SSP's

[audioguy]

I am in the process of evaluating new SSP's. I am currently using an Integra 80.2 and, unlike some folks, have had excellent results with Audyssey (Pro). The only audible negative I am hearing is the amount of noise this processor puts out with no signal. I have yet to try analog input but it has been implied that the analog in are not a strong suit. In addition, I am looking for a product that has excellent 2 channel capability. I am considering or have considered: (Those in bold are still on the short list)

AP20 but it is not quite ready for prime time (among other things, no current bass management)

SSP-800 (eliminated due to minimal room correction of 5 PEQ's per channel)

Anthem D2V - Don't know much about it as of yet so looking for any input (positive or negative). My local dealer carries this and the SSP-800 and while he says the SSP-800 sounds great, if room correction is important to me, it doesn't cut it). (And it's not about profit for him since I sell him my products for cost and he does the same)

Krell (over priced)

Theta (no room correction therefore not an option)

ADA: (Possible)

Lexicon: (Possible)

Meridian: Out of my price range.

Has anyone heard the Anthem and been able to compare it to any of my other candidates? I'm most interested in the kind of room correction technology used (parametric EQ, time domain based EQ, etc)

 

[amirm]

We are a dealer for Anthem D2V and have it set up in our showroom. We tried it with a tough situation first: invisible speakers (imagine drywall making sound) and a Paradigm sub. At first, it seemed to degrade the performance. I was not there buy my guys tried it again and it definitely improved the fidelity. Next was in our smaller theater. There, it made an improvement and I was pleased that it did not try to do too much. I have the older D2 at my home but have not upgraded it to have room EQ. Will do that soon. Overall, I give its room EQ a "competent" score. Note that you cannot program target curves although you can tell it to not correct above certain frequency.

You know my feelings on AP-20 from the other forum . I think this is a specialty product made for a different market. While I expect it to perform well on EQ side given the pedigree of the people, I worry about how long they stay in this market and support the product. And given the reports of hiss out of the unit, I am not sure it will address your core need of getting a quieter unit.

Lexicon is getting closer to being released. So if you are not in hurry, perhaps wait until the reports are in. It will be more expensive than the above products although if you are getting it at cost, then the difference is more manageable. I expect its EQ to be very good if the current JBL is any indication.

 

[audioguy]

Overall, I give its room EQ a "competent" score. Note that you cannot program target curves although you can tell it to not correct above certain frequency.

Audyssey on my 80.2 does an amazing job on bass ringing. My room is very well treated and the newer version of Audyssey (X32) improved greatly the upper bass. If the EQ is only "competent", that may be a deal breaker. And lack of a target curve is an even bigger deal breaker!! Would you be in a position to define "competent EQ"?

You know my feelings on AP-20 from the other forum . I think this is a specialty product made for a different market. While I expect it to perform well on EQ side given the pedigree of the people, I worry about how long they stay in this market and support the product. And given the reports of hiss out of the unit, I am not sure it will address your core need of getting a quieter unit.

I have had a number of discussions with folks on the "quietness" issue and I'm not concerned but would insist on a try out before I purchased. My bigger concern is not the product functionality but the ability of the company to survive. While it may turn out to be a great consumer product (as in great performance in a home theater environment) , if they don't "consumerize it", I don't think they will be successful. I am talking about things like the connectors. They need to have regular home audio connectors like XLR's and single-ended and the traditional digital connector. While adding add-on cables to their existing interface gets the job done, it's ugly. It all depends on how deep their pockets are. I worked for a company (SigTech) that had a great idea and a great product but they left me and hundreds of others high and dry when they folded. First time, shame on them. Second time, shame on me!!

Lexicon is getting closer to being released. So if you are not in hurry, perhaps wait until the reports are in. It will be more expensive than the above products although if you are getting it at cost, then the difference is more manageable. I expect its EQ to be very good if the current JBL is any indication.

I don't have access to Lexicon at cost. And I'm not in a big hurry as my 80.2 is more than satisfactory for now.

 

[audioguy]

I did read on another forum that Kal Robinson liked the D2V for movies and Audyssey for music! (I know you are not an Audyssey fan!)

 

[amirm]

I did read on another forum that Kal Robinson liked the D2V for movies and Audyssey for music! (I know you are not an Audyssey fan!)

I have only listened to it on movies just the same. All of our 2-channel audio systems are direct with no EQ other than Wisdom with Audyssey.

I think looking at other people's experiences can be tricky with room EQ. As you know, the system behavior can be wildly different depending on what room and speakers it is trying to deal with. As I explained in my experience with ARC, given one scenario it didn't work, but another did.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

I did read on another forum that Kal Robinson liked the D2V for movies and Audyssey for music! (I know you are not an Audyssey fan!)

First, that is old news dating from mid-2008. Second, it was the older D2, not the D2V, and the original Audyssey Sound Equalizer (and that has been superseded by more recent developments).

I think looking at other people's experiences can be tricky with room EQ. As you know, the system behavior can be wildly different depending on what room and speakers it is trying to deal with. As I explained in my experience with ARC, given one scenario it didn't work, but another did.

Amen. I think of each as a toolkit and, therefore, its usefulness is assessed in terms of the task (combination of speakers and room).

Kal

 

[audioguy]

First, that is old news dating from mid-2008. Second, it was the older D2, not the D2V, and the original Audyssey Sound Equalizer (and that has been superseded by more recent developments).
Kal

Without trying to put you on the spot (or maybe I am), given the improvements in both technologies, what would be your opinioni be now.

