Zu loudspeakers

[bonzo75]

I don't expect anyone to be that interested in my system, Ked. The purpose of the thread is to encapsulate my enthusiasm for the brand, why they remain compelling to me despite hearing many fantastic alternative spkrs over the year, and discuss full range/high sensitivity concepts, a different take on achieving musicality.

Ked, I'd have thought that as someone who has discovered the joys of musicality via Devore and Tannoy, the concept would appeal to you. Even just a little bit.

Marc the above was a joke on your system having many other expenses much more than the Zus.

Yes the concept appeals to me but to really understand it I need to listen to it with various amps starting with 2a3 and going up the various tube and watt ranges to yours. Otherwise it is not possible to understand Zu by listening to your system

 

[spiritofmusic]

Ked, understood. I don't do the compare thing, but many others do. Zu are not quite going to speak to you, not having that final level of transparency tbh.

However, I've learned that it's very hard having the whole cake and eating the whole thing. So, upon hearing more transparency in systems like UK Pauls, it's missing the low mids and upper bass density that Zus give me. Upon hearing more dynamics and imaging at The General and at Blue58, the forensicness of these systems don't suit the majority of my music. Upon hearing the sheer wall of sound at Justin's Apogees I felt the sound was more tilted than at home.

However fine tuning the Zus, esp in their new space, and they've flowered to a level you never heard back in London.

Too bad you can't just come over to the home of a fellow enthusiast and just chill. You know, the thing that guys with an obsessive hobby in common do all the time. If it's all data points Ked, we're really not in the same hobby.

 

[bonzo75]

I don't understand how I will understand the Zus by just listening to it on one amp. What if you have got it wrong?

 

[spiritofmusic]

Getting it wrong, what a fascinating concept. Ked, it's fine. I'd rather you go elsewhere and tell someone else they have their pants down.

 

[spiritofmusic]

I've had plenty of people up. Some loved my system incl a record producer, club DJ and sound man who once worked for Prince.

I've had some audiophiles up as well LOL. They've all pointed out pros and cons in my sound. Which led on many occasions to me making beneficial changes. One guy loathed my sound from start to finish. Fair dos.

But I've never had someone reluctant to come up because I might have it wrong. Tbh, this says more about you than it does me.

As I say, visits are all about the shared experience. Except for you Ked, visits are just for your data points. If you got a system you were proud of, Schopper, affordable amps, Tannoys, and invited me down, I'd be interested in what you'd achieved. Not deliberating on whether you got it wrong. Hey, different folks, different strokes.

 

[bonzo75]

Getting it wrong, what a fascinating concept. Ked, it's fine. I'd rather you go elsewhere and tell someone else they have their pants down.

Am just saying it's always possible happens all the time. Even owners don't know. You don't have to take things so defensively.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Ked, you made the right call on my old room. Part of the purpose of the invite was to get you up so you could gauge the difference. Everything has evolved since, but directly from, the opening up of possibilities that fantastic room acoustics allows. Beyond that, any changes I make register immediately, good or bad.

So I'm ultra happy w things, would never say anyone else would be. I've been told my sound has been wrong before. Another time wouldn't bother me.

Ked, this thread is not about you visiting me or not, I'm sure you have Tannoys setups on yr itinerary. It's to extol the virtues of Zu. But this looks like the wrong forum to do it on.

 

[jeff1225]

I've heard Zu's several times and each time I was struck by their musicality. Two times I will always remember:

I was at a listening party with an excellent system made up of Martin speakers and Eisenstein pre-amp and OTL's. This playback was so bright and fatiguing that I was driven from the listening room to the kitchen. 2 hours into the party, most of the party goers were in the kitchen drinking. The system owner then put in a pair of Zu Definitions and we were invited back in the room. The sound was now entirely musical with a huge soundstage and excellent bass. Voices that were edgy before (15 IPS tape and LP's played on a Brinkman LaGrange) were now engaging and frankly beautiful. I was about to leave the party moments before the speaker change was made, I ended up staying until 1AM.

