Evaluation of the Magnepan 1.7

[Gregadd]

I don't get paid for this. Consequently for technical questions regarding the Magnepan 1.7 and how it differs from the 1.6 use this link. http://www.magnepan.com/model_MG_16 The evaluation will posted over the next couple of days.
Thanks Greg

 

[Gregadd]

EVALUATING THE MAGNEPLANAR 1.7

I purchased the Magneplanar MG 1 circa 1978 at Myer Emco in Metro DC which is now more of an AV store than hi-fi emporium. I purchased it on the same day I heard it. Curiously I have never had a serious relationship with a box speaker from that moment on.
Allow me now to go to my bedroom closet and pull out my Magnepan MG 1. Yes I still have it. Yes it sounds as good as ever did. I really need to have a yard sale.

For some reason when I tried to punch in the address for GIFTED LISTENER AUDIO (www.giftedlistener.com) in Centerville, Virginia into my GPS it wood not accept it. I had checked out the directions on Mapquest but did not print them out. I generally remembered where it was located .I had not visited the store in almost ten years. I kept up with them on their website.
On one of my visits the owner (Tom and Suzanne Unger) had expressed his opinion that tubes were unacceptable and that he would carry only solid state amps. I thought it was okay to make that decision for himself. How about his customers? He carried some solid state heavyweights at the time like Mark Levinson and Bryston. Not too worry. He’s a VTL dealer now. Okay he only had one, little VTL amp not connected to anything. I would wager that his customers prevailed.

I met Suzanne Unger years ago. She seemed more interested in the people involved in audio than. The equipment. We had a colorful discussion about Harry Pearson.

I avoided Route 66 the main commuter drag and took the scenic Route 29. Scenic if you love strip malls. Just as I recalled the store was located in the middle of the mall. It really is an elegant store and the owner was a gentleman who served me a cup of coffee and allowed me to listen as long I cared to. The purchase of the Maggie 1.7 is an eight week wait.. Yikes! Talk about delayed gratification. The owner said worldwide demand is causing the delay of a popular product.

At $2,000.00 the Maggie 1.7 is accessible to the masses. Get four and have surround sound. It is diminutive with a small footprint. Part of the membrane is exposed. I‘m not sure why and I thought it was visually unappealing. The exposed membrane. Overall the speaker should meet the WAF. Mysteriously the Maggie feet continue to shrink. James Winey definitely does not have a foot fetish. After market stands are available from something minimal like sound anchors or the all out Magnestands. http://www.indiespinzone.com/mag/mag4.html
The system was connected to some Rotel components. They are unremarkable enough to not warrant mention here. 60 wpch were available for each speaker. A variety of some of my favorite CDs were supplied by me.
I settled in for a listen. Maggies’ reputation for a voracious appetite for power was not in evidence. Low level resolution was very good,. A pleasant surprise in that I remembered that former models had to be played loud. Alas, it did sound better played loud. Most speakers do. Expect to acthe complish best results from a well designed solid sate amp of at least 200 watts. Yes I said solid state. Not only is Magnepan one of the few speakers that sound fine with solid state, I may actually prefer it that way.

One of the many things that anger me about the NFL is the policy of sending the best players to the worst teams. How many great players never reached their potential because there team never provided a proper supporting cast.. The Maggie 1. 7 had been drafted by Rotel and was destined to spend at least the early part of it career as an underachiever languishing in obscurity.
I
Imaging was good. No ping pong effect or larger than life instruments or vocals. Nothing spectacular.

Transient response was very good and detailed .Speed was very good. Triangles tingled and everything was coherent as you might expect with a diaphragm dipolar.
Bass was tight and coherent. Vocals had a realistic quality to them. It’s noteworthy how many components don’t do anything wrong nowadays. That is to say their sins tend to be those of omission rather than commission.

How does the 1.7 compare to my reference CLS. I think that if both speakers were S at the some concert The CLS would be in row five and The Maggie would be in row 10.
I just can’t help it. If the #1 pick was on a team with some decent blocking and a passing a game he could easily rush for a hundred yards per a game. I though hard about taking my amp and preamp to the store. When you know you are not going to buy there is only so much you can do.

The good news is the Maggie 1.7could be the basis of a top notch system. You could actually save enough money to allow you to have both vinyl and CD in your system.
A sub may offer some benefits, but is not an absolute necessity.

I hope that some good teams will try to trade up in the draft to get this player on their team. If not he will languish on a terrible team and not realize his potential. That would be a shame. My Moscode 402AU, and a CD player that could be used without a preamp, like one of the fine Accuphase players, may provide grade A sound on a “budget.”

A $2000.00 speaker will not wow your audio bodies, at least until they come over for a listen.

Highly recommended.

 

[Gregadd]

Pixture from the event

Pictues from the event
#1 CDs used for evaluation
#2My orinal MG 1 purchased in 1978
#3 Maggie 1.7 in store
#4 Sore front

 

[kach22i]

I went into Audio Dimensions in Royal Oak today. Harry Francis hooked up the 1.7's for me, driven by an Audio Research integrated modular solid state amp. He played Holly Cole's Temptation CD which I know very well as it is one of my test CD's.

