oh well, they don't know what they're missing. And the more budget oriented audiophiles who are serious about sound but couldn't afford the double price wouldn't buy it either.

No, I love what Schiit is doing. They are one of those companies that save the high end for the younger generations.

No self respecting audiophile would take people into their listening room a say, " And this is my pile of Schiit."
 
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Al M.

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No self respecting audiophile would take people into their listening room a say, " And this is my pile of Schiit."

Unfortunately, I have only one Schiit component, no pile of Schiit...
 
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Al M.

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Oh well, a thread about a Magico review that ends up in a pile of shit. Who knew.
 
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Mr Rickz

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Oh well, a thread about a Magico review that ends up in a pile of shit. Who knew.

I must apologize to the group. I'm nearly 70 years old, but somewhere along the way I seem to have lost my serious.
 

Al M.

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I must apologize to the group. I'm nearly 70 years old, but somewhere along the way I seem to have lost my serious.

Oh I never had it in the first place.
 

Al M.

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the sound of Tao

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Exclusivity and bragging rights are ...and therefore the higher the price, the better the speaker!~ Something that Alon Wolf has understood from the beginning. Something that maybe the folks at Magnepan should take heed of.
Whoa dude... Magnepan bashing in a Magico bashing thread is just plain disrespectful to Magico... try and keep the bashing on point ;) (Just jkn).

Theres always been more than a fair amount of both brand and topology tribalism going on (at times) in this blood sport and behind that can sometimes be a good splash of envy and a bit of the old tall poppy syndrome.

I don’t tend to bash (consciously at any rate) and I feel if you want to constructively criticise it’s better to start by identifying first what is really good about something and then you can also look to where something can then be better.

The drive to explore improvement in technology as championed at Magico seems pretty amazing and they are adept at marketing (as are Wilson). I’ll be honest though, just because you may not necessarily be a fan of a product is not a good reason to bash anything. We all appreciate different things but constantly undermining other things in an attempt to improve the perception of the things that you then favour is something of a povo move.
 

tima

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I’ll be honest though, just because you may not necessarily be a fan of a product is not a good reason to bash anything. We all appreciate different things but constantly undermining other things in an attempt to improve the perception of the things that you then favour is something of a povo move.


This is one of those threads suited for a Sociology of Audio Forum Dynamics 301 term paper. Ostensibly about a new Magico speaker, the M6, about which almost nothing is written because it's new and the announcing review not read yet. So one might think the thread is rather leading edge, although there's the normal point score for posting first about 'a hot new thing.'

But wait, the title has the minor opprobium "Oh jeez' tacked onto it along with the opening message
This one beats all others that beat all others before that which beat all others before that - I am about to throw up, TAS
followed by what seems to be a chiding over the redundancy of ... what? Either 'yet another Magico speaker' or, and this is the way I read it, "yet another TAS review extoling a Magico speaker." Either topic eligible steak tartar for hungry forum denizens.

At this point the tone of lunch is not quite pinned down. Is it about TAS or about Magico? No overt direction is set, but the gang is ready to eat. Ah, there it is. It only takes one post about' bad sound from Magico show rooms' and the statement "Sorry. I am not a fan." While it's not obvious whether he's not a fan of Magico show rooms or not a fan of Magico, someone interprets the conclusion to be "Magico is not good." And off we go.

First we have the standard response, a call to the subjectivity of hearing and preference followed by a paen to the brand's fast rise and impressive sound with a note about how distasteful it is when a brand is regularly bashed. Why is this product so put upon? Of course the thread is interspersed with the usual, kibbitzing, virtue signaling, and calling one another out for offenses taken. But now we have it, bashing is afoot - there's our theme. But alas, the thread dwindles into gibberish non-focused banter.

The underplay going on never really surfaces and no lessons are learned about how comments from the various players swerve threads to their ends. Why is there bashing?

First there's the topic that no genuine product bashing took place. And no real ad hominems were cast.

Second there's the topic of why are products bashed? My sense is such bashing is rarely caused by personal enmity or directed at individuals. Maybe there's some thrill in "riling up" the, in this case, Magico crowd. But I don't think so. Maybe someone had a bad personal experience with a product or manufacturer that they can't get over and bashing is their way to find personal relief. Maybe someone finds a product does not do what it claims and thinks it is a 'good thing' to warn others about it. Maybe some, as Tao intimates, need to confirm their choices by denigrating the alternatives they did not take. This is a thorny topic.

Third there's the much more dangerous topic of why product owners and their cohorts take offense at the whiff of criticsim and come to the defense of their products. The owner-product connection is never really explored at WBF. But we know it does exist, yet some don't use this knowledge despite knowing that someone likely will be offended, especially if the product is a major brand.

