Another Orange fuse of the 9 I installed in my system has succumbed to infant mortality. That makes 2. The Bussman fuses that were original to the amp & installed in the amp per the specified ratings have lasted for whole time frame I have had the unit without any spurious events.
I have probably only turned the main system on 3x since all 9 Orange fuses have been installed.. I have another on the way.
Another Orange fuse of the 9 I installed in my system has succumbed to infant mortality. That makes 2. The Bussman fuses that were original to the amp & installed in the amp per the specified ratings have lasted for whole time frame I have had the unit without any spurious events.
I have probably only turned the main system on 3x since all 9 Orange fuses have been installed.. I have another on the way.
Yes, I have de-rated the amperage so that the Orange fuses are 30-50% more than original specification. I learned this originally on my Io where I promptly blew 4 fuses in both power supplies upon second turn on.
Even though I de-rated they blew.. so ... something in this production run or different in the Orange or bad luck.. not sure. Fwiw, they were all mini fast blow types that went on me this time.
I would really de -rate for a safety margin for blowing with the orange to at least +50% and if you are worried, check with your mfr.
Having said that they needed tons of break-in , which is as controversial as using after market fuses. At least 200 hrs . They initially sounded horrific.
Worth it in the end but expensive if you prematurely fry them
Yes, I have de-rated the amperage so that the Orange fuses are 30-50% more than original specification. I learned this originally on my Io where I promptly blew 4 fuses in both power supplies upon second turn on.
Even though I de-rated they blew.. so ... something in this production run or different in the Orange or bad luck.. not sure. Fwiw, they were all mini fast blow types that went on me this time.
I would really de -rate for a safety margin for blowing with the orange to at least +50% and if you are worried, check with your mfr.
Having said that they needed tons of break-in , which is as controversial as using after market fuses. At least 200 hrs . They initially sounded horrific.
Worth it in the end but expensive if you prematurely fry them
Let me know what values you settle with. I tired some Furutech fuses and they died a rather quick death in my Io Signature. I have remained with the stock fuses. Expensive experiment.
Unless the equipment manufacturer specifies fast blow, using them is, well, not good thinking...unless you’re hell bent on helping SR’s and resellers’ bottom lines. Think about it: since most equipment has an initial fast surge at start up, a fast blow fuse will by definition be less able to withstand that, unless it is of much higher amperage — and you know what the start-up surge amperage is.
My experience since the SR Blue, when I believe blown fuses first became an issue, is that 25% higher than spec is sufficient. That’s what I’ve read SR is privately advising at least for tube gear. If one has a regenerator or another piece that in effect protects against external surges, then going higher probably doesn’t hurt, though I’d check with someone more knowledgeable. In any case, I’ve found around 300 hours to be the ‘aha’ moment for the Orange. Those hours will be continuous, as long as power to the gear remains continuous.
Unless the equipment manufacturer specifies fast blow, using them is, well, not good thinking...unless you’re hell bent on helping SR’s and resellers’ bottom lines. Think about it: since most equipment has an initial fast surge at start up, a fast blow fuse will by definition be less able to withstand that, unless it is of much higher amperage — and you know what the start-up surge amperage is.
My experience since the SR Blue, when I believe blown fuses first became an issue, is that 25% higher than spec is sufficient. That’s what I’ve read SR is privately advising at least for tube gear. If one has a regenerator or another piece that in effect protects against external surges, then going higher probably doesn’t hurt, though I’d check with someone more knowledgeable. In any case, I’ve found around 300 hours to be the ‘aha’ moment for the Orange. Those hours will be continuous, as long as power to the gear remains continuous.
Thanks for the response, there are particular circuit implimentations where fast blow are needed for various reasons. Depending on application and the availablity of the SR line up 25-50% + works. Manufacturers will almost always admonish this practice though. So most of us will be on our own.
It would be nice if SR would build a fuse that works and lasts like Bussman, or Littlefuse or Schurter.... those companies have solid engineering in place over decades- the technology is mature and variables and parameters are well known.
I spent a good part of my early career in engineering looking at failure modes of equipment and fuse fatigue
I am all for fuses and protection or else I would have soldered a wire across connectors years ago.... I was able to get replacements through the good relationship of distributor and as a good client. Not everyone may have this service.
Agree about 300hrs ---not always equal for all equipment. The Io which consumes about 800watts power consumption took longer than other pieces of equipment at significantly less consumption
Yes, it’s surprising that SR isn’t meeting industry standards, certification or not, as it seems most or all of the other aftermarket fuse companies are developing to spec.
For my Supratek preamp, the developer says 2A, provides 3.15A and the instructions say a max of 4A. Not all rectifier tubes start at the same pace. A 2.5A that was working fine blew when I added a set of RCA ICs. So with an SR Orange, I’m looking for 4A or maybe a 5A for that location.
Why would more power consumption lead to longer burn in time? I’m especially interested because a 6.3A Orange is arriving today and I’m wondering whether to start it in the preamp or the Regenerator, where it’s meant for. The latter has eight power cords drawing for other equipment.
