Ssssh, is your tube preamp really that quiet?

[DaveyF]

Does anyone own, or know of, a tube preamp that is TRULY QUIET even when the volume is turned up? On my CAT tube preamp, there is always a certain amount of tube rush when the volume is up. This doesn't really bother me as it is not really audible when music is playing, BUT I'm sure the sound could be better IF this wasn't the case. Anyone have a totally quiet tube preamp?? No ssssh whatsoever!


I posted this question on this forum: http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?aamps&1395079397&openflup&32&4#32
and received some VERY interesting responses, including those from Ken Stevens ( CAT) and Ralph Karsten ( Atmasphere).

So, I pose the same question here..

 

[Bruce B]

Yup, my Doshi tape and phono pre's. Quietest tube equipment I've ever had!

 

[MylesBAstor]

Yup, my Doshi tape and phono pre's. Quietest tube equipment I've ever had!

But the phono is a hybrid, not pure tube unit.

 

[Bruce B]

But the phono is a hybrid, not pure tube unit.

My mistake Myles. I thought it had tubes.

 

[puroagave]

some of the responses on the a'gon thread are amusing, first they heard no noise then they did...me thinks some don't actually listen very carefully. every tube preamp ive ever owned had some tube rush, a CJ PV-9 being the worst offender and joule electra LA-150 among the quietest. ive recently had two fairly quiet tubed phono stages that can handle LOMC carts, the zesto Andros and rogue ares but both use SUTs. my klyne exhibits a faint 'rush' with carts below 300uV but I find the spectrum of that noise less obtrusive than 'tube rush' ive noticed this in most SS phono/line stages ive used vis-a-vis tubes.

 

[rockitman]

But the phono is a hybrid, not pure tube unit.

My phono is dead quiet. Tube PS & Gain stage. (Pure Tube)

 

[MylesBAstor]

My mistake Myles. I thought it had tubes.

I thought Davey was referring to an all tube phono and/or line stage say like his CAT, the Aesthetix, TW Acoustics, etc.

Nick uses a JFET input and hybrid circuits can't be compared to an all tube unit when it comes to noise. You won't have noise either from an all tube phono if you run a 2mV cartridge either. Also it's easier to design a quiet tube line stage when you're talking 10 dB of gain rather than the higher gain of the CAT or GAT.

 

[MylesBAstor]

My phono is dead quiet. Tube PS & Gain stage. (Pure Tube)

The Allnic you have doesn't use a SUT?

 

[JackD201]

Christian, if I'm not mistaken uses the 3000 head amp.

 

[DaveyF]

some of the responses on the a'gon thread are amusing, first they heard no noise then they did....

That is what I found to be amusing as well, Rob. I suspect that a lot of a'philes never actually listen up close to their speakers and hear the tube rush that I referred to. Since, according to Ralph and Ken, it is impossible to remove all tube noise from an all tube phono stage, ( without using a SUT, that is) it certainly makes one wonder.

 

[DaveyF]

I thought Davey was referring to an all tube phono and/or line stage say like his CAT, the Aesthetix, TW Acoustics, etc.
.

Myles, I was indeed referring to an all tube phono stage and did in fact refer to my CAT as an example.

 

[Bruce B]

I suspect that a lot of a'philes never actually listen up close to their speakers and hear the tube rush that I referred to. Since, according to Ralph and Ken, it is impossible to remove all tube noise from an all tube phono stage, ( without using a SUT, that is) it certainly makes one wonder.

That's the first thing I did when I saw Nick's tape stage. I've heard too many noisy tube units. My CAT was pretty quiet, though I could barely hear a hiss with the volume at full.

 

[rockitman]

Christian, if I'm not mistaken uses the 3000 head amp.

I use both. After inserting 1967 MIL spec Mullard/Blackburn GZ37 rectifiers, the advantage in dynamics and soundstage of active gain has been mostly offset. The super low noise of the transformer gain makes me now prefer it over the HA3000 head amp. Rectifier choices make a huge impact on performance for this pre.

