Best audiophile switch
- Thread starter Frankie67
- Start date
Absolutely this.
Some folk seem to be confused by eg Cat 8 which is able to handle huge amounts of data precisely because of the way its high twist rates and excellent shielding mimimise the amount of extraneous noise and in-cable crosstalk; but we audiophiles are more interested in the side-effect (noise reduction/rejection) than the speed they are capable of.
Most of us continue to use switches capable of handling no more than 1Gbps, sometimes 100Mbps. Data bandwidth/speed in the cables we connect to these is hardly an issue.
Agreed: there is a lot of misinformation being put out there.Oh dear, so much misinformation being put out there!
The tiny transformer magnetics at EVERY RJ45 Ethernet port in the world DO provide galvanic isolation. (Though some of those magnetics are better than others; most have 6~8 cores, the magnetics in EtherREGEN have 12 cores per port.) These transformers will block DC and low-source-impedance leakage. However, they DO NOT block high-source-impedance AC leakage.
Optical connections of course do block all leakage, but the circuitry in optical SFP transceivers generate their own noise at both ends and some amount of jitter (however small).
[As a footnote aside, since this is not a promotional forum, the--still 100% unique--advantage of the EtherREGEN (and why we have 'A' and 'B' side ports) is our active-differential isolation "moat". Literally high-speed differential digital isolation chips (expensive) sitting across a gap in the PCB.
Data--in SGMII format for Gen2 s we can offer 'B'-side Gigabit in Gen2 (isolators these fast were not available when back in 2018)--flows across this "moat", and clocks in differential format flow back to the 'A' side across another isolator. Following the isolators the data goes directly into our our secret 10GHz-capable ultra-low jitter (just 200 femtoseconds!) reclocking flip-flop. This is where the "magic" happens.]
The tiny transformer magnetics at EVERY RJ45 Ethernet port in the world DO provide galvanic isolation. (Though some of those magnetics are better than others.
So what does this actually mean? Is isolation not binary? Does the effect diminish over time?
So what does this actually mean? Is isolation not binary? Does the effect diminish over time?
Returning to Jeremy's excellent post as there are a few comments I wanted to make.
Appreciate the kind words about my system. I think the room treatments really help to make it easy to notice differences. Those ASC tube traps and Stillpoints Aperture panels made a huge difference.
It was interesting to hear how the Synergistic switch evolved right in front of us. This easily proved that it's worth the effort to try to get the best out of the gear we already purchased
I have been a fan of Synergistic's products that utilize UEF to reduce noise. I have a number of products that feature this (fuses, AC outlet, outlet cover, ECTs, Carbon Tuning discs) and they each delivered a benefit that justified what I paid for them. Thus, it really surprised me that these doohickeys didn't seem to do much when I tried them.
This is an excellent point. I do hope though that more can be achieved at a lower price as the switch marketplace matures. I think three out of the four switches were first generation products, with the Tempus possibly being a second generation as @keithc mentioned in passing that NA had a previous switch with a different name.
Another excellent point. I probably should have done the same. Keith spent more time with the PhoenixNET, so I look forward to reading his review once it's published.
It was really good - especially into the switches. That's gonna cost me.
They reduce noise, but I would be careful to not use the verb "filter". They are each able to pass less noise, I think mainly by imparting less of their own.
It was the $400 Shunyata Venom V14 digital, but otherwise spot on.
Yes, I have been very happy with the sound quality from my ER. So much so that I'm not really in the market for another switch. I will buy a ER Gen 2 though, mostly because it will support gigabit. It can be painfully slow to copy large PGGB'd files over to the internal drives of my Antipodes server. Also, when files are in the process of being copied over, music can't be played from my NAS as there will be dropouts. The ER Gen 1 will get moved to my AV system once the Gen 2 lands.
Agree totally.
I give you about a year.how long can I resist the temptation to trade up to one?
I think he answered this by saying that "these transformers will block DC and low-source-impedance leakage. However, they DO NOT block high-source-impedance AC leakage." So there still is some leakage through these transformers. Were there not, audiophile switches might not do as much.
I am new to this thread and read most posts since the above by Kenny due his cross-reference elsewhere. There is some good discussion here. I have a few key comments to chip in about what I have found (briefly).
Synergistic Research Tranquility Pods (EM Cells) are very effective at improving SQ when used with any switch I tried, and that improvement increases with upgrading grounding, footers and power supply. I have them under ethernet devices that are not able to be changed for 'audiophile' versions and under my ER. The SR Switch and Router have these EM cells at their heart.
SR ECTs placed inside switches are quite beneficial.
Shakti On-lines on ethernet cable connectors to be quite effective, perhaps even more than the Shakti stones on switches etc
I use a Mikrotik CRS 305 as router because it is 10G and sounds a lot better than the Ubiquiti Edge Router X (1G) it replaced. There is a whole thread on Audiophile Style about Optical that covers 10G benefits.
