Technics SL-1000R or Kuzma Stabi M.

[Gary J]

Hi Everyone, I started a thread a few months ago wondering what table I should buy and I decided to wait for a few months for the new Technics SL-1000R table to make its way into some hands of people on this site to get a better idea on how it sounds especially compared to the Kuzma Stabi M table. Now I know it is rare to find someone that has knowledge of these two tables but I just want to be sure when I buy one of these tables I have made the right decision. No one in my area has the Kuzma for me to listen to and it is doubtful I am going to hear it before I make my decision. The Technics will be easier for me to listen to because more dealers will have it closer to where I live so I may have to rely on your opinions on the kuzma and make a decision based on what you say so if anyone has listened to both tables please chime in.
Thanks.

 

[bazelio]

Still deciding, eh? The best suggestion I have for you is to give the SL-1000R a good listen; get familiar with it as best possible and then ask very specific questions of us Stabi-M owners related to the sound characteristics in order to try to relate one to the other. I'll be glad to help. I'm very familiar with sonic characteristics of each component in my chain at this point (having now A/B'd each piece to a decent variety of alternatives). If you have specific reference LPs that you want to use as compare points (and they're reasonably close to my taste in music ;-) ), I'd be glad to obtain a couple of them for note comparison purposes. This might even be better done offline, if you want to PM me and exchange text numbers / info.

At a high level, I'd simply say that the M loves transparency. And while absolute transparency is never really possible, I personally have found that moving away from tubes in the chain has paid big dividends. Tube distortion, IMO, really just didn't allow the M to sing at its full potential. I'm now running Stabi-M -> EAR 324 (solid state) -> Passive AVC -> Dart 108 -> Marten / Accuton ceramics. I don't want for much at this point.

 

[Gary J]

Bazelio thanks for the info on the Stabi M, my system is so different from yours as my system has Sound Lab speakers that do not like solid-state and I have tried many solid-state amps and preamps and they all sound thin or lean compared to tubes. With my electrostats I have shut down 400 watt solid-state amps with thermal overload because of the mismatch and the way electrostatic speakers need to be driven. With that in mind some say the Technics cannot be beat and some say the belt driven tables are the way to go because they are more musical. Some people say the Technics sound somewhat like digital and some say belt tables sound sluggish in the bottom compared to direct drive and it goes on and on. From what I think you are saying you have heard the new technics SL-1000R table if that is so does it do anything that you like better then the Stabi M?
Thanks.

 

[bazelio]

Bazelio thanks for the info on the Stabi M, my system is so different from yours as my system has Sound Lab speakers that do not like solid-state and I have tried many solid-state amps and preamps and they all sound thin or lean compared to tubes. With my electrostats I have shut down 400 watt solid-state amps with thermal overload because of the mismatch and the way electrostatic speakers need to be driven. With that in mind some say the Technics cannot be beat and some say the belt driven tables are the way to go because they are more musical. Some people say the Technics sound somewhat like digital and some say belt tables sound sluggish in the bottom compared to direct drive and it goes on and on. From what I think you are saying you have heard the new technics SL-1000R table if that is so does it do anything that you like better then the Stabi M?
Thanks.

Given this, I might suggest considering the Kuzma XLDC as well, which IMO is even more tilted towards a direct drive signature than the M and has a weighty foundation. The M does a better job of sort of melding the desirable characteristics of both belt and direct drive. (All based on my experience.)

With tubes, again IME, I do think I'd prefer XLDC over the M. And so I'd lean towards the former or the SL-1000R as an option. I haven't heard the SL-1000R, so I can't recommend it one way or the other. I'd really like to hear it.

 

[Gary J]

Bazelio Thanks for your answers, I am waiting to hear the SL-1000R also. The people on this site are great to talk to and they have vast knowledge of everything audio, it is in my opinion the best audio site on the net.

 

[bonzo75]

Bazelio thanks for the info on the Stabi M, my system is so different from yours as my system has Sound Lab speakers that do not like solid-state and I have tried many solid-state amps and preamps and they all sound thin or lean compared to tubes. With my electrostats I have shut down 400 watt solid-state amps with thermal overload because of the mismatch and the way electrostatic speakers need to be driven. With that in mind some say the Technics cannot be beat and some say the belt driven tables are the way to go because they are more musical. Some people say the Technics sound somewhat like digital and some say belt tables sound sluggish in the bottom compared to direct drive and it goes on and on. From what I think you are saying you have heard the new technics SL-1000R table if that is so does it do anything that you like better then the Stabi M?
Thanks.

Hi Gary, can you please say which SS amps you tried, and which tube amps you preferred?

