Would S3's or S5's be best in my room

Popspin

Well-Known Member
Apr 28, 2015
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258
Hello,
First post here. Oby, I remember you from AVS. Now I know where you went!
I have been listening to various speakers (Salon II Ultra, Atria, 802D, Raidho, Blade2, S3) and was struck by the S3 mids and highs. With Goldmund behind them they were excellent, except that they didn't reach down as low as I had hoped. I understand that the S5 will provide that extra lower frequency range.
But will I give up the beautiful mids and highs I loved so much with the S3?
I am not sure if my room is medium or large. How is that defined? My room is 13' wide by 28' long. It's L shaped so it's open at the back, for now...project to seal it is in process but some time off.
I am wondering if I should buy the S3's and see how they couple with my room vs the dealer's showroom or buy a primo used pair of S5's. Am I crazy to think Magico will upgrade the S5 with the new S3 mid?
I could only listen to the S3 as the dealer didn't have a pair of S5's to demo I am very interested in hearing from those experienced with both speakers.
FWIW, I have a pair of JL212's to add low end but have never been as pleased with the sound as when just the L & R speakers are playing. I Use the JL's for fun rocking out music and HT. Current main speakers, Aerial 9's, fill the space quite nicely.
Thanks guys!
Popspin
 

Elberoth

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Dec 15, 2012
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Personally, I wouldn't loose my sleep over this. It is not the midrange driver is different (they both use the very same M380 midrange driver and MB30 tweeter), but the midrange driver housing.

The S5, like the Q3 / Q5 and Q7 - has a rectangular housing made of aluminium.
The S3, has an egg shaped housing made of plasitc.

The egg shaped housing certainly has some benefit over rectangular one, and is certainly cheaper to manufacture. Not sure the plastic as a material is as good as aluminium from the SQ point of view though.

Add to that a far more substantial speaker box of the S5, with much thicker front panel, which gives far better support to the drive units, and any advantage the new shape of the midrange driver housing brings, should be offset by those other factors.

The S5 is also 1dB more efficient, which is always a good thing.
 

JackD201

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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Your room can be considered large in area but it is a bit narrow. I'm sure S5s would be perfectly fine.
 

stereo

Well-Known Member
Sep 1, 2012
407
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I would go either for S5 or for S3 and add one Qsub15.
I have also 2 Fathom and don't like how they integrate with my Q1. But I have to admit than hearing the Qsub with various Magico speakers, I was very impressed. First time I heard a sub integrating well with a magico speaker.
 

Popspin

Well-Known Member
Apr 28, 2015
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54
258
Hello;
Thanks for your input. What I take away from the comments are that I should head towards the S5 for 2 reasons; 1) my room is considered large; and 2) integrating my current JL 212's will be a challenge so I am better off with the added low end extension of the S5 so I can avoid using my subs as frequently.
This has been helpful.
Thanks!
Popspin
 

JackD201

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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Anytime Popspin and oh my manners, welcome to the forum!

I think you'll find that integrating your subs might be easier with an S5 because the lower the crossover frequency, generally, the easier things get. Enjoy!
 

nirodha

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Aug 11, 2010
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Anytime Popspin and oh my manners, welcome to the forum!

I think you'll find that integrating your subs might be easier with an S5 because the lower the crossover frequency, generally, the easier things get. Enjoy!

So true: use a sub for the function it is built: the lowest frequencies.
 

CKKeung

Well-Known Member
Jun 17, 2011
3,053
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I recommend S5 for you too.

Size of my room is similar to yours but even a bit narrower but my S5 performs in sit comfortably.
 

Popspin

Well-Known Member
Apr 28, 2015
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258
Thanks for the welcome

So true: use a sub for the function it is built: the lowest frequencies.

nirodha;
Thanks for the welcome. I am finding much to like about this forum.