 

[flez007]

I have a Jadis JPMC all tube (and MC capable) unit - it is NOT that quiet....but musical sounding!

 

[mep]

Tube preamps will have more noise than a SS preamp. Show me a system where the owner claims that he can turn up the volume all the way and you have to stick you ear right on the tweeter to hear anything and I will show you an owner with damaged hearing or damaged tweeters or a room with a high noise floor. And it doesn't matter if it's SS or tube. All gear has some amount of residual noise. It may be super-low in level which is where you want it obviously, but it's there to be heard.

 

[thedudeabides]

Hi mep,

With my CJ ET5, the "residual" stock tube hiss was audible within a couple of feet of my MBL's.

When I replaced with the EAT tube, extremely quiet and no audible hiss with my ear within an inch of the tweeter / mid range pods at a very aggressive volume level. That tube eventually developed some hiss audible at my listening seat.

I received a replacement EAT tube. Extremely quiet again.

I don't believe I have hearing damage. Nor do I believe my MBL's are damaged. And the residual noise in my room is extremely low. I do turn my fridge off when I am listening.

GG

 

[Peter Breuninger]

Tube preamps will have more noise than a SS preamp. Show me a system where the owner claims that he can turn up the volume all the way and you have to stick you ear right on the tweeter to hear anything and I will show you an owner with damaged hearing or damaged tweeters or a room with a high noise floor. And it doesn't matter if it's SS or tube. All gear has some amount of residual noise. It may be super-low in level which is where you want it obviously, but it's there to be heard.

I totally agree.

 

[LL21]

Hi mep,

With my CJ ET5, the "residual" stock tube hiss was audible within a couple of feet of my MBL's.

When I replaced with the EAT tube, extremely quiet and no audible hiss with my ear within an inch of the tweeter / mid range pods at a very aggressive volume level. That tube eventually developed some hiss audible at my listening seat.

I received a replacement EAT tube. Extremely quiet again.

I don't believe I have hearing damage. Nor do I believe my MBL's are damaged. And the residual noise in my room is extremely low. I do turn my fridge off when I am listening.

GG

With my CJ GAT, when tubes are new, its the same for me. And I've got a lot of gain. However, I can hear it in the dead of nite from about 12 inches away as the tubes get older. The fan on my Gryphon Colosseum is unfortunately louder. My Oppo 95 is a ton louder...I can hear that from 8 feet away in the dead of nite if it is not playing a movie...when not playing, I always shut it off.

 

[mep]

Hi mep,

With my CJ ET5, the "residual" stock tube hiss was audible within a couple of feet of my MBL's.

When I replaced with the EAT tube, extremely quiet and no audible hiss with my ear within an inch of the tweeter / mid range pods at a very aggressive volume level. That tube eventually developed some hiss audible at my listening seat.

I received a replacement EAT tube. Extremely quiet again.

I don't believe I have hearing damage. Nor do I believe my MBL's are damaged. And the residual noise in my room is extremely low. I do turn my fridge off when I am listening.

GG

I hope your hearing isn't damaged, your MBLs aren't damaged, and the residual noise in your room is extremely low. However, I would reserve my personal judgement on how quiet your preamp is when turned up to an "aggressive volume level" unless I was there to hear it for myself.

 

[mep]

With my CJ GAT, when tubes are new, its the same for me. And I've got a lot of gain. However, I can hear it in the dead of nite from about 12 inches away as the tubes get older. The fan on my Gryphon Colosseum is unfortunately louder. My Oppo 95 is a ton louder...I can hear that from 8 feet away in the dead of nite if it is not playing a movie...when not playing, I always shut it off.

This is what I'm talking about. The racket from your other components is masking the noise from your preamp. It doesn't mean it isn't there, it's just lower in level than your other racket making devices.