These speakers sounded amazingly similar to my Martin Logan original Aerius speakers (in a good way) which have attached super tweeters and a self powered subwoofer. My Aerius speakers are driven with a 100 watt tube amp.

The 1.7's had the range and openness of a good large panel speaker, which it is.

The sound is slightly more crowded than my old Aerius speakers but the smooth seamless top end more than makes up for it.

The bass is there, no complaints at all, I really did not think about it to much as it just sounded right. Every mid-range and top-end detail had the right amount of sparkle and emphasis.

There was a slight lack of center stage and full flushness of vocals coming together. This is the same thing I heard at the AK-Fest but not as bad. I think this can be fixed with modest room treatments (absorption between speakers) and perhaps a different amp. Holly's voice did not have the ripe tone or presence and depth I've been able to coax out of my system after many years of tweaking.

These are very good, $2,000 speakers hitting a similar price and performance level the Aerius did 20 years ago. That may not sound like a glowing remark but in my mind it is (no super tweeter or sub on the 1.7). And like the Aerius they sounded good at low and medium sound levels, we did not crank them to 11.

RE: AK-Fest 2010
I mentioned that the 1.7 setup had us standing against the wall as the center seats were too close. Harry asked if I heard the 1.7's on the short wall of the hotel room, of course not I said they were set up on the long wall. He said trust me, I tried the 1.7's all over that room, that was the best place. I mentioned to him that in a similar room with dipole/bipole speakers set up on the short wall and there was a bad phase shift thing going on. Harry looked at me and sort of smiled with a knowing which said he avoid that problem for a lesser one.

EDIT: I've just read Greg's review above, I suspect any of the short comings we heard could be slayed with more money thrown into the front end including amps and preamps. If anyone else gets a chance to hear the 1.7's demand that they be hooked up with the best in the store and tell us what you hear.

 

[Gregadd]

EDIT: I've just read Greg's review above, I suspect any of the short comings we heard could be slayed with more money thrown into the front end including amps and preamps. If anyone else gets a chance to hear the 1.7's demand that they be hooked up with the best in the store and tell us what you hear.

Agreed.

 

[DonH50]

+2. I was very lucky to have a good dealer in the primordial past when I got my MG-III's (after owning MG-I's for years and flirting with II's and everything else, Magnepan or not). I was considering the III's, Tympani's, and B&W 801's (which were about as much as the Tymps and within my budget at the time -- not now!) I really liked the III's, but in comparison to the Tympani's they were sorely lacking bottom end and the image wasn't as stable. They were in different rooms but with similar electronics. Except in deep bass, the Tymp's (and III's) gave the 801's a run for their money, and after lots of listening over many days/weeks I decided to stay with Maggies. (I did try numerous other speakers, but that's another story.) But to the point...

My last rounds of listening showed the Tymp's clearly superior in bass to the III's, though I did not care for their sheer size nor the unrealistically wide (to me, in that room) sound stage. The speakers were in different rooms, but with almost identical electronics (tubes, out of deference to my current components then, though I listened using a variety of components). The dealer (Christopher Hanson, LA area) then moved the III's into the same room as the Tymps, re-arranging everything in the process so I could listen. The magic happened -- in the larger room, with better treatment, the difference was almost gone. The MG-III's took the day, due to a dealer willing to go the extra mile (or ten) and show what the speakers would do, not what he could sell. They lost a Tympani sale, but gained a customer, and ultimately others as I spread the word.

My recent experience with Magnepan, both calling the company and working with a local'ish dealer, leads me to believe they have not lost that willingness to work with a customer and go that extra mile (or ten). Kudos - Don

 

[Lee]

The Maggie 1.7s will suffer from that old dealer syndrome of "they are only $2K speakers, why would I pair them with $20K of electronics?"

But they sound awesome when this happens.

 

[Fred]

I listened to the 1.7's about 6 weeks ago at my local dealer. He had them set up along the short axis of the room and in the middle of it. (It was a large room). Powered with refernce level AR gear the speakers sounded truly special. Open, large, dynamic, resolving. The only thing was the hole in the soundstage which I attributed to his odd setup in his room. I didn't say anything about it, but I know I'll be able to eliminate that charactertic in my own listening room. Oh, I forgot to mention, based on that audition I went back last week and ordered a pair. Black on Black thank you very much.

 

[kach22i]

I went back last week and ordered a pair.

Did they come in yet?

 

[Gregadd]

George I heard there was a six week backorder.

 

[Fred]

Did they come in yet?

Yes, I've had them in my sytem for about 3 weeks now. I've told several friends that I really believ the $2099.99 is the best money I have ever spent in my life. These speakers are amazing sounding and are a very honest speaker. By that I mean, brutally unforgiving to poorly recorded music. But the resolution and detail are unmatched by any speaker I've ever come into contact with. They produce such a huge soundstage. Wide, deep and tall.

They have also exposed the weakness in my amp as they do need real power to get the best out of them. That's purchase for another day, but also something to look forward to. I really enjoyed the research process that led me to the Maggies and I will have an equally good time searching out the right power to drive them.