The second time I was blown away by Zu's was at the last LA Audio show. Sean Casey from Zu was demoing the latest Zu Driud Mark VI and playing progressive rock. The system was simple: First Watt F6 amp and preamp and a vintage Luxman turntable. This simple system produced the musically I heard at the listening party but with enhanced definition and more defined space between the instruments. For $10K, the Druid VI is a contender for one of my favorite speakers. I can only imaging what the Druid VI could do with higher end amps.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Thanks Jeffrey. Sean's setups at shows can blow hot and cold, but he's getting it more and more right.

Variety is the spice of life, there are those like me for whom the Zu sonic signature ticks many boxes. I'm using tweaking and room acoustics to bridge the gap to those areas Zu can struggle with.

FWIW, Phil aka 213Cobra is releasing his long awaited user report on the new Druids VI on Audiogon in the next several days. I may ask him to post it here too.

 

[jeff1225]

Thanks Jeffrey. Sean's setups at shows can blow hot and cold, but he's getting it more and more right.

Variety is the spice of life, there are those like me for whom the Zu sonic signature ticks many boxes. I'm using tweaking and room acoustics to bridge the gap to those areas Zu can struggle with.

FWIW, Phil aka 213Cobra is releasing his long awaited user report on the new Druids VI on Audiogon in the next several days. I may ask him to post it here too.

Have you thought about employing a super tweeter? A super tweeter on a friend's Tannoys has filled in all the gaps in terms of air, sound stage height and even the bass. The addition of Townshend super tweeter would be an interesting addition.

https://www.musicdirect.com/speakers/townshend-maximum-super-tweeter-pr

 

[shadowlight]

I am former owner of Zu (Druid V, Omen Def Mk. 2 and Soul Superfly). The only reason that I moved away from them was to try something new in open baffle and the need to recycle my play money . The sound of Zu is an acquired taste, some like it and some hate it. I loved the sound and still miss it. The Zu's required a bit of setup.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Jeffrey, yes I have the Towshend supertweeters. They've contributed a small but important part to the end result I'm achieving.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Shadowlight, I think when a spkr has a strong character like Zu, it is, or can be perceived as, lacking ultimate transparency. However I've heard spkrs that are as characterless and see thru as glass, and about as exciting.

For me, Zu is very transparent to musicality and tone density, less so to microdynamics and air. That's how they appear out of the box in a poor room (my situation in London).

Put them in a more forgiving space, w proper distance to front and side walls, feed them good power, w cables that are organic rather than hyper detailed, and you're 90% there.

Now my Zus are starting to not look embarrassed in the areas of low level detail, ambience, imaging. Rather than shine a searchlight, they're gently illuminating music more now.

What OBs do you run?

 

[morricab]

I've been encouraged by new kid on the block SETDrugs to start a thread on Zu.

I have been reluctant, I'm known to bang on about Zu endlessly, and maybe I've said all there is to say.

But in the last 3 months I've so improved things w them, I've developed a whole new appreciation for what they do well (while being totally aware of their limitations), and this feels like the right time to properly extol their virtues on a dedicated thread.

I've asked fellow owners: long time favourite here Caesar, new guy and Thomas Mayer fanatic SETDrugs, and occasional poster 213Cobra, to chip in. You all know how I hate the sound of my voice LOL.

So, I'll post thoughts soon on why I bought Zu, why I've stuck w them over a decade, and why the last 3 months has totally vindicated my decision.

I'm just hoping I can get some interest in a true 100% American success story.

You have the Mk IV version I assume? I had a look and was interested to see that they are using a Radian 850 compression driver for the tweeter. This is a very good driver. No idea where their fullrangers come from (Eminence maybe??). However, it struck me as very ood that they would use a Radian 850 because they cross it over at like 12Khz, but this is a 2 inch exit CD with a 3 inch diaphragm....These generally do not do so well above 10Khz and are more suitable from like 800-8000Hz. I would have thought the 1 inch exit Radian 475 would have been a better choice as a very high frequency driver or perhaps a number of Fostex horn supertweeters that work from about 4Khz and up.

