Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème

[Steve Williams]

I'm pretty sure that Emile said that no other switches would be necessary but playing with the extra switches might produce a flavor the listener likes but bottom line I think I read is that they all cause noise. Not sure why people are trying to outsmart the designer

 

[oldmustang]

I'm pretty sure that Emile said that no other switches would be necessary but playing with the extra switches might produce a flavor the listener likes but bottom line I think I read is that they all cause noise. Not sure why people are trying to outsmart the designer

Because we're audiophiles and can't help ourselves?

Steve Z

 

[John T]

I'm pretty sure that Emile said that no other switches would be necessary but playing with the extra switches might produce a flavor the listener likes but bottom line I think I read is that they all cause noise. Not sure why people are trying to outsmart the designer

I don't think anyone is trying, can, or will, outsmart Emile. Its too simple an exercise not to take a listen. Its not like I'm buying a switch to accomplish this. Nor would I. I find my baseline with the new switch after sometime I insert (in my case the M12) and decipher what I hear. Nothing ventured nothing gained. If it adds nothing or makes thinks worse I sell the damn thing...

 

[John T]

Because we're audiophiles and can't help ourselves?

Steve Z

Exactly!!

 

[Steve Williams]

I’m very much the audiophile as well but my grit and determination stops here as I have always gone without a switch awaiting the Taiko release of such and therefore nothing to compare it to. I’m expecting to see a whole lot of used switches for sale

i also seem reading somewhere on this thread thatTaiko created their own switch that would be better than all others making the need for others unnecessary

 

[Rhapsody]

Very content new Extreme owner. He’s LOVIN his EXTREME!

He has “I ain’t nothing but a hound dog” playing on repeat for the last 13 hours.

 

[gereric]

Very content new Extreme owner. He’s LOVIN his EXTREME!

He has “I ain’t nothing but a hound dog” playing on repeat for the last 13 hours.

View attachment 102786

Who makes those equipment racks?

 

[Rhapsody]

Who makes those equipment racks?

They were foundation racks, but the owner said this model is no longer made. http://www.foundationaudio.ca is in Canada.

From their site.

In 1996, Cliff Stone sold Foundation Audio to Focus Audio, a high end speaker manufacturer based in Markham, Ontario, Canada. Focus adhered to the authority of "the Foundation" of its products and designs whereas Cliff Stone remains as an exclusive consultant of future projects. Immediately after the acquisition, Cliff Stone modified the Classic and Designer speaker stands. The new stands outperformed the old Classic. They are given the names the Classic II and Designer II. Since then, the new stands have been manufactured in Canada.

 

[oldmustang]

Very content new Extreme owner. He’s LOVIN his EXTREME!

He has “I ain’t nothing but a hound dog” playing on repeat for the last 13 hours.

View attachment 102786

The dog is definitely lovin' it!

Steve Z

 

[Huy Hoang]

Not sure why people are trying to outsmart the designer

Maybe sometime designer doesn't put "cost no object" in their indicators, but in case of Taiko's product I think we will always get best ROI at top class sound quality

 

[Taiko Audio]

I remember during the OS upgrade there were certain routers from certain users that needed replacing.

It’s clear we should remove switches before the Taiko switch; should we also remove second routers (from an objective, noise related perspective, not a subjective “preference” one). Or just like during the OS upgrade, does the answer depend on what the main router is?

Well you don't HAVE to remove them, you should however definitely check if they don't deteriorate sound quality. The Router "routing" your network where your music server resides is the one defining your network parameters and has the largest impact over preceding routers, at like 90%.

 

[Taiko Audio]

Emile, here's my thinking on whether to retain, or not, the Nordost QNET switch in series with the Taiko switch.

1) The first consideration is that I have a single ethernet wall port coming from the cable modem 50 feet away to the part of the house that has the music room. I need to access the ethernet in the music room for 2 purposes a) the Taiko switch and b) an ethernet line to my smart TV. Since the Taiko switch does not have any spare ports, I'm essentially one port short so the Nordost switch will be useful in providing a port to send ethernet to the TV. If there is an alternate method that is simpler (a simple splitter at the RJ45 wall port?), please advise.

For that a switch is indeed the best solution. In the future you could consider replacing that switch with the upcoming router which can create truly separated networks for your SMART TV and Extreme. Which SMART TV do you have? I have all mine connecting over Wi-Fi in which case you could simply remove the Nordost switch. You should still listen if you prefer your sound with it in or out of course..

