Aurender N200 vs N20 Impressions So Far...

[Polyrhythm9]

I've had a chance to listen to the N200 and N20 back to back for 4 days.

I've used the N200 for about a year and have been very impressed. So, having been very impressed with the sound quality and ease of use with the Conductor app, I thought going to the N20 would bring an even higher sound quality.


-N20

Connected with AES and USB

I immediately noticed a larger soundstage, and more separation of instruments. The soundstage is a bit wider , taller, and deeper. There seems to be a bit more detail compared to the N200, but this slight increase in detail isn't jumping out at you.

I am noticing that the top end (treble) is a little recessed compared to the N200. There seems to be less sparkle to cymbals. Just a bit less upper frequency 'sheen' on the overall presentation.



-Going back to the N200.

Connected with USB

The soundstage gets just a bit smaller, and instruments aren't quite as separated compared to the N20. The upper frequency 'sparkle' is back though, which is something that I do enjoy. Cymbals seem more present /clear and the overall presentation is a bit more 'spotlit'.


If there was a way to combine the N20's larger soundstage, and separation of instruments with the N200's more 'spotlit' presentation-this would be ideal for my taste!!!


QUESTION:

Will the upper frequency (treble) presentation become more 'spotlit' and extended with burn in time? (I have only had the N20 for 4 days)


thank you!

 

[thomask]

I've had a chance to listen to the N200 and N20 back to back for 4 days.

I've used the N200 for about a year and have been very impressed. So, having been very impressed with the sound quality and ease of use with the Conductor app, I thought going to the N20 would bring an even higher sound quality.


-N20

Connected with AES and USB

I immediately noticed a larger soundstage, and more separation of instruments. The soundstage is a bit wider , taller, and deeper. There seems to be a bit more detail compared to the N200, but this slight increase in detail isn't jumping out at you.

I am noticing that the top end (treble) is a little recessed compared to the N200. There seems to be less sparkle to cymbals. Just a bit less upper frequency 'sheen' on the overall presentation.



-Going back to the N200.

Connected with USB

The soundstage gets just a bit smaller, and instruments aren't quite as separated compared to the N20. The upper frequency 'sparkle' is back though, which is something that I do enjoy. Cymbals seem more present /clear and the overall presentation is a bit more 'spotlit'.


If there was a way to combine the N20's larger soundstage, and separation of instruments with the N200's more 'spotlit' presentation-this would be ideal for my taste!!!


QUESTION:

Will the upper frequency (treble) presentation become more 'spotlit' and extended with burn in time? (I have only had the N20 for 4 days)


thank you!

After being impressed with N20 at home audition, I bought N30.

But the difference between N30 and 20 is rather small.

N 30 give little bit of more sparkle and details.

The reason you felt N200 give more sparkle could be due to connection or digital cable.

You may play around different cables and connection method.

Overalll N20 is a very nice server for the price.

 

[VoicesInMyHead]

I've had a chance to listen to the N200 and N20 back to back for 4 days.

I've used the N200 for about a year and have been very impressed. So, having been very impressed with the sound quality and ease of use with the Conductor app, I thought going to the N20 would bring an even higher sound quality.


-N20

Connected with AES and USB

I immediately noticed a larger soundstage, and more separation of instruments. The soundstage is a bit wider , taller, and deeper. There seems to be a bit more detail compared to the N200, but this slight increase in detail isn't jumping out at you.

I am noticing that the top end (treble) is a little recessed compared to the N200. There seems to be less sparkle to cymbals. Just a bit less upper frequency 'sheen' on the overall presentation.



-Going back to the N200.

Connected with USB

The soundstage gets just a bit smaller, and instruments aren't quite as separated compared to the N20. The upper frequency 'sparkle' is back though, which is something that I do enjoy. Cymbals seem more present /clear and the overall presentation is a bit more 'spotlit'.


