Why no universal agreement on which is best in computer audio: Usb, Spdif, Aes/Ebu, i2s, coax?

[spiritofmusic]

Ok, I'm finally warming to the idea of streaming. No issue w having to run two boxes. I remain irritated that only a minority of streamers are Roon Core meaning there is a significant quandary in going eg Innuos Zenith (Roon Core) or DCS Bridge (non-Roon Core).

And just as I'm trying to reconcile that, there are other considerations, incl what appears to be non conformity on connections.
So some Dacs are optimised for USB, where some streamers/bridges are optimised for Aes/Ebu, and gear like the Aqua LinQ bridge is optimised for i2s.

Coax seems to be favoured by some. And then there are whole units devoted to maxxing USB like MicroRendu and Innuos Zenith.

This lack of consistent opinion on up to half a dozen different connections seems to be one additional barrier to straightforward choice of gear.

Or am I over-complicating things?

 

[DSkip]

It’s no different than single ended vs xlr in the analog world. The difference in digital is some technologies are limited in what they can transfer.

Much of this, to me, seems to more about what the end user wants and will implement more than what is ideal. I would say find a streamer that suits your needs and contact the manufacturer to figure out their optimized output. I assume this decision could also be affected by what your dac is optimized for.

 

[spiritofmusic]

D, so I get that. But every amp within reason has both RCA and XLR. There just seems to have so much variation. I mean some approaches absolutely abhor USB...others spend $000s on USB optimisers.

Is it a case of choosing the server first, and then the dac/connection that suits it? Eg

Innuos...USB
DCS Bridge...Aes/Ebu
Aqua LinQ...i2s

 

[howiebrou]

D, so I get that. But every amp within reason has both RCA and XLR. There just seems to have so much variation. I mean some approaches absolutely abhor USB...others spend $000s on USB optimisers.

Is it a case of choosing the server first, and then the dac/connection that suits it? Eg

Innuos...USB
DCS Bridge...Aes/Ebu
Aqua LinQ...i2s

It’s partly a reflection of how digital technology and formats evolved with DSD and high res etc. 20 years ago it would have just been optical or coaxial. I wouldn’t loose any sleep over it. Choose the server and Dac combo you like and use the interface that they recommend.

 

[the sound of Tao]

D, so I get that. But every amp within reason has both RCA and XLR. There just seems to have so much variation. I mean some approaches absolutely abhor USB...others spend $000s on USB optimisers.

Is it a case of choosing the server first, and then the dac/connection that suits it? Eg

Innuos...USB
DCS Bridge...Aes/Ebu
Aqua LinQ...i2s

Marc I’d also consider which server and dac combo you are most drawn to. Either way I’d avoid any pathway that is too niche or potentially fading in popularity. The more universal the better...

As an aside you can get extraordinary examples of USB based outcomes and either Extreme, Innuos and Antipodes servers will all work beautifully via USB.

I’d also avoid any too niche a choice in dac and look to the ones that will more likely be reasonably supported going ahead.

I’d also factor in other things as well, you have great faith in Sablon cables and you know that there are great USB and Ethernet options there.

 

[spiritofmusic]

The impetus to this thread was chatting Schiit Yggy here. I mentioned the Unison 2 USB board installed on that dac. And how that might mate well w the USB-oriented Innuos Zenith...and the responses came back of some members here hating USB, intimating reasons why USB is a bad technical choice.

I wouldn't mind doing research into connections, but I've yet to find a review on a dac or server that in the conclusion has a set of findings ranking superiority of connections.

If reviews regularly outlined these rankings, I could at least rule out some combinations.

A good example is SPDIF. The Eera cdp that I have my eye on has a Digital In, and it's SPDIF. I have zero idea which streamers are good w this connection.

Conversely, the DCS Network Bridge has no USB, but favours AES/EBU. I have no idea which Dacs are great via this.

Why does Aqua LinQ favour i2s?

And just what is the controversy on USB?

 

[Blue58]

Ok, I'm finally warming to the idea of streaming. No issue w having to run two boxes. I remain irritated that only a minority of streamers are Roon Core meaning there is a significant quandary in going eg Innuos Zenith (Roon Core) or DCS Bridge (non-Roon Core).

And just as I'm trying to reconcile that, there are other considerations, incl what appears to be non conformity on connections.
So some Dacs are optimised for USB, where some streamers/bridges are optimised for Aes/Ebu, and gear like the Aqua LinQ bridge is optimised for i2s.

Coax seems to be favoured by some. And then there are whole units devoted to maxxing USB like MicroRendu and Innuos Zenith.

This lack of consistent opinion on up to half a dozen different connections seems to be one additional barrier to straightforward choice of gear.

Or am I over-complicating things?

Quote:- “ I'm NEVER going down the server/streaming route. the Eera is my keeper for life” April 10, 2014



And congrats on breaking the 11K post barrier. 15K before Xmas

 

[spiritofmusic]

Well, that statement would still hold if like the balanced German and Japanese markets still held in UK and US, that is cds still a big part of the mix. However since my hand is forced, I have to consider streaming.