2) The real attraction to retaining the Nordost switch might be in the area of noise reduction, which always emerges as a key consideration for your approach on how you intend to optimize the entire signal pathway from ISP to the Extreme. Here's a partial factory description of the Norsdost Switch:
Each port on the QNET is optimized for its application. Three of the five ports are auto-negotiated 1000BASE-T (1 Gbps) capable, which should be used for the router and other generic network devices. The remaining two ports are fixed to 100BASE-TX (100 Mbps), a speed at which internal noise reduction is possible, making these ports best used for primary audio servers/players or external media sources.

What is unclear is exactly what they mean when they say"internal noise reduction is possible"? Does this mean that noise reduction in those ports only occurs on Tuesdays? Sunny days only? Any day but only at a certain time? Are special incantations required? I have no clue what they mean when they say "noise reduction is possible" but the question is, if noise reduction is indeed possible by using one of their 100Mbps ports, could this be advantageous since it falls in line with your hypothesis that noise reduction in networks in general, seems to be a good thing! I think the only correct answer at this point is- nobody knows, at least not yet. Thus, since putting the Nordost switch in series with the Taiko switch is easy to do, there's little down side to trying it both ways and seeing if any differences can be heard. Would I be thrilled not to need the Nordost switch at all? You bet. Bye-bye Nordost = found money!

Providing 100Mbit ports is a "trick" employed by various "audiophile" switches. For a lot of, usually lower priced, servers this can provide "better" sound quality. This does not apply to the Extreme though, and most likely neither to other servers with ample processing power on board.

 

[Taiko Audio]

Do you not have a strong wifi signal in your music room that the smart TV could use? In one of my rooms that’s what I do and it works fine.

Missed that while replying just now, that's a good recommendation.

 

[Taiko Audio]

Emile, any update/pics on the black switch?

Still waiting for the sample to return! This is basically a good example of why we want to move towards doing everything in house.

 

[Taiko Audio]

I’m very much the audiophile as well but my grit and determination stops here as I have always gone without a switch awaiting the Taiko release of such and therefore nothing to compare it to. I’m expecting to see a whole lot of used switches for sale

i also seem reading somewhere on this thread thatTaiko created their own switch that would be better than all others making the need for others unnecessary

Well at least we designed one which actually lowers noise in the downstream device, being the server in stead of only "manipulating" and/or producing less noise itself.

 

[MusicFellow]

Emile, regarding the copper surface. I understood that your treatment keeps it from tarnishing, like those T+A DACs. So check on that requirement!

What about the hardness of the copper switch? Does one have to be very careful to not put any scratches in it, e.g. with fingernails or is this nothing to be concerned about?

 

[Taiko Audio]

Emile, regarding the copper surface. I understood that your treatment keeps it from tarnishing, like those T+A DACs. So check on that requirement!

What about the hardness of the copper switch? Does one have to be very careful to not put any scratches in it, e.g. with fingernails or is this nothing to be concerned about?

It will have a tough scratch resistant coating.

 

[MusicFellow]

It will have a tough scratch resistant coating.

Great to know!

I‘m between this or the silver aluminum. Maybe switch in copper and router in silver. It‘s just that for the silver I‘d need the whitish (not silvery) tone as Extremes seem to differ - mine being more white-silver in color.
But with a router that‘s not directly next to the Extreme a slightly different tone wouldn’t catch the eye‘s attention so much.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Great to know!

I‘m between this or the silver aluminum. Maybe switch in copper and router in silver. It‘s just that for the silver I‘d need the whitish (not silvery) tone as Extremes seem to differ - mine being more white-silver in color.
But with a router that‘s not directly next to the Extreme a slightly different tone wouldn’t catch the eye‘s attention so much.

Gotta love you guys. How many of you dismiss your significant others when they're color coordinating? Lol

 

[SwissTom]

@Taiko Audio , Hi Emile,

Do you plan to contact other DAC manufacturers who might want to integrate the new interface?

I'm thinking of Soulution Audio.

Not only because I own a Soulution system, but also because they are quite receptive to advances like yours.

The topology of their amplifiers goes against what is being done. And to a certain extent, their DAC too (especially the 7 series)

There is a growing demand for a system which allows Roon to be used in the best possible conditions. The Extreme is one of the best options, if not the best.

Cyrill Hammer, the director, is really friendly and easy to talk to.