Let me know what values you settle with. I tired some Furutech fuses and they died a rather quick death in my Io Signature. I have remained with the stock fuses. Expensive experiment.
@dan31 I use the SB 3.15amp slow blow SR... these are the size I used in the blue variation and now in the orange as well. Once I changed to the 3.15a for the blues I had no issues - I ordered the same size for the Orange ... so far so good in the Io.
Specified value for the Io is 2a SB for the B+ and 2a SB for the Heaters.-- 4 in all for 2 supplies.
Its my amps that have been a problem with the oranges... have not hit the right equation yet.
Seems like those fuses complicate things quite a bit.
In a world where we have already enough problems ,lol .
Doesnt that limit the listening expirience , when you constanly have to worry that a fuse will blow.
I would think Kcin's circumstance isn't the majority experience. Over the years, I've only had one fuse blow, and that happened a week or two ago when I took a working situation and hooked up a second pair of ICs to burn in, not realizing that would send the start up surge beyond what the fuse could handle. Perhaps not coincidentally, that was an SR fuse. I would say the key is to know your equipment, what the developer thinks, read and ask questions of other users, and know about the fuse brand you are choosing. For example, with tube equipment, it's important to know if the rectifier, for example, is a slow starter or takes a big surge. I don't think it's normally as much a consideration with SS. Generally, if you have the spec right and know whether you can trust the fuse spec or need to adjust, you're clear, no worry. It does help, though, to have something in between the wall and components, such as a regenerator or conditioner.
On the small sample size of 6 enthusiasts locally 4 of us had fuses that blew from SR.. Additionally, the dealer that sold them to us as a the initiator blew his first samples as well. So, 5 of 7 .
Hardly scientific, although something to watch for. When you do get them correct and you do allow for the burn in, they do improve the sound as explained above to my ears. Asking about return, exchange policy with regard to this might be something I would inquire about along with recommendations for de-rating.
Having said all that, a very inexpensive tweak all positive for far less money and far more impact than any set of cables or even tube changes in some positions in my set up and those among the group here.
I was actually looking at my fuse socket and started measuring out the space to remove the socket and replace it with a miniature magnetic circuit breaker.
I have just received two of the Audio Magic Ultimate Premiers which replaced the Audio Magic Ultimates, the previous highest level fuses from them. These are beyond spectacular. I have only fried one of their fuses, but it was my fault not theirs. Highly recommended.
You would think that straight wire without any fuse should sound better than with any fuse at all, just as you would think that a power cable direct from the wall should be better than with any power conditioner placed between the wall and the component. But, I think it is a matter of whether or not the inserted device offers more in the way of improvements than any detriments brought on by the additional parts and connections etc. So is it possible that a mere fuse can deliver more in the way of improvements than straight wire? I would answer resoundingly in the affirmative. But there’s a caveat: the system needs to have achieved some critical mass in terms of its ability to resolve very fine differences. I think we would all agree that putting a $240 fuse in a $300 receiver may not deliver an appreciable improvement whereas inserting the same fuse in a highly resolving system could bring it to unimagined heights of glory. I don’t say that lightly. I have experienced these differences firsthand many times as I am sure many, if not all here have.
So what could this fuse be doing that is having such a profound effect? I don’t know what the manufacturer would say, but I would conjecture that it is either filtering out high frequency noise or detrimental vibrational elements or both. People often ask the question: with miles and miles of polluted powerlines delivering power to your home why should one meter of cable between the wall and the system matter in the least. I would answer that if you live in a region where the water supply is heavily polluted you had damn well better have competent filtering system for your drinking water.
Finally, I will mention my idea I call ”the myth of diminishing returns”. Simply stated the more highly resolving the system becomes through the sum total of its upgrades the more impact smaller and smaller changes will have. Each new upgrade leverages every one that went before. And as far as I can tell there is no end to this process, no final state where we can say that a system cannot improve further.
The theory goes ... A generic fuse is designed for one purpose, to open if more current goes through it than designed to handle. As current demand fluctuates, the fuse metal has to change with it. With increased current, the fuse wire gets warmer and the election flow is hampered by increased resistance in the wire. The fuse vibrates and produces noise as the electrons excite the metal wire. With the fancy audio fuse, attention is paid to the type of metals that are used in the fuse wire and there is lower resonance and resistance change to the metal as its temperature increases. In turn, less noise is produced and transferred to current passing through the fuse. Less noise, cleaner audio. Or so they say.
The guy who designed my preamp uses a circuit breaker. He tried both and finds a CB performs better. Has anyone actually tried a CB?
I have no doubt a purpose built fuse performs better than a glass fuse. I have no idea if a purpose built fuse performs better than a CB.
Thermistors (thermal fuses) perform a similar function. I don’t know why more designs don’t use them as it eliminates the fuse holder as well as the fuse itself.