Anyone in the market for a new pair of speakers (that have the requisite room) and are in the $2,000.00 up to $10,000 price range would do well by auditioning a pair of the 1.7's. The sound speaks for itself, this is a product that absolutely stands on its own merit.

 

[Fred]

George I heard there was a six week backorder.

Not true, mine where in at 2 weeks.

I understand the 3.7's are backordered though.

 

[kach22i]

Yes, I've had them in my sytem for about 3 weeks now.

Did you have to do anything special to get the center image/stage to "fill-in"?

Tell us about your room and speaker set up, some dimensions would be nice.

Perhaps a few photos?

What is your current amp, and why do you feel it is the weak point in the chain?

 

[Fred]

Did you have to do anything special to get the center image/stage to "fill-in"?

Tell us about your room and speaker set up, some dimensions would be nice.

Perhaps a few photos?

What is your current amp, and why do you feel it is the weak point in the chain?

Glad you asked. My room is small at 12x14. The Maggies stand just a 3 feet off of the back wall and are about 16 inches from the side walls. (Side walls being far less of a factor for this design). The Maggies are shipped as a matched pair with identical serial numbers, differentiated only by a 1 and 2. The ribbons for the super tweeter is set to the inside of the speaker and Magnepan suggests that the setup is optimal for the sweet spot with both left and right speakers orienting the supertweeter on the inside each speaker. Magnepan also suggests that the speakers be set up with some degree of toe-in. This set-up offers a focused, almost pin-point setup. In a room a bit longer than mine I think this would work well.

In my setup, however, I have chosen to orient the speakers opposite to this set-up. Instead, I have reversed the orientation and have the supertweeters set to the outside. I did this because in this near-field listening room, with 2 large theater style chairs, I needed to balance the soundstage so that each chair offered a satisfying listening experience. The result has been a very expansive soundstage. Perhaps less in pinpoint detail, but broader, taller and deeper. In my view, a more satisfying sound as the entire room is alive from nearly anywhere that you stand or sit. It's a trade-off, but I spent several days moving the speakers around in both configurations and finally settled upon a toe-in alignment with the ribbons oriented to the outside of each speaker. I like it this way. A LOT!

Pictures are something I will post in due course, but I'm not completely finished with the front end yet and want to wait until it's done to my satisfaction. Hope you can understand that.

BTW, Alvin Lee and Ten Years After (Ssssh) on the original Deram label sounds really good with these speakers. Just happen to have that spinning as I post this.

 

[DaveyF]

Fred, I would be very interested in photos, once you have a chance to post them. Have you tried the Maggies without any toe-in? When I owned Maggies, I slightly preferred them with no toe-in in a room of approximately the same size as yours. OTOH, the Maggies did like to be as far out into the room as was possible, I managed to pull mine out about to the middle of the room; and since i was listening like you in the near-field, the impression of depth was increased in this manner.

 

[Gregadd]

Not true, mine where in at 2 weeks.

I understand the 3.7's are backordered though.

Things change. Different dealers have different priority.

 

[Fred]

Things change. Different dealers have different priority.

My post was made from the point of view that at the time my order was placed the dealer called Magnepan to be certain that they were not back-ordered at the factory. I assume that status is subject to change without notice.

As for dealer priorities I would hope that every dealers concern is only to get the product into the hands of the customer at the earliest possible moment. Unless, of course, your reference to priority concerns the dealers status with Magnepan. If that's the case I wouldn't know what to say about that.

 

[Fred]

Fred, I would be very interested in photos, once you have a chance to post them. Have you tried the Maggies without any toe-in? When I owned Maggies, I slightly preferred them with no toe-in in a room of approximately the same size as yours. OTOH, the Maggies did like to be as far out into the room as was possible, I managed to pull mine out about to the middle of the room; and since i was listening like you in the near-field, the impression of depth was increased in this manner.

I tried them without toe-in. Too much imaging is lost in this setup. No, for me, toe-in for sure.

 

[Gregadd]

My post was made from the point of view that at the time my order was placed the dealer called Magnepan to be certain that they were not back-ordered at the factory. I assume that status is subject to change without notice.

As for dealer priorities I would hope that every dealers concern is only to get the product into the hands of the customer at the earliest possible moment. Unless, of course, your reference to priority concerns the dealers status with Magnepan. If that's the case I wouldn't know what to say about that.

Fred I forgot to say you were right about the two weeks. When I originated this thread the dealer said the back order was six weeks. Not surprising for the initial launch of a hot product. No doubt the buzz has died down and they have caught up with the back orders.

I have had discussions with lots of dealers. Big store often get priority because they can submit multiple orders and pay up front.

I never meant to contradict you.

 

[jadis]

the Maggies did like to be as far out into the room as was possible, I managed to pull mine out about to the middle of the room; and since i was listening like you in the near-field, the impression of depth was increased in this manner.

Hi Davey,

The position for my Maggies for the longest time has been like that, about in middle of the room, and indeed, it provides the best depth and front to back layering in the soundstage in this position. Early on when I placed them like this, a lot my friends frowned upon it because very few people I know would place speakers almost in the middle of the length of the room. I'm not too concerned about how things look in my listening room, but how they sound, and this is how I like them best.