If there was a way to combine the N20's larger soundstage, and separation of instruments with the N200's more 'spotlit' presentation-this would be ideal for my taste!!!


QUESTION:

Will the upper frequency (treble) presentation become more 'spotlit' and extended with burn in time? (I have only had the N20 for 4 days)


thank you!

As already mentioned you should probably use spdif/aes with N20 for best result, this is also one of the key differences with the ocxo clock in the N20 vs N200. It's of course a combination with your DAC, so maybe one can't say that you should _always_ do this or that, but from an N20 perspective, the spdif/aes output would normally be the preferred output.

The Aurender sends signal on all outputs at once, I just tested to switch between them on my DAC with both spdif and usb connected. I'm clearly preferring spdif in my setup (LampizatOr DAC). Both my usb and spdif cables are Sablon Audio. I've always been a usb guy, but when I bought the N20 I decided to go spdif.

 

[ecwl]

QUESTION:

Will the upper frequency (treble) presentation become more 'spotlit' and extended with burn in time? (I have only had the N20 for 4 days)

I see you’re using Chord DAVE as your DAC. It is a pretty weird DAC to optimize IMHO even though I love mine.

If you don’t need >96kHz source, the reference (best IMHO) sound with DAVE is actually with Toslink.
If you’re playing 44.1kHz sources, the HF filter ideally should be off. Anything higher in sample rate, HF filter ideally should be on. Of course you may have your own preferences.

Once you introduce a streamer via AES/S/PDIF/USB, it’s a bit unpredictable what sound you’ll get without trial and error because Chord DACs in general is more jitter immune than most other DACs out there but it tends to be more transparent to the amount of RF noise you’re injecting into the AES/S/PDIF/USB digital input despite lots of filtering. And the noise tends to tweak the sound a little, sometimes to your liking, sometimes not.

If you still have the N20 to try, just take the cheap Toslink cable from your DAVE box and plug it between N20 and DAVE and remove all the other digital cables (so no noise can get from the Aurender to DAVE) and see if you like the sound. You will have to ask the Aurender to downsample the music to 96kHz or less. Some Toslink cables can handle 192kHz, if Aurender can. But I found it to be a little bit unreliable as I had it working and then I moved my cable a little and it stopped working.

 

[Polyrhythm9]

This is truly a great forum- I thank you for your comments!

Thomask--- based on your suggestion I changed cables from AES to USB on the N20. With the USB connection - the air including upper frequency extension came back to close to the N200 with USB connection. The details seem to have more attack with USB on the N20, which I do like.

VoicesInMyHead and ecwl - I did some searching last night to find Rob Watts comments (creator of Chord DAVE) and he said that the best connection to use on the Chord DAVE is USB by a small margin? Who knows, I will try the toslink connection to see what sound difference this connection will bring as well.

 

[ecwl]

This is truly a great forum- I thank you for your comments!

Thomask--- based on your suggestion I changed cables from AES to USB on the N20. With the USB connection - the air including upper frequency extension came back to close to the N200 with USB connection. The details seem to have more attack with USB on the N20, which I do like.

VoicesInMyHead and ecwl - I did some searching last night to find Rob Watts comments (creator of Chord DAVE) and he said that the best connection to use on the Chord DAVE is USB by a small margin? Who knows, I will try the toslink connection to see what sound difference this connection will bring as well.

Watts Up...? | Page 247 | Headphone Reviews and Discussion - Head-Fi.org

This is probably the best summary. If you run your USB via battery powered laptop/iPad that is not charging, then you can get sound similar to Toslink. Once you have a grounded device like the Aurender, your Aurender power supply can potentially leak some ground RF noise through the USB cable into the DAVE power supply back to ground.

 

[Polyrhythm9]

Interesting- I'm going to try and find the toslink cable and give it a try.

 

[Polyrhythm9]

I found the toslink cable included with the DAVE and tried it. This DOES sound much more clear compared to the AES and USB.