For sure the 850 will be barely working as it is designed to do serious output and I guess getting 100db/watt or so out of it up there is possible (since I think it is more like 110db lower down in frequency), so maybe it works better in some ways than a more tweeter dedicated tweeter, because normally a driver like the 850 would be used with a dedicated supertweeter in addition.

Curious as to why they didn't go with a somewhat larger horn and then make the crossover significantly lower down...you would have to roll off the full-range drivers then of course.

I am doing something a bit similar with my Decware HDTs, which use an 8 inch modified Fostex. i will mate them with a Beyma CP350ti compression driver (an oldie but very goodie) and some new style wave guide horns with a crossover around 3Khz and a first order crossover. The Beyma has a range down to 600Hz or so and then a 1st order down at 3Khz should work. I will also probably add active subs below 50hz in the future.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Brad, I can't really comment on the tech. But a critical reason why the IV sounds so much better than the II is the change to the Radian 850.

Sean is adamant that he wants the full range driver to cover the ?2.5? octaves range of the human voice, 40-50Hz to 11kHz, w no crossover component interrupting this range.

I do know the Radian 850 is highly modded incl building into a quasi horn. Maybe this takes its range closer to 20kHz.

It may interest you to know, the newest top Zus ie recently released Druid VI, and soon to be released Definitions VI, Dominances II and Experiences I, will all still use the 850, despite much else being changed.

Full range drivers are nano tech doped Eminences w whizzer cone, 12" Eminences as subs. Sean is working hard to bring the Eminence subs close to the 101dB efficiency of the full range drivers.

 

[KeithR]

Have you thought about employing a super tweeter? A super tweeter on a friend's Tannoys has filled in all the gaps in terms of air, sound stage height and even the bass. The addition of Townshend super tweeter would be an interesting addition.

Phil has been experimenting with them in his Druid VI system

 

[spiritofmusic]

He's using some supertweeters that are discontinued.
To good effect.
I'm finding they help a little.
"Stir the pot, and season a little for taste."

 

[spiritofmusic]

Despite the spkrs I have bought in this hobby (first, Roksan Ojans, then ProAc Futures Two, followed by my two sets of Zu Definitions, II and then IV, the latter modded w Duelund caps and Lundahls transformers to Hypex sub amps), it always looked like I was going to end up in a way different place.

In the 80s when I got my serious bug for audio, I hankered first after active Linn Isobariks, and then on my tryst w CD, Meridian M10 actives.

In the 90s I then fell in love w Apogees on Krells, and Wilson Watt Puppies, again w Krells.

And my last dalliance was ML Prodigys on MF Kilowatt monos.

But something in the Zu/SETs presentation spoke on a deeper level to me, and that's the winding road I went down. And haven't been fully convinced to reset my Sat Nav yet to go on a different road.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Zu speakers are not my personal cup of tea, but I am huge fan of Sean Casey, both personally and professionally.

I will be very interested to see what Sean releases if he pursues his Zu flagship design.

 

[spiritofmusic]

Well Ron, he'll have two LOL flagships.

One, the Dominances II, a more limited run design incorporating three full range drivers flanked top and bottom by a pair of Radian 850 tweeters, and multiple 15" sub drivers front and side mounted.

These subs will not likely be self powered requiring the spkr to be bi-amped.

About 60"x18"x24", as per existing Dominances I.

His higher volume flagship, Experiences I, will be as tall, but slimmer and shallower, with a form factor similar to current Definitions IV, two full range drivers and single Radian 850. The downfiring 12" sub in my spkr will prob be replaced with two pairs of sub drivers. In built amps w full analog adjustability.

Sean is obsessed w getting extra stiffness and reducing weight, in both drivers and cabinets, so he's gone the extra mile on nano coatings to the full range drivers, and composite birch/carbon fibre to the shells.

To his credit, he's not releasing any of these until he cracks these areas successfully. No replacing models every 18-36 months as happens w so many other top marques.