So, that's 11,001? Just 3,999 to go before Xmas? Maybe I'll break that on this thread.

 

[GSOphile]

My understanding is that the i2s interface is vendor specific (i.e., non-standard) at least insofar as the protocols used with the hardware interface is concerned?

 

[matthias]

Ok, I'm finally warming to the idea of streaming. No issue w having to run two boxes. I remain irritated that only a minority of streamers are Roon Core meaning there is a significant quandary in going eg Innuos Zenith (Roon Core) or DCS Bridge (non-Roon Core).
And just as I'm trying to reconcile that, there are other considerations, incl what appears to be non conformity on connections.
So some Dacs are optimised for USB, where some streamers/bridges are optimised for Aes/Ebu, and gear like the Aqua LinQ bridge is optimised for i2s.
Coax seems to be favoured by some. And then there are whole units devoted to maxxing USB like MicroRendu and Innuos Zenith.
This lack of consistent opinion on up to half a dozen different connections seems to be one additional barrier to straightforward choice of gear.
Or am I over-complicating things?

I would go for the best server I can afford and then buy a DAC according the best output this server offers.

In case of the Taiko Extreme this is USB. So best used with an excellent USB-DAC.

Matt

 

[spiritofmusic]

Well of course, Extreme ownership somewhat simplifies things.
Tbh, this feels like the audiophile version of why all mobile phone chargers aren't the same.
I can't be the only one irritated by that unfortunate unnecessary fact of life.

 

[microstrip]

D, so I get that. But every amp within reason has both RCA and XLR. There just seems to have so much variation. I mean some approaches absolutely abhor USB...others spend $000s on USB optimisers.

Is it a case of choosing the server first, and then the dac/connection that suits it? Eg

Innuos...USB
DCS Bridge...Aes/Ebu
Aqua LinQ...i2s

Even much more complicated then you imagine - we can have separate clock lines, that can reverse the arguments! IMHO you should consider the whole digital system in one step. Otherwise pick a DAC you enjoy and write 100 times in a sheet of paper : XXX is the best DAC in the world, much better than anything else costing up to 100 times the price.

Do not forget you should repeat the writing exercise every time you visit WBF before listening to your system!

 

[spiritofmusic]

Thanks, Teach' lol
I certainly have the time during Covid.
My Q is as much lack of transparency on the best connectors as found by testing or manufacturer honesty.
I mean, DCS don't rate USB, so don't have it on their Network Bridge, and state they prefer Aes/Ebu. That's easy. But how do I find a Dac that favours Aes/Ebu? It's not apparent on many websites that I read.
So when all I see is connectors "availability" (I have eyes) but no preference/ranking on which sounds best (my eyes can't see into the mind of the designer), I remain in the dark.

Case in point...Holo Springs has USB. But it apparently sounds poor, prefers use of Singxer to go USB> i2s. It's not immediately apparent without delving into user reviews online.

 

[spiritofmusic]

So here I have two opposing pieces of advice. Pick the best streamer for yr budget. And the dac that fits the optimal connection for that streamer.

Pick the best dac and fit the streamer to it.

Neither seems the wrong advice. Can they both be right? And it would be easier if there was consensus on maybe a maximum of two connection protocols.

My predicament is heightened because of my shortlist of 6 to 8 sub-$5k dacs, only 3 are easily demoed in UK. The others would be a sale or return punt...and I'd really like to know exactly which protocol is favoured by each dac and streamer on the market. Harder to come by than you'd imagine.

 

[DSkip]

D, so I get that. But every amp within reason has both RCA and XLR. There just seems to have so much variation. I mean some approaches absolutely abhor USB...others spend $000s on USB optimisers.

Is it a case of choosing the server first, and then the dac/connection that suits it? Eg

Innuos...USB
DCS Bridge...Aes/Ebu
Aqua LinQ...i2s

My point on XLR/RCA is that a designer will choose to prioritize one over the other if both are offered. One will ideally be a better connection depending on how it was designed.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Yes D, but we're talking upwards of six connection protocols.
Case in point. I love my Eera cdp. I could get a version w SPDIF digital in jack. I know that dac section will sound spectacular. But I have zero idea which streamers out there work well/best w SPDIF. And no way of knowing...it's not highlighted on tech sections of any websites.
So, I have a dac...but no way of knowing which streamer would work well with it.

 

[matthias]

Yes D, but we're talking upwards of six connection protocols.
Case in point. I love my Eera cdp. I could get a version w SPDIF digital in jack. I know that dac section will sound spectacular. But I have zero idea which streamers out there work well/best w SPDIF. And no way of knowing...it's not highlighted on tech sections of any websites.
So, I have a dac...but no way of knowing which streamer would work well with it.

You could order an Extreme with the SPDIF output card.

Matt

 

[spiritofmusic]

I could Matt.
And I could have gone out w Gillian Anderson in 1995.
Alas, one didn't happen. And the other won't either.
Life sucks.

 

[bonzo75]

And I could have gone out w Gillian Anderson in 1995.

please explain

 

[spiritofmusic]

Ah, Ked, you'd like to know.
The chances of me owning an Extreme matches to the chances of me having gone out w Agent Scully.