Preserved moss as an echo buster

[rubinken]

Has anyone tried using preserved moss as an acoustical treatment for echo in a room? If so, please share your experiences.

I have a very large 'great room' with tall wood cathedral ceilings, glass windows & glass doors throughout. I've placed rugs, furniture, plants, various soft absorbing throws & yarn, and bookshelves with various items at various depths and heights. Echo is still terrible.

I want to keep the visual impact of our glass views open, so I prefer not adding curtains. I understand that this will probably limit my critical listening in that room. Fortunately I have two other systems. But I would love to enjoy music in our great room too.

There are 12" wall spaces between the glass doors & windows. Today I started investigating preserved moss as an eye pleasing, ear pleasing echo buster. It requires no maintenance. Your thoughts about preserved moss to reduce echo's are appreciated

 

[Cellcbern]

Has anyone tried using preserved moss as an acoustical treatment for echo in a room? If so, please share your experiences.

I have a very large 'great room' with tall wood cathedral ceilings, glass windows & glass doors throughout. I've placed rugs, furniture, plants, various soft absorbing throws & yarn, and bookshelves with various items at various depths and heights. Echo is still terrible.

I want to keep the visual impact of our glass views open, so I prefer not adding curtains. I understand that this will probably limit my critical listening in that room. Fortunately I have two other systems. But I would love to enjoy music in our great room too.

There are 12" wall spaces between the glass doors & windows. Today I started investigating preserved moss as an eye pleasing, ear pleasing echo buster. It requires no maintenance. Your thoughts about preserved moss to reduce echo's are appreciated

DHDI's ZR Acoustics panels may be the ideal thing for you. My experiences with them can be found here: https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/trying-the-zr-acoustics-panels.31846/

FYI: Here is a piece on one of their installations featuring extensive glass surfaces:

Creating Transparency In A Glass House

After spending more than three years looking for a new house into which he could relocate his private production studio, Eric Hart was able to move out of his stereotypical black-box room and into a space flooded with natural light.

www.mixonline.com

 

[rubinken]

DHDI's ZR Acoustics panels may be the ideal thing for you. My experiences with them can be found here: https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/trying-the-zr-acoustics-panels.31846/

FYI: Here is a piece on one of their installations featuring extensive glass surfaces:

Creating Transparency In A Glass House

After spending more than three years looking for a new house into which he could relocate his private production studio, Eric Hart was able to move out of his stereotypical black-box room and into a space flooded with natural light.

www.mixonline.com

Thanks Cellcbern,
I'll read through and check your links more thoroughly. A quick perusal leaves me stumped as to how these would be viable, other than behind my speakers. I'll read more.

 

[Cellcbern]

Thanks Cellcbern,
I'll read through and check your links more thoroughly. A quick perusal leaves me stumped as to how these would be viable, other than behind my speakers. I'll read more.

Behind your speakers would be the most important place for them (you would move your speakers up close to them) but they would also be deployed at other non-glass reflection points.

 

[rubinken]

Some photos. It's challenging to use the same space for entertainment and quality music. Some photos:

 

[Ron Resnick]

It all looks beautiful!

 

[rubinken]

It all looks beautiful!

Thanks Ron. Visually it is gorgeous. Acoustically though, its an echo chamber nightmare. Maybe it's a situation where , "You can't always get what you want..."

 

[Ron Resnick]

Thanks Ron. Visually it is gorgeous. Acoustically though, its an echo chamber nightmare. Maybe it's a situation where , "You can't always get what you want..."

I understand. Walls of glass and good acoustics don't mix.

 

[Solypsa]

Are you opposed to treating the ceilings?

 

[rubinken]

Are you opposed to treating the ceilings?

Good question. Thanks. If it was visually pleasing, we would be totally open. But I'm not sure if treating only the ceilings would significantly reduce echo with all the other glasswork and open layout. I'm certainly not an acoustical expert...

