I just auditioned a DAC that lists for 10K in my system. Having read/watched reviews and thread comments extolling its organic presentation, it had risen to the top of my "to demo" list. When a used unit with a return option appeared, I snapped it up. I thought I 'd scored my end-game DAC. Not so! I let it run for 6 days and it never engaged me emotionally. I hate bright/forward gear but in my system, this sounded dull and compressed. I never imagined that my integrated's onboard DAC could sound so much better to me than a 10K standalone unit, but this is what I experienced. I'm not going to mention the name because I'm sure there's nothing wrong with the DAC. This appears to be a question of synergy.
What I would like to know is, what factors should I pay closer attention to when DAC shopping that might help me avoid repeating this scenario?
You have to audition gear in your own system, in your home, with your music. Reviews are great in pointing you in a particular direction but you have to trust your ears. Unfortunately sometimes we buy the wrong gear, decide it's not what we really want and have to try again. If you're not happy then bite the bullet, put it up for sale and get something that brings you closer to your ideal presentation. Nobody knows what that is other than you.
I will be happy to respond to your question. Why not hear the DACs and companion systems on display at Shows. But the best way is to check with your local dealer for an audition. In my case, I heard the Grimm MU2 (streamer and DAC) with Zellaton speakers at Axpona, and I was pleasantly shocked. Then I heard the MBL C41 streamer in an MBL system, and it was a revelation! Two synergistic systems at opposite ends of the affordable scale.
Thanks for your kind responses. I don't buy anything I can't first demo at home and return, if necessary. I had bad experiences early on, buying gear based upon showroom demos and haven't ever developed the ability to listen to gear in unfamiliar rooms, with unfamiliar gear and extrapolate how it might sound in my room, with my gear. I know some can do this and while I admire such skills, I don't possess them.
Of course, I've had previous experiences with gear that didn't synergize with my system, in my room. This is normal. Mostly, in my case, such disappointments have centered around tonality/voicing. What was not so normal in this case was the sheer degree of difference between what I heard and the descriptions I'd read. I'd heard DACs up to 7K in the past but not at this 10K price point. I hadn't encountered any mentions in reviews of this component being particularly picky about partnering with ancillary gear. My integrated was 7K. The current version of my speakers list at 7K. My transport lists at 2.5K. Perhaps this DAC requires partnering with gear at the same price point to sound good. I don't know. That this component spounded so uninspiring at it's price point is what shocked me. It's often said that price is no guarantee of improved SQ. I guess previous experience simply hadn't prepared me for such a stark example of this truism.
Well, I spent about two years researching DACs and I believe I'm pretty well versed on what's available for 5-6K new and used. My previous standalone DAC was an r2r/NOS Aqua La Voce S2. It was originally available with various chipsets. Mine had Burr-Browns and that DAC together with the Hegel H390 had terrific bass for a monitor system. Eventually I sold that DAC because there was something abrasive about the upper mids that began to increasingly wear on me.
My Hegel H390's onboard AKM DAC is not at all fatiguing but I do miss the bass I got from the Aqua. I have a Jay's CDT2MK3 transport and Silverline SR17.5 monitors. Cabling is Audio Art speaker, Synergistic Research coax and VooDoo ac. I don't have a dedicated room. I've had very warm sound in there and also very bright sound, depending on the gear.
As it happens, I've just discovered the work I need done on my acoustic guitar is going to cost much more than expected, so for now, I'm going to explore upgrading ac cords to see if that helps with bass and postpone a DAC upgrade. To be honest, this experience has left me feeling more than a little gun-shy about DACs. That's what prompted me to ask whether there might be some spec or design element to watch out for that I haven't paid attention to up until now.
I just auditioned a DAC that lists for 10K in my system. Having read/watched reviews and thread comments extolling its organic presentation, it had risen to the top of my "to demo" list. When a used unit with a return option appeared, I snapped it up. I thought I 'd scored my end-game DAC. Not so! I let it run for 6 days and it never engaged me emotionally. I hate bright/forward gear but in my system, this sounded dull and compressed. I never imagined that my integrated's onboard DAC could sound so much better to me than a 10K standalone unit, but this is what I experienced. I'm not going to mention the name because I'm sure there's nothing wrong with the DAC. This appears to be a question of synergy.
What I would like to know is, what factors should I pay closer attention to when DAC shopping that might help me avoid repeating this scenario?
since everything in my setup takes a month to settle in, I would suggest giving it more time. If, for example, the used unit hadn't been played in a while or never completely broken in, it will need more time. Just a thought. Other than your time, it is a free experiment.
FYI, I had 7 days. From my perspective, the problem I see with your strategy is that it opens up the prospect of the brain "burning in", rather than the component. I've experienced this and discovered that this "burn in" is not necessarily a permanent state -- that one can unconsciously accommodate/suppress sonic nasties that later reassert themselves. I've had used gear here before that took two or three days to "wake up", but 6 days with no discernible change? No. I've bought components that improved over time, but their initial character remained -- it just became more refined. I'm not asserting what you suggest is impossible but it doesn't fit my experience.
FYI, I had 7 days. From my perspective, the problem I see with your strategy is that it opens up the prospect of the brain "burning in", rather than the component. I've experienced this and discovered that this "burn in" is not necessarily a permanent state -- that one can unconsciously accommodate/suppress sonic nasties that later reassert themselves. I've had used gear here before that took two or three days to "wake up", but 6 days with no discernible change? No. I've bought components that improved over time, but their initial character remained -- it just became more refined. I'm not asserting what you suggest is impossible but it doesn't fit my experience.
well, everyone goes about it their own way. and our own ears have to decide.
I agree that we bring new focus to new gear and that does change our listing perspective. But I also have experienced a few times when I almost returned cables/gear before a 30-day money-back trial period. Luckily, in those cases, I waited. A 30 - 60 day money-back guarantee helps. The 30-day is pretty standard. I've never purchased any gear without listening for two weeks and that was for gear that is broken in. The reason is the one you state -- that our ear/brain may be getting accustomed to the sound too. But that goes away after a few days - well, in my experience anyway.
Different room, ears, preferences, etc., so cannot generalize. However, I have also found that if a manufacturer suggests a certain number of hours for burn-in/settle-in, they are usually pretty close to the mark. In my experience (having had many DACs) digital takes a long time - months to reach their full potential.
Thanks for your additional comments. I could've conceivably extended the return window for a few more days and would've, had I observed any change in the presentation. There was simply no provision to give this unit months to reach its potential. In retrospect, it wouldn't have been a bad idea to contact the manufacturer. Of course, I still would've had a relatively short time in which to make a decision. Perhaps this was a scenario in which only a leap of faith could've verified for certain whether the unit would ever behave as described in reviews. However, I only have one system and for better or worse, am not the type of person to willingly put up with poor sonics for an extended period, not knowing what the outcome might be, in hopes that there will be an eventual payoff. I can see there might be an advantage to such an approach but that's not me and at 68, I don't see that changing. ;o)