The problem with evaluating products like this is that one MUST depend on the opinoins of others. The probability of getting a loaner for a long enough time to learn the operations (specifically room correction) to be effective in it's use so that one could do a fair evalutation would be difficult at best. It's not like borrowing a preamp and sticking it in your system.

So given that Kal spends a fair amount of him time listening to mutlichannel, I would want to at least understand his opinon.

My two concerns on the D2V are (1) lack of support of multiple subs (I guess I could purchase a SubEQ from Audyssey) and (2) the ability to create my own target curves.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

Without trying to put you on the spot (or maybe I am), given the improvements in both technologies, what would be your opinioni be now.

The problem with evaluating products like this is that one MUST depend on the opinoins of others. The probability of getting a loaner for a long enough time to learn the operations (specifically room correction) to be effective in it's use so that one could do a fair evalutation would be difficult at best. It's not like borrowing a preamp and sticking it in your system.

So given that Kal spends a fair amount of him time listening to mutlichannel, I would want to at least understand his opinon.

My two concerns on the D2V are (1) lack of support of multiple subs (I guess I could purchase a SubEQ from Audyssey) and (2) the ability to create my own target curves.

Hard to say. I have not used any Anthem/ARC since then and, as I said, the SEQ has been superseded by newer XT32/Pro products.

I suspect that Anthem gets at the multiple sub issue by promoting the use of Paradigm subs with ARC built in. You EQ each sub separately and then EQ the ensemble with the prepro.

The big divide, imho, is between autoEQ (with little or no manual tweaking) and fully controllable EQ. That comes down to issues of skill and preference. If you do not have the skill and tools (and interest and patience) to do it yourself, autoEQ (Audyssey, RoomPerfect, Trinnov, RoomPerfect, MRC) is the way to go. Some are somewhat tweakable (AudysseyPro, MRC).

 

[audioguy]

Kal: Thanks for your response.

Given the 10 years I spent with SigTech, having owned three different TacT units, as well as three different units controlled by Audyssey Pro, I am very comfortable with doing the work myself.

As I have discovered more about the Anthem unit, it is not for me. No correction past 5K; no way to handle multiple subs (less your example) and no target curve control.

The search continues. My Integra 80.2 does a pretty good job, particularly with the bass so I'm willing to wait for the right product.

 

[Ron Party]

Chuck, join the crowd.

 

[garylkoh]

Chuck,

I have the Integra 80.2 too. The noise it puts out when there is no input signal may be down to the poor grounding. I found that sorting out the grounding externally cuts the noise down to almost zero. I ended up with all digital audio on optical before I could eliminate the hissing and spitting.

 

[NorthStar]

What about a separate Audyssey MultEQ XT32 Pro component with REW?

* And separate digital DSP Sub EQs from other companies like Behringer, etc.? Mini DSPs?
Anti-Mode? ...

** A separate digital EQ component from TRINNOV?

Is ARC1 from the Anthem Statement D2v/ARC1 Surround Processor better than Audyssey MultEQ Pro with the filtering resolution of Audyssey MultEQ XT32?

Is JBL Synthesis superior?

And what about the microphone used with all those Auto Room EQ Systems? Proprietary or others?
Plastic or metal?

_____________________

I only have experience with Audyssey, and I don't like the digital filtering effect on Music!
But I do like what it does with the Subwoofer channel(s) on Movies!
That is for Audyssey MultEQ XT and XT32. ...Not Pro.

What is the Best? And is the Best also the Best for you and I? ...Or only for the others?

 

[audioguy]

It looks like (for me) it's down to ADA about which I know less than zero; Lexicon about which I know just an RCH more than zero and the AP20 which has potential but it sure not ready for Prime Time.

It appears to me that some company has an opportunity if they are willing to take advantage of it since there appears to be a number of individuals looking for the same functionality (at a reasonable price point) that I am.

 

[NorthStar]

ADA has TRINNOV right?

Yup! => ADA With TRINNOV Teq

=> ADA & Trinnov With the Teq Series Of Room Correction & Optimizers

________________________________

Lexicon has JBL Synthesis from Harman Kardon, right?

 

[audioguy]

Is Trinnov built into the ADA box or is it two boxes (which also means an extra D2A and then A2D)

 

[NorthStar]

It's a two-box affair.

 

[mimesis]

I should add that Trinnov's standalone product is eminently tweakable. You can set the parameters for cut and boost, the target curves; take multiple microphone measurements and create many (20) configurations with full control over the processing and the active measure points. It also has a full blown parametric EQ. I have the four channel unit and it can handle four of whatever kind of speaker you have. I believe a multichannel unit based on the technology in the ST2 series is out or about to come out. Trinnov (not the one in the Sherwood receivers) does not decode DTS or Dolby HD-type tracks and requires either analog or LPCM input for each channel. I find it to be very effective and a worthwhile enhancement to my otherwise purist setup.

William

 

[Kal Rubinson]

As I have discovered more about the Anthem unit, it is not for me. No correction past 5K;.....................

? Sure there is. The top end of the EQ is selectable and I used a minimum of 12KHz.

 

[JimP]

? Sure there is. The top end of the EQ is selectable and I used a minimum of 12KHz.

It is selectable but it has been found that for it to properly correct the more problematic frequencies that you have to use a 5Khz top frequency.
I suspect that this has to do with the amount of correction its capable of doing. If you're room has fewer problems, then maybe you can run a higher frequency as you're not using up resources as early on.

 

[RUR]

It's a two-box affair.

I had read ~ a year ago that ADA was noodling Trinnov inclusion into the Rhapsody Mach IV in future, albeit with less functionality than the stand-alone Trinnov box. Dunno if this is still in the cards/abandoned.