Blending subs with mains is difficult, at least for me! I must be doing something wrong. As hard as I try to get the proper blend between my current speakers (Aerial 9's) and the pair of JL212's, even crossing at 40hz, I find the character of the 9's change when the sub is added. I tend to listen more without the subs; it just makes the 9's sound much better.
I expect the same with the S5's, appreciating the added fullness vs the S3's and avoiding some desire for a sub.
Popspin
 

nirodha

Well-Known Member
Aug 11, 2010
678
293
975
nirodha;
Thanks for the welcome. I am finding much to like about this forum.

Blending subs with mains is difficult, at least for me! I must be doing something wrong. As hard as I try to get the proper blend between my current speakers (Aerial 9's) and the pair of JL212's, even crossing at 40hz, I find the character of the 9's change when the sub is added. I tend to listen more without the subs; it just makes the 9's sound much better.
I expect the same with the S5's, appreciating the added fullness vs the S3's and avoiding some desire for a sub.
Popspin

Hi Popspin,
I think you are right. I don't use a sub with my Kef Ref 207/2 but I have heard many. It is possible to have a seamless match but it is very hard. The lesser the frequency gap, the better. But besides this, main speakers and a sub should be seen as "set" so preferably same material, same manufacturer etc. That is probably why users of the Magico subs are so happy when they add them to their main speakers. Envious of your future S5's by the way. Enjoy!!!:) Can't afford them now but the lack of "smear"...wow!
 

Tand

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2013
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Norway
nirodha;
Thanks for the welcome. I am finding much to like about this forum.

Blending subs with mains is difficult, at least for me! I must be doing something wrong. As hard as I try to get the proper blend between my current speakers (Aerial 9's) and the pair of JL212's, even crossing at 40hz, I find the character of the 9's change when the sub is added. I tend to listen more without the subs; it just makes the 9's sound much better.
I expect the same with the S5's, appreciating the added fullness vs the S3's and avoiding some desire for a sub.
Popspin

I used to have the Q5 but changed to Q3 + Qsub15. The fullness of the Q5 were much better than the Q3 only - but when using the Qsub15 the total sound is much larger and better defined, I guess the massive controll in lower hz gives a better flow/ease of the music. I would highly recommend an audition with the S3 and the Qsub. At least for me the combo with Q3+Qsub15 is more satisfying than the Q5s, but again the Q5 s/S5 with the Qsub would rise the bar even higher…. :)
 

Popspin

Well-Known Member
Apr 28, 2015
104
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258
Sub integration, as an issue, doesn't exist when Qsub is used? I will have to listen!
 

Tand

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2013
65
5
238
Norway
Sub integration, as an issue, doesn't exist when Qsub is used? I will have to listen!

The sub integration is perfect, I only notice the sub when I turn it off. I use a Macbook with DSPcontrol for the sub, the sub is contected with a ethernet cable to my network. This way I controll the sub wireless. It is very easy to blend in the sub with your main speakers. I only use one sub placed in the middle between my Q3s and I am very happy with that! A lot of people say you must have 2 (or more) to have an optimal result, it might be true - but one Qsub gets you a long way!
 

stereo

Well-Known Member
Sep 1, 2012
407
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Sub integration, as an issue, doesn't exist when Qsub is used? I will have to listen!

As I already wrote in the past, I have been always a "subwoofer-skeptical", as I never listened to a perfectly integrated sub before listening to the Qsub. I have 2 Fathom sub, tried to integrate them with Q1, and ended up with the conclusion that Q1 works much better without.
my position has changed after listening to the Qsub18 with the Q7mk2 as well as Qsub15 with Mproject. Integration was seamless, and the result was very convincing. Right now, I would even plan for a Qsub18 with my Ultimate.... if the floor of my apartment was hard enough to allow the additional weight I would have to add....
 