 

[Gary J]

Bonzo I tried Mark Levinson 536 mono blocks and they went into thermal overload and shut down at moderate listening levels and I also tried Parasound JC-1 monoblocks and they were way too bright. The only amp that sounded good was the Pass Labs 350 amp and it was a bit too lean. The best amps I have had on my speakers were the Antique Sound Labs DT-200 monoblocks but they broke down due to poor build quality. I am running Quicksilver mono 120 amps now and they sound great I have also had a Convergent Audio Technology JL-5 amp and Conrad Johnson tube amps that sounded good too but for my system tubes are the way to go they provide body, warmth, and are more musical overall then every solid-state amp I have had in my system and I have had my Sound Labs since 1993.

 

[bazelio]

Bonzo I tried Mark Levinson 536 mono blocks and they went into thermal overload and shut down at moderate listening levels and I also tried Parasound JC-1 monoblocks and they were way too bright. The only amp that sounded good was the Pass Labs 350 amp and it was a bit too lean. The best amps I have had on my speakers were the Antique Sound Labs DT-200 monoblocks but they broke down due to poor build quality. I am running Quicksilver mono 120 amps now and they sound great I have also had a Convergent Audio Technology JL-5 amp and Conrad Johnson tube amps that sounded good too but for my system tubes are the way to go they provide body, warmth, and are more musical overall then every solid-state amp I have had in my system and I have had my Sound Labs since 1993.

I heard those Quicksilver amps recently. Not bad at all and I can see why you like them with estats. I do think the Kuzma XLDC would be the right pairing there. And the Technics is also a very intuitive choice. You're going to end up with a killer sound in the end, either way. Very curious to hear what you end up with.

 

[bonzo75]

Bonzo I tried Mark Levinson 536 mono blocks and they went into thermal overload and shut down at moderate listening levels and I also tried Parasound JC-1 monoblocks and they were way too bright. The only amp that sounded good was the Pass Labs 350 amp and it was a bit too lean. The best amps I have had on my speakers were the Antique Sound Labs DT-200 monoblocks but they broke down due to poor build quality. I am running Quicksilver mono 120 amps now and they sound great I have also had a Convergent Audio Technology JL-5 amp and Conrad Johnson tube amps that sounded good too but for my system tubes are the way to go they provide body, warmth, and are more musical overall then every solid-state amp I have had in my system and I have had my Sound Labs since 1993.

Thanks. Do you prefer the quicksilver to CJ and cat? What differences between the 3? Which pre do you use?

 

[Gary J]

Bonzo75 The Cat can drive anything with only 100 watts of power, the CJ is smooth sounding using kt 120 tubes and the Quicksilver sounds great with only two kt 150 tubes per amp. The Quicksilver is only $4400 USD one third of the other two amps with power and sound to match. I am using a Cat Legend Black Path Edition preamp with built in phono this preamp is the best I have had in my system and I have had many.

 

[zerostargeneral]

Dear Sir,

Why not try the Primary Control and have the best of all worlds,so to speak?

Personally I feel it bests the other two by some margin.Their own tonearm with a modern Garrott P 77i or the Optim(MM) will sing like a bird on electrostatics.

Kindest regards,G.

 

[Gary J]

I ordered a SL-1000R table and arm in May and my dealer has no idea of if or when it will arrive. Maybe I should have ordered a Stabi M instead.

 

[asiufy]

Weird, we've delivered a few 1200Rs since then. They're coming, but supply is still pretty tight...

 

[Gary J]

I have made a decision after over a year of research, I have a Technics SL-1000R coming next month. I hope I made the right decision and I know soon I will be changing out the arm for a better one, not sure what to change it to maybe a triplanar, a 4 point or a SME. Some say the Kuzma Stabi M is better and in the end it may be but I have always had belt drives and maybe it is time to change to direct drive for a change, time will tell. Thanks to all for your suggestions this last year.

 

[assessor43]

My local brick and mortar has one still in the box. pretty sure about that.

 

[KeithR]

Good luck with the SP1000, Gary! Look forward to a full report.

 

[XV-1]

congrats on the R. Put a Thales Simplicity II and you will have close to a world beater.

 

[hongkongfoufou]

Hello, do you receive your Technics ?
I have mine since one year.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

Hello, do you receive your Technics ?
I have mine since one year.

Hello Fou,

How is the Technics?

 

[hongkongfoufou]

Because I have the same cartridges, I can say the Technics has not the same sound like the VPI Classic 3.
But I have Furutech Silver Arrows first version with VPI and JPS LAB Super conductor V for the Technics.
The Technics is more HiFi if I can say that, and the VPI is more embellished.
A friend prefers the VPI, another prefer the Technics...For me , there are two different sounds.
But the Technics plays with an absolute silent, even between two songs.
With the VPI, if I increase the volume sound, at very high level, we can listen some rumble...and this is the big difference....
Another thing, the arm of the VPI is excellent, but I don't know how did Technics to make this turntable, because I have powerful bass with the same cartridge !!! More bass than the VPI.