 

[Cellcbern]

Some photos. It's challenging to use the same space for entertainment and quality music. Some photos:

Definitely a challenging room. The good news is that you appear to have a lot of space behind the listening sofa, making rear wall reflections (diffusion might be the choice there) less of a concern. I think you have to treat the wall behind the speakers, at least below the top shelf. Each speaker appears to effectively be in a little alcove with walls on three sides in addition to the shelves - a concentration of reflective surfaces. The 12" square DHDI ZR Acoustics "Sample Rate" panels (top choice) or GIK 244 or similar (cheaper) would fit on the wall between the shelves (possibly GIK on the "side" walls as well). If the shelves are removable and you can live without them it would be easier - you would have fewer reflective surfaces and could use bigger panels. I would also try treating the ceiling over the listening area with the ZR "hybrid" panels (very expensive), GIK or similar absorbers (much cheaper), or a combination panel (e.g., RPG BAD). The advantage of the ZR Acoustics panels is that they are thin (.75" to 1.5") and at least in my experience are the most effective. You might also treat the two wooden columns between the windows. Finally, if you are willing to do the work of experimenting with positioning, you might also try the ASI "Sugar Cubes" on the glass surfaces, in corners, and other spots (trial and error).

See:

ASI Sugar Cubes: Devil's Dice

Test - review of Acoustic System International Sugar Cubes

www.audiodrom.net

6moons audio reviews: ASI Sugar Cubes

asi

I would buy a few panels and try them on the ceiling and between the shelves to see what impact they make before buying more.

FYI: https://deltahdesign.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/DHDI-Product-Comparison-Chart-January-2022.pdf

 

[Solypsa]

Setting aside a full acoustical rework, which is not my area, I can say this:

I have worked on sound and general acoustic treatments for commercial spaces with the typical concrete floors, lots of glass and high ceilings. Sometimes the ceiling and maybe the top few feet of the wall space is the only place to apply any significant treatment. They can make a very positive impact, allowing rooms to be comfortable where they would not have been without.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

Thanks Ron. Visually it is gorgeous. Acoustically though, its an echo chamber nightmare. Maybe it's a situation where , "You can't always get what you want..."

Yeah exactly - at the end of the day, those stunning view and surroundings are fantastic so just do whatever you can to make the hifi sound okay without ruining that.

 

[kodomo]

My room has preserved moss on front wall but I also have extensive acoustic treatment tailor made and measured. Moss wall is much better than naked wall. Try and be creative with the moss and use different elements, depth etc. It is also a very nice interior design element to add to a room. Here is a snapshot from mine;

 

[the sound of Tao]

I’d wondered what that scene was on your front wall whenever I’ve seen your room pics Kodomo. Had imagined a mural in oils but preserved moss… you can see the achitect coming out in you… fascinating and very cool.

 

[kodomo]

I will be moving to a new house in a few weeks as my old house was within the hotel resorts land I have sold as of new years. The new room is a little smaller and ceiling is a bit lower but it will be a dedicated stereo listening room. Actually it will be a whole floor below our new house with its separate entrance. I will have an entree with audio related library, small bar, kitchenette, toilet etc. I will also be able to setup my studio with my old mixing console along my other studio equipment, synthesizers etc. in the adjacent room. I really miss making music and providing music production related services which I have had to gradually stop after my job started taking more and more time and on top of it I got married.

Now, I decided I will only do audio related businesses. Focus on my speaker company, provide room design for listening and production rooms, make music, mix albums, practice my instruments and all that I will be sharing the new room on my own topic when it is done.

 

[rubinken]

I appreciate your specific suggestions and links. I'll do some research. Thanks

My room has preserved moss on front wall but I also have extensive acoustic treatment tailor made and measured. Moss wall is much better than naked wall. Try and be creative with the moss and use different elements, depth etc. It is also a very nice interior design element to add to a room. Here is a snapshot from mine;

I think that looks stunning. Thanks for the photo.

 

[Hi-FiGuy]

Have you tried putting the speakers on the wall with the amazing out door view, I think you might be surprised.
Looks like a there would be natural rear diffusion at that point.
Try it, if it no work, move it back.
Be awesome to have that view while listening!

 

[rubinken]

Have you tried putting the speakers on the wall with the amazing out door view, I think you might be surprised.
Looks like a there would be natural rear diffusion at that point.
Try it, if it no work, move it back.
Be awesome to have that view while listening!

I had not considered repositioning three speakers on front of the glass. Thanks so much for expanding my thinking. I'll get some friends and we'll try that setup. Thanks again.

 

[Hi-FiGuy]

I had not considered repositioning three speakers on front of the glass. Thanks so much for expanding my thinking. I'll get some friends and we'll try that setup. Thanks again.

I have had some great results defying "status quo" set up rules and your room is without question not status quo.
Will wait for patiently for the report back.