Brinkmann 10.5 - How would you describe its sound?

Loheswaran

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2014
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Smart little group Walrus--them and Cornflake were/still are, probably the original"boutique" Audio outlets in the big Smoke!.

Yes LW is correct on the cartridge aspect plus accounting for maybe bit of tongue in cheek;)--no measure in promoting an Arm you cannot obtain anymore-fair enough he is entitle to his opinion.

Last correspondence I had with Herr Breuer was about 10 years ago when he posted me a replacement loom for an Arm. he never encompassed the "modern " world with no Website/etc plus contact by mail only for customers outside of Switzerland.

You may have a point on timeline -all my ones were the Gold Tubing 5A's and 10's--I have not heard the black (coated?)versions.

The Fletcher MDC800 is an excellent Arm-- deserved of Cult status-easily the best thing Sumiko ever promoted:cool:!

Good luck in your quest,

BruceD
Hi Bruce

Cornflake are going strong but major on installations for the London Nouveau Riche

Walrus closed down. I heard that Les was a food vlogger but I can’t confirm it.

going off thread he said the basis vector 4 was very good and didn’t even sell it.

I would love a Breuer if one came up but they are very rare and valued

with 2 young kids my audio spending has had to be curtailed of late
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
14,625
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E. England
The Durand Tosca I'm sure is a great arm, but it is above my budget. I really don't want to spend more than around the price of the Brinkmann, less if possible.

A linear tracker is not really what I am looking for either - aesthetically I find them unappealing, particularly on an idler.

Thanks for the suggestions, however.

I am not in the US, but I may email Chris at Artisan Fidelity to get his views, although I am unlikely ever to be a customer of his.
Hi Ross, respect your skepticism re LT arms on idlers, but I'm successfully running an air LT on rim drive TT, indeed the rim drive TT that I'm using was predicated on the same designer's LT arm concept.
I'm skeptical of the idea of synergy in audio, but there does seem to be a "rightness" in this combination's sound.
 

rossb

Well-Known Member
May 24, 2017
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Thanks for your thoughts. I'm sure LT arms are very good, and they certainly have some inherent advantages. My objections are purely aesthetic, rather than anything else.

Since I posted my initial questions I have bought a Schroder CB-9, and am waiting for a new armboard to arrive, which is about a week away. I will post some impressions on it when I have set it up.
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
14,625
5,434
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E. England
Thanks for your thoughts. I'm sure LT arms are very good, and they certainly have some inherent advantages. My objections are purely aesthetic, rather than anything else.

Since I posted my initial questions I have bought a Schroder CB-9, and am waiting for a new armboard to arrive, which is about a week away. I will post some impressions on it when I have set it up.
Ah, well re aesthetics it was always gonna be unlikely we fancied the same people lol.
 

rossb

Well-Known Member
May 24, 2017
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148
Time to update this thread.

The Schroder CB-9 arrived a month or so ago, and was installed on my PTP Solid 9 along with the cartridge I am currently using, an Ortofon Jubilee. (I still prefer the Jubilee to my Windfeld Ti.)

The Schroder lasted a couple of weeks, and I ended up returning it to the dealer, who was very helpful and accommodating.

Unfortunately, the Schroder arm did not work out. It was a combination of ergonomics, installation issues and, ultimately, sound quality which resulted in my returning it.

Aside from the bearing, on which I cannot comment, the design of the arm seems a bit odd. The mounting collar is held to the armboard by a single bolt, which means that the arm can rotate on that bolt, no matter how tightly it is installed. The counterweight is quite large and heavy, and its shape means that not only do you need to position it correctly along the shaft to get the correct VTF, at the same time you need to keep it perfectly vertical which is very difficult in practice. The weight of the counterweight means that setting VTF precisely is extremely difficult, since small changes of around 0.25mm can result in overshooting by at least 0.5g in either direction. So getting the correct tracking force as well as ensuring the counterweight is perpendicular is far more laborious and time consuming than it needs to be.

There is no finger lift or arm rest (although there is an arm lift) which means that handling the arm is a little bit more awkward than ideal. It was said that this was for sound quality reasons, but it could just as easily because it would have been difficult to incorporate these into the design.

Cartridge set up is also a challenge. My Ortofon cartridges are far from unusual in their dimensions, but I could only get the cartridge close to accurately installed using my Feickert protractor by having it extended in the headshell area as far as possible, and rotated as much as possible. Even so, it was a fraction of a milimetre and a fraction of a degree short of perfect. (And, yes, I did check that the pivot to spindle distance was correct, which it was. In fact, I re-installed the arm at least 3 times to see if I was doing something wrong.)

All of these factors could be forgiven if it sounded amazing. Which it didn't. It wasn't so much that it wasn't the improvement over my Audio Origami arm that I was looking for. It actually sounded worse than my AO arm. The sound was somewhat thin, noticeably coloured and lacked dynamic impact and density. On the plus side, bass was deep and it sounded fast. But it was a distinctive sound which I didn't care for.

Having owned a number of good arms over the years - an SME IV, Morch DP-6, Kuzma Stogi Ref, 313 VTA and 4 Point, all versions of the Linn Ekos (including the SE) and a number of others, as well as my current Audio Origami - the Schroder was the outlier in terms of sound character. I even preferred my Rega RB2000 when I briefly installed it after the Schroder.

In retrospect, I am not sure why I was looking to replace the Audio Origami arm. It is a superb arm. I preferred it to the (much more expensive) Kuzma 4 Point. It is easy to set up and sounds excellent. I was probably just going through one of those moments of boredom when we become fixated on the idea of replacing a specific component, even though it is perfectly fine or, in this case, excellent.

In fact, after reinstalling the Audio Origami arm and spending some more time optimising the cartridge set up, and then replacing the tubes in my Nagra VPS phono stage with some NOS Tung Sols, I am getting the best vinyl sound I have ever had in my system, so in that sense the journey has been worth it.

Thanks to all who contributed to this thread. While this particular change didn't work out, I appreciate all the help and suggestions, and hearing something different and having the opportunity to re-evaluate what you already have is always a valuable experience.





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Solypsa

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Jun 7, 2017
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www.solypsa.com
@rossb which version AO arm? PU7 titanium?
 

rossb

Well-Known Member
May 24, 2017
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PU7, standard version. I opted not to get the titanium version because I didn't like the two tone look of the titanium, and I was familiar with the standard PU7 having owned one previously and I knew what to expect. J7 at AO told me that he thought the titanium version was maybe a tad faster but did not really hear much difference between them.

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Loheswaran

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2014
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@rossb
I am astonished with ur experience with the Schroeder. I heard a DPS and a Platine and both were superb.
Next time ur selling an arm let me know.
That aside it’s good to hear a different perspective
 

mtemur

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Mar 26, 2019
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Having owned a number of good arms over the years - an SME IV, Morch DP-6, Kuzma Stogi Ref, 313 VTA and 4 Point, all versions of the Linn Ekos (including the SE) and a number of others, as well as my current Audio Origami - the Schroder was the outlier in terms of sound character. I even preferred my Rega RB2000 when I briefly installed it after the Schroder.
You payed for experience which happens to everybody in this hobby. More importantly you haven’t stick to a mistake and move back in favor of better sound.
 

Kinn

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2021
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Thanks for sharing your experience on Schroeder CB tonearm. It is a tonearm that I am interested in, will look out for the “thin” sound that you experienced.

Having heard Linn Ekos SE and Audio Origami PU7, I can gather what kind of sound presentation you enjoy.

Noticed you’d changed your turntable to PTP, have fun!
 

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