Constellation Audio Centaur

[asiufy]

Aren't we getting in dangerous territory here? Remember when wizard posted inside pics of the FMA amps, and people found them "too simple"?

Obviously everybody wants a neat and good looking amp, inside and out. But it's like great measurements, it's a "nice to have", but what matters in the end is the sound.

I remember a similar thread in a local forum, when someone posted the internals of an expensive GamuT amp. Coincidentally, people compared it to the internals of a beefy Xindak amp. Having heard both, I know which one I'd buy, and it's not the chinese brand


alexandre

 

[andromedaaudio]

I believe good/clever quality design and soundquality go hand in hand , plus the fact that it is perfectly understandable for a buyer to want to know what makes a product so expensive , in the audiophile world there is a lot of hocus pocus around and i believe advantage is taken from that ,whether intentionally or not .

 

[MylesBAstor]

I believe good/clever quality design and soundquality go hand in hand , plus the fact that it is perfectly understandable for a buyer to want to know what makes a product so expensive , in the audiophile world there is a lot of hocus pocus around and i believe advantage is taken from that ,whether intentionally or not .

Yes but are they a 'properly' designed amp?

 

[andromedaaudio]

So you re kinda like saying , they might have figured out a certain circuit that sounds better than for example boulder with lesser building costs , but because they compete in that pricerange , they have to make the price the same even if the buildingcost are a lot less , remember this is all hypothetically speaking , to make it a" believable" audiophile product.


Well, ..... i pass
Cables are the worst , then CD players

 

[MylesBAstor]

So you re kinda like saying , they might have figured out a certain circuit that sounds better than for example boulder with lesser building costs , but because they compete in that pricerange , they have to make the price the same even if the buildingcost are a lot less , remember this is all hypothetically speaking , to make it a believeble audiophile product.

Well, ..... i pass
Cables are the worst , then CD players

No I think they're saying that you don't need measurements anymore. All you need to do is pop the hood. It's always amazing to me that everyone knows more than the designer.

 

[FrantzM]

So you re kinda like saying , they might have figured out a certain circuit that sounds better than for example boulder with lesser building costs , but because they compete in that pricerange , they have to make the price the same even if the buildingcost are a lot less , remember this is all hypothetically speaking , to make it a" believable" audiophile product.


