Thanks for the udpate...I've not heard of those amps (other than the Vitus)...good to know. Will be interesting to read your feedback on the Vitus both in absolute terms, but also in comparison to these other amps. Good luck.
What amplification are you using with your Wilson speakers ?
- Thread starter Chrisfrombyron
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Thanks for the udpate...I've not heard of those amps (other than the Vitus)...good to know. Will be interesting to read your feedback on the Vitus both in absolute terms, but also in comparison to these other amps. Good luck.
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
Sam, having just re-viewed this thread, I think you may do well to try an ARC Ref5 SE pre with your Ref 150, you will note bass improvement for sure. And those Herbies footer things did not work at all for me under my racks, I removed them and the music returned, before, the sound was there, but not the music. I decided to just go ahead and spike the racks. But... YMMV. Under my Alexia I use Stillpoints. My dealer begged me to get them so when he placed the speakers, on carpet, he could easily move them around. (Of course, they sound great too.) Of the SS amps I've heard, the Dag stuff would be my choice if buying SS gear, but I'd pair the pre with the amps. You might consider the Dag integrated?
A lot of folks prefer SS amps for their bass control. I had a few audiophile folks over a couple weeks back for a four hour listening session. All kinds of music was played (didn't get to any classical), and I think Daft Punk probably had the biggest bass lines. The REF75 seemed to do a fine job, considering my room has a fundamental frequency very close to Alexia's own peak ~73 hz. My room also is open behind listening position, else I'm sure the bass would get truly muddy. I'm starting design on a room remodel, and will be looking forward to hearing the Ref75 in a well designed room. (Probably send the amp for upgrade to SE status while room is under construction.)
A lot of folks prefer SS amps for their bass control. I had a few audiophile folks over a couple weeks back for a four hour listening session. All kinds of music was played (didn't get to any classical), and I think Daft Punk probably had the biggest bass lines. The REF75 seemed to do a fine job, considering my room has a fundamental frequency very close to Alexia's own peak ~73 hz. My room also is open behind listening position, else I'm sure the bass would get truly muddy. I'm starting design on a room remodel, and will be looking forward to hearing the Ref75 in a well designed room. (Probably send the amp for upgrade to SE status while room is under construction.)
ref 150 is great amp for running wilsons.
i agree with bob that pairing it with a ref 5se will maximise things. they just get on so well together electronically.
in regards to gryphon, the diablo imo, is nowhere near the level of antileon/colosseum/mephisto.
nowhere near them to be honest.
i agree with bob that pairing it with a ref 5se will maximise things. they just get on so well together electronically.
in regards to gryphon, the diablo imo, is nowhere near the level of antileon/colosseum/mephisto.
nowhere near them to be honest.
Good to know...thanks. Never heard the Diablo. I am hesitant to ask another person who seems to have heard the bigger Gryphons...but here goes.
How do the Antileon, Colosseum and latest Mephisto compare? I have owned the original Antileon and now the Colosseum...so thanks for any observations about Mephisto.
My Dag Stereo does an outstanding job and over the past two years just gets better. Matched with either the cj GAT or Pass XP-20 plays some nice music.
I would agree that the ARC REF150 might not be the best at controlling the bass, especially if your room exhibits any bass boom/overhang.
I would agree that the ARC REF150 might not be the best at controlling the bass, especially if your room exhibits any bass boom/overhang.
agree - though for smaller room, ref150 is fine.
ll21 - i haven't heard the mephisto, but i reckon it may be a step up from antileon for sure!
having said that, i've heard the antileon and it's as much amp as anybody could want.......
the diablo was very thin sounding to me. very ss sounding. antileon got nice weight. much more full-bodied control. mephisto probably moreso.
another similar sounding one was the karan kam-900 mono's. great amps!
ll21 - i haven't heard the mephisto, but i reckon it may be a step up from antileon for sure!
having said that, i've heard the antileon and it's as much amp as anybody could want.......
the diablo was very thin sounding to me. very ss sounding. antileon got nice weight. much more full-bodied control. mephisto probably moreso.
another similar sounding one was the karan kam-900 mono's. great amps!
Thanks...i will say that the Antileon is a phenomenal amp. The Colosseum presents a more filigreed, nuanced and much more extended treble that feels more balanced to me (in my system.) I also feel its noise floor is lower with lower grain as well. Did the Antileon have perhaps 2% more intensity of sweetness in the mids? i thought it did in comparison, and i am told it is now back in the Mephisto which has even lower grain, greater extension, etc...So kind of the best of both amps, but where (i am told) the Colosseum is much closer to the Mephisto than to the Antileon.
Someday, i will hear for myself, but until then perfectly content.
have you heard the antileon signature?
i haven't, but am interested to know if any sonic differences are evident with that one.
of course it is up in power.
i haven't, but am interested to know if any sonic differences are evident with that one.
of course it is up in power.
I have not heard the Antileon Signature, only the Antileon which i also owned. I also have heard the earlier DMA100 from ages ago, but not in a system i knew well. I have been told the Antileon Signature of a few years ago was better than the Antileon but retained the character of the original Antileon (a darker balance, but one which i enjoyed). I do not know much about the revised Antileon Signature which was just announced...i believe the intention was again to retain Antileon's character but with greater improvements in terms of noise floor, etc.
ok thank you.
one day i will hopefully hear one and report back.
i also heard a dm-100 and also the reference monoblocks, but they were both about 20 years ago, so not much recollection of the sound other than i was definitely bowled over by the references driving ml's ( i think monoliths?)
one day i will hopefully hear one and report back.
i also heard a dm-100 and also the reference monoblocks, but they were both about 20 years ago, so not much recollection of the sound other than i was definitely bowled over by the references driving ml's ( i think monoliths?)