I was surprised with the increase in clarity. It has more air, and more upper frequency extension also.

And then the connection started failing! The signal on the DAVE started flickering and audible pops were coming out. I've never experienced this before with a connection on the DAVE. Apparently. its a known issue with the DAVE optical input connection! Frustrating because the sound with the toslink is incredible...There must be a way to remedy this!

 

[ecwl]

And then the connection started failing! The signal on the DAVE started flickering and audible pops were coming out. I've never experienced this before with a connection on the DAVE. Apparently. its a known issue with the DAVE optical input connection! Frustrating because the sound with the toslink is incredible...There must be a way to remedy this!

There are two optical inputs for DAVE. And as long as you’re playing 44.1kHz-96kHz tracks, it shouldn’t drop. If one jack truly is unreliable, you can try another.

However, there are some Toslink cables that don’t insert fully into DAVE because DAVE Toslink jack is quite shallow. So you have to make sure the cable is fully plugged into DAVE and Aurender. This was why I recommended the cheap cable in your DAVE box. But even then, you need to make sure it’s fully inserted into DAVE with a click. Remember Toslink cable plug is asymmetrical so there is only one correct position to insert it and you should gently insert the cable until it clicks into the jack.

 

[Polyrhythm9]

I did try to connect to the 2nd optical input on DAVE and it didn't seem to receive any data strangely. I will try to reconnect in optical 1 and make sure it's 44.1/96.

I wonder if trying a few other optical cords would be worth seeing if the connection is more engaged? That sound from optical was really impressive-it was more transparent, and more coherent.

 

[ecwl]

I did try to connect to the 2nd optical input on DAVE and it didn't seem to receive any data strangely. I will try to reconnect in optical 1 and make sure it's 44.1/96.

I wonder if trying a few other optical cords would be worth seeing if the connection is more engaged? That sound from optical was really impressive-it was more transparent, and more coherent.

if you want 176-192kHz, I find KableDirekt Toslink cable that Rob Watts recommended to be useful. Assuming your Aurender supports it. And it’s fairly cheap on Amazon.

You can see in my profile that I use a USB to Toslink converter Douk Audio U2 XU208. it is also fairly cheap that you can just add to your N200 instead of buying the N20. You can even get the U2 Pro which has USB-A instead of USB-C. Total cost is $70 including cable on Amazon to try.

I can’t remember if you have to select Toslink output in Aurender or whether all the digital outputs are always on.

 

[Polyrhythm9]

Great information ecwl. I ordered a KableDirekt from Amazon, and it is cheap-especially compared to other types of cables! Hopefully this will do the trick.

I'll try the USB to toslink converter if this doesn't work. If the new cable works-it's game over for my 'ideal' sound. Again, the difference WITH toslink was fairly incredible sonically.

Thank you for these suggestions!

 

[Polyrhythm9]

After guidance from you all (thank you!), I am able to get the 'air' and high frequency extension back with the N20. The N20 now combines a larger soundstage, better instrument separation, with as much upper frequency extension as you could ask for (these ears anyway). So, here's how:

1, It turns out that the Chord DAVE is very particular with digital connections, and a toslink (optical) connection with the Aurender N20 seems to provide significantly more air, clarity, and detail (ecwl) compared to both AES and USB connections. This was particularly noticeable with tosllink vs AES connection. The AES connection darkened the sound, and rounded the edges too much- it took some of the liveliness away- and that was my first impression with the N20. That's no longer the case.

2. Also, the Chord DAVE DB setting on its standard -3DB setting in 'DAC mode' can be too much for a Preamp and may overdrive, or clip it. So, lowering the DB setting to -11DB with XLR cables in 'Preamp mode' improved the sound SIGNIFICANTLY as well. (hopefully this is understandable).

I can now say that the jump to N20 IS worth it IMHO, and the DAC connection/settings were crucial to realizing its sonic abilities.

Next up is trying RCA cables vs XLR from the DAVE to Preamp!