Put caps like Audioquest on all unused RJ45 ports.
I am surprised the QSA-L etherent cable is 6m, it suggest it is 'absorbing' something unwanted enroute. I'd be curious how that compares with short cables that also absorb - perhaps the likes of Shunyata Omega.
I am not surprised to hear changing power cables to switches makes a difference.
I am not so sure veiled sounding is automatically a bad thing, sometimes that seems to be a step towards and overall improvement depending on some other tweak to 'illuminate'.
If I have time I will reply to specific comments later.
Which QSA-L Ethernet cable- Gamma Revelation, Gamma Infinity, or Spectra Combo?
By my definition of veiled, it can never be a good thing, as my ultimate goal is for my system to get the heck out of the way of the music. If a tweak is found to illuminate then it would get substituted for something that better gets out of the way. I don’t subscribe to the “offset this by adding that” approach. I think that’s why @jeremya was able to say that my system is an “excellent lens to experience music through”.
Not everyone is after that though. I just mention it as I think it helps to explain how I stack-ranked the switches. It was essentially a ranking of how well each switch helped my system to get out of the way of the music.
Hello and good afternoon to you. All you should really concern yourself with (honestly) is the end result as to what hits your ears. That is what is important.
When you hear it (after break in) is all that really matters. At the end of the day, they have proprietary items inside the box, so you can guess but will never know.
Kind of like QSA products. People clammer about knowing it's this or that but again....there are proprietary items within the product. Unless you know what they are or buy their products? You will never know.
Tom
Some might call it veiled when those artefacts are removed. I have experienced reducing noise in increments so much that what initially sounded veiled, dark or dull gradually revealed more nuance and detail more clearly which might have previously been emphasised in a distorted way by noise.
I am slowly learning what un-distorted sounds like.
I'd be interested to know why copper in parallel to fibre is used.
I know a few reputable audiophile brands that do this because its sounds best to them. I have one and compared with a competitors cable with the shield connected at only one end there is not much difference.
I would say that each device (and cable) is both impacted by and pass on noise to a different degree, the end result at the streamer is the combined benefits of each thing's measures to reduce the noise and impacts.
gotcha. anyway the post (of the internals) was for fun.
As always, let their magic wow me
I'm using the ediscreation between my modem and FMC (copper cable/sablon ethernet 2020)
The FMC connects to router via fibre optic.
Don't know if the Stargate, as FMC would sound good/perform good like the Ediscreation switch? Or should I still use both Edis+Stargate (Stacked?) - but this would be quite a dream as I still need a Tempus (or something) for the front-end
Hi @dbastin , for avoidance of doubt and all that. When you quoted me earlier, you used only the (now italicised) piece after the semi-colon so may have missed the context of the very specific use case (now in bold) to which I referred which is between a switch and a streamer. This is for the reasons stated, that a network cable with the shield grounded at both ends can effectively undo the good work of the switch in reducing RFI noise. Does this same use case apply to your response? Did you try the above between a switch and streamer or elsewhere in your network?
For what it's worth, for the 10m run from router to switch I use Cat6a (shielded grounded at both ends) and then from switch to streamer I use a cable with the shield(s) grounded at only the switch end.
Republicoftexas69
Well-Known Member
So you have router > optical > Ediscreation > FMC > ...
Sorry if I missed it earlier but what is the rest of your network up to the streamer please? Thanks
QSA 13A fuses are sold in the UK. These are safety fuses and subject to strict legal regulations and labelling requirements.
I emailed the UK distributor. He confirmed by email that they are compliant Bussmann fuses underneath that have been relabelled and subject to QSA's treatment. There is no physical modification, else they would be illegal. As QSA won't explain their magic sauce, whether it changes their performance and legality is unknown.
UK law requires the manufacturer name and BS1362 certification to be displayed. In this regard they don't comply.
As these 13A fuses are marketed for up to $10,000 each in the UK, I can only assume all other QSA fuses are prepared the same way from stock fuses. In fact this can be seen from their YouTube channel.
its complicated.. i'll try.
Internet:
optical network terminal (ONT) > ediscreation switch > FMC > router
Note: I prefer fibre optic over copper transceiver. hence the use of FMC
Internal network
Router > Mikrotik SFP switch > etherRegen > Streamer (Lumin u2 mini)
Note: Fibre optic is used from from Router to etherRegen
I'm probably getting a Zayin Stargate to eliminate the ediscreation and FMC.
I intend to upgrade the etherRegen too
But that shield provides a connection between two ground points with different potentials, and will certainly result in current flowing from one to the other, something I have been advised to avoid. I believe you will hear an improvement if you add a LAN Isolator between the router and switch, to interrupt the continuity. A good one will also clean the signal from the router.
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