Looking for a good amp / pre amp to go with Wilson Alexa's. Listening to the following amps next week
Momentum Mono's + Pre
Gryphon Mephisto + Pandora
ML No 53's + No 52 Pre
I will be adding a TT in the near future. Have heard the DAG Integrated and liked the rich tonality felt that the sound could have done with more sparkle and control. A friend in the industry in the US has done the above comparison and recommended the Gryphon combo as sounding the best. Any comments please.
Momentum Mono's + Pre
Gryphon Mephisto + Pandora
ML No 53's + No 52 Pre
I will be adding a TT in the near future. Have heard the DAG Integrated and liked the rich tonality felt that the sound could have done with more sparkle and control. A friend in the industry in the US has done the above comparison and recommended the Gryphon combo as sounding the best. Any comments please.
Bruce B
WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
I have heard the XLFs with D'Agostino stereo and monos. i have heard the Gryphon drive my own X1s. Both great combinations...though the speakers are not your Alexias (but close). i have a bias, as i own the Gryphon and feel no desire to change to anything else. There is something about it when we played it in comparison to a few amps in the store...with Wilson speakers. The Gryphon is quite a special amp, and i do like its sound coming thru a Wilson.
Good luck...all seem to be great choices.
Reading the specs on the Mephisto it would have complete control over any speakers it was driving, the aspect I enjoyed so much out of the Momentum Integrated was the rich musicality, unfortunately I can't listen to a Mephisto next week so would like to know if it has that rich character. The only review I could find was the Ultra audio one by Jeff Fritz which gave it high praise.
if you are going to sydney to hear the amps, they did have an antileon signature there, that i heard recently.
it sounded good after a couple of hours warm up, just like an antileon, but maybe a touch cooler.
surely mephisto would be a substantial step up.
mephisto monos would be huge overkill, but if you have the means and the space......and don't forget these amps get the room pretty warm, maybe unbearably so in qld summer if you have small room.
it sounded good after a couple of hours warm up, just like an antileon, but maybe a touch cooler.
surely mephisto would be a substantial step up.
mephisto monos would be huge overkill, but if you have the means and the space......and don't forget these amps get the room pretty warm, maybe unbearably so in qld summer if you have small room.
as opposed to which?
antileon?
or momentum?
i haven't heard mephisto, but i'd think the house sound would likely be retained with more refinement and more effortlessness.they really can drive anything.
i heard the vtl s200 on the alexia, and that definitely was not enough power to control the woofers.
gryphon separates will control anything.
i have not heard momentum, but there are guys on here who own them and enjoy them on wilsons.
antileon?
or momentum?
i haven't heard mephisto, but i'd think the house sound would likely be retained with more refinement and more effortlessness.they really can drive anything.
i heard the vtl s200 on the alexia, and that definitely was not enough power to control the woofers.
gryphon separates will control anything.
i have not heard momentum, but there are guys on here who own them and enjoy them on wilsons.
I have owned the original Antileon and now the Colosseum. I have only spoken with fellow Gryphon owners who have compared Colosseum to Mephisto (which they now own). I also have spoken with Gryphon about Mephisto.
My own observations in my system:
- The Antileon overall had immensely propulsive and detailed bass. It delivered the same when it arrived, and we were A/B'ing it against other big amps in the store which at the time included Krells 900s as i recall though its been some time and the ARC Ref210s.
- It also had a remarkable deep tonal reach into violin strings which was a joy to listen to. When strings really soar, there was this intense 'sweetness' at the extreme end of the note that was really rare to hear imho that brought me closer to live
- Its treble was dark but detailed, as in the treble detail was there but recessed in relation to the rest of the spectrum...more of a balance thing, when we compared with Goldmund, CJ amps. it took some getting used to, but i was okay with it
Colosseum
- The bass retains that same propulsive and controlled quality
- The treble is suddenly illuminated, extended and detailed like someone finally opened the window and the let the air in...there is a sense of 'breathing' in the upper registers that i did not get with the Antileon
- Overall seems a bit quieter, lower noise floor or at least more detail coming forth...and much, much finer grain
- The mids are 'nearly' identical...in fact, better in all aspects given noise and more refined grain...but it seems (to me) to have lost just a hint of that intense sweetness in the mids at the extremes of the note...and by hint i mean "3%-5%".
i am told by fellow Gryphon owners the Mephisto continues the path of improvement in a number of areas, but in particular that intensity of sweetness is back and even improved. Just my observations.
My own observations in my system:
- The Antileon overall had immensely propulsive and detailed bass. It delivered the same when it arrived, and we were A/B'ing it against other big amps in the store which at the time included Krells 900s as i recall though its been some time and the ARC Ref210s.
- It also had a remarkable deep tonal reach into violin strings which was a joy to listen to. When strings really soar, there was this intense 'sweetness' at the extreme end of the note that was really rare to hear imho that brought me closer to live
- Its treble was dark but detailed, as in the treble detail was there but recessed in relation to the rest of the spectrum...more of a balance thing, when we compared with Goldmund, CJ amps. it took some getting used to, but i was okay with it
Colosseum
- The bass retains that same propulsive and controlled quality
- The treble is suddenly illuminated, extended and detailed like someone finally opened the window and the let the air in...there is a sense of 'breathing' in the upper registers that i did not get with the Antileon
- Overall seems a bit quieter, lower noise floor or at least more detail coming forth...and much, much finer grain
- The mids are 'nearly' identical...in fact, better in all aspects given noise and more refined grain...but it seems (to me) to have lost just a hint of that intense sweetness in the mids at the extremes of the note...and by hint i mean "3%-5%".
i am told by fellow Gryphon owners the Mephisto continues the path of improvement in a number of areas, but in particular that intensity of sweetness is back and even improved. Just my observations.
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