The easy account says the owner takes an "attack" on a product to be an attack upon themselves, or their process of choice, or something they associate to. No doubt the whole property-self relation seems to be real, perhaps it's like the workproduct-self relation. Human nature? Then, there's probably some inherent desire to maintain property value. Thus what is typically not aimed at people / owners is nonetheless taken as such. And yet, if we thought about it would acknowledge that it's likely someones will be offended. Going ahead leads to arguments and sometimes to people bashing. It happens over and over.

Frequently this is where someone jumps in with "but it's really about the music."

Happily, we'll be back tommorrow.
 

PeterA

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"Best of all, the M6 simply doesn’t have any shortcomings that one must consciously or unconsciously listen past."

Too funny, and full bullshit at the same time. Show me a speaker that in some areas cannot be bettered by other reproduction.

Al, Actually, the review's author, Robert Harley, writes this in the opening paragraph:

"Before taking delivery of Magico’s M6 loudspeaker, the three best-sounding speakers I’d had in my home were Magico’s own Q7 Mk.II ($229,000, Issue 256), the Wilson Benesch Eminence ($235,000, Issue 294) and the Rockport Lyra ($169,000, Issue 276). The M6 doesn’t have the bass extension, power, and muscularity of the mighty Q7, but it’s close. The M6’s midrange isn’t quite as magical as the Eminence’s ethereal, electrostat-like transparency. This new Magico also falls a little short of the Rockport in resolving extremely low-level textural detail that reveals the beauty and realism of instrumental timbre."

Harley is showing you the speaker right here. It is the Magico M6. But it is not a speaker that "can not be bettered by other reproduction." He explicitly states that it can, and he gives specific examples of speakers that he feels are better in certain areas. "Too funny, and full bullshit at the same time." Really? It seems like he knows of at least three speakers that he has actually had in his own listening room that he feels better the M6 in specific areas, and he describes those areas, and he names those speakers. This qualifying opening paragraph serves quite well to set a context and to support his conclusion that his preference for the M6 is about how balanced it is.

Lots of chat here about the two covers showing the M6 and M2. Upon actually reading the first review, I don't get what all the excitement is about. Has anyone here actually heard the M6? I think Kingsrule upgraded from the Magico M Pro to the M6, so we have at least one owner. I have heard the M Pro at Madfloyd's house many times. It is a tremendous speaker, IMO, and it served to celebrate the company's 10th anniversary and introdue new technologies. It also ushered in a new series up upgraded models and a new direction for the company. The M6 is Magico's replacement of the M Pro.

I found the article pretty interesting actually. Thank you Ack for sharing the link to the digital review.
 
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Al M.

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Al, Actually, the review's author, Robert Harley, writes this in the opening paragraph:

"Before taking delivery of Magico’s M6 loudspeaker, the three best-sounding speakers I’d had in my home were Magico’s own Q7 Mk.II ($229,000, Issue 256), the Wilson Benesch Eminence ($235,000, Issue 294) and the Rockport Lyra ($169,000, Issue 276). The M6 doesn’t have the bass extension, power, and muscularity of the mighty Q7, but it’s close. The M6’s midrange isn’t quite as magical as the Eminence’s ethereal, electrostat-like transparency. This new Magico also falls a little short of the Rockport in resolving extremely low-level textural detail that reveals the beauty and realism of instrumental timbre."

Harley is showing you the speaker right here. It is the Magico M6. "Too funny, and full bullshit at the same time." Really? It seems like he knows of at least three speakers that he has actually had in his own listening room that he feels better the M6 in specific areas, and he describes those areas, and he names those speakers. This qualifying opening paragraph serves quite well to set a context and to support his conclusion that his preference for the M6 is about how balanced it is.

Lots of chat here about the two covers showing the M6 and M2. Upon actually reading the first review, I don't get what all the excitement is about. Has anyone here actually heard the M6? I think Kingsrule upgraded from the Magico M Pro to the M6, so we have at least one owner. I have heard the M Pro at Madfloyd's house many times. It is a tremendous speaker, IMO, and it served to celebrate the company's 10th anniversary and introdue new technologies. It also ushered in a new series up upgraded models and a new direction for the company. The M6 is Magico's replacement of the M Pro.

I found the article pretty interesting actually. Thank you Ack for sharing the link to the digital review.

Thanks for the perspective, Peter, and providing context for the quote of the sentence you replied to. Much appreciated.

To Robert Harley's great credit, the review then seems more of a balanced assessment, but I still think the quoted sentence should not have been written as such.

Having said that, I have been mercilessly quoted out of context too, with the most egregious example being by creationist websites from my review article on the origin of life by natural causes. Any reasonable reader would not have done that, but you don't get to pick your adversaries. Should I have written certain sentences in that article differently? Not to make the points that I was making, no. But perhaps to avoid misquoting, probably.
 

ack

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To Robert Harley's great credit, the review then seems more of a balanced assessment, but I still think the quoted sentence should not have been written as such.

Lest we miss it, here's another Harley gem:

Jonathan remains high-end audio’s finest writer...

I found the entire review often dumb and rushed
 
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