Tand

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2013
65
5
238
Norway
As I already wrote in the past, I have been always a "subwoofer-skeptical", as I never listened to a perfectly integrated sub before listening to the Qsub. I have 2 Fathom sub, tried to integrate them with Q1, and ended up with the conclusion that Q1 works much better without.
my position has changed after listening to the Qsub18 with the Q7mk2 as well as Qsub15 with Mproject. Integration was seamless, and the result was very convincing. Right now, I would even plan for a Qsub18 with my Ultimate.... if the floor of my apartment was hard enough to allow the additional weight I would have to add....


Sorry for OT.

@Stereo. It would be very interesting to know how much of a difference there is between the Qsub18 and the Qsub15, can you put it in words? Thanks
 

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 6, 2011
12,521
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I have 2 Fathom sub, tried to integrate them with Q1, and ended up with the conclusion that Q1 works much better without.

I tried to integrate two JL Audio F110 subs with my Mini 2s. There was increased extension, but I lost some of the beautiful and clean midrange, so ultimately I ended up selling the subs because I preferred the Mini 2 without them in my room. I imagine that a well integrated Qsub with any of the Q speakers would sound incredible.
 

NC Lee

Well-Known Member
Oct 23, 2014
72
33
248
NC
Hello,
First post here. Oby, I remember you from AVS. Now I know where you went!
I have been listening to various speakers (Salon II Ultra, Atria, 802D, Raidho, Blade2, S3) and was struck by the S3 mids and highs. With Goldmund behind them they were excellent, except that they didn't reach down as low as I had hoped. I understand that the S5 will provide that extra lower frequency range.
But will I give up the beautiful mids and highs I loved so much with the S3?
I am not sure if my room is medium or large. How is that defined? My room is 13' wide by 28' long. It's L shaped so it's open at the back, for now...project to seal it is in process but some time off.
I am wondering if I should buy the S3's and see how they couple with my room vs the dealer's showroom or buy a primo used pair of S5's. Am I crazy to think Magico will upgrade the S5 with the new S3 mid?
I could only listen to the S3 as the dealer didn't have a pair of S5's to demo I am very interested in hearing from those experienced with both speakers.
FWIW, I have a pair of JL212's to add low end but have never been as pleased with the sound as when just the L & R speakers are playing. I Use the JL's for fun rocking out music and HT. Current main speakers, Aerial 9's, fill the space quite nicely.
Thanks guys!
Popspin

I spent 4.5 hours comparing the S3 and S5 in the same store in different sized rooms. I may have slightly preferred the S3 with some music, but my room is bigger than yours and I brought home the S5's. If you want a full orchestral sound the S3's don't get there, even in a smaller room. The S5's bring a fullness to music the S3 does not. So, the S5 is more versatile and "safer" if you question filling your space. I am an Aerial fan- both the 7 and 20T were impressive. A tiny company.
 

stereo

Well-Known Member
Sep 1, 2012
407
4
143
Sorry for OT.

@Stereo. It would be very interesting to know how much of a difference there is between the Qsub18 and the Qsub15, can you put it in words? Thanks
At least in a very large room, the Qsub18 gives a better sense of space. You listen to symphonic music, the soundstage is huge. And on bass lines of jazz CDs, it is a physical experience as your full body feels the impact....
It may be the same with 2 Qsub15, but I have only heard a single one: unclear to me if 2 Qsub15 are as good or better than one Qsub18. The room was very big, so while excellent, I did get a similar effect, but to a smaller scale with the Qsub15
 

Tand

Well-Known Member
Nov 26, 2013
65
5
238
Norway
Thanks. It makes sense, given the larger woofers and bigger amp(s) in Qsub18.

Tommy
 

James63

New Member
Aug 7, 2013
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0
For those of you that tried to mix JL audio subs with magicos did you use a high pass crossover? I am using JL's cheaper subs (jl e112) in my system and using the high pass crossovers they blended right in. Without the high pass and just using the low pass the system sounds like total garbage no matter how low the low pass filter is set.

I have been thinking about buying a pair of S1s to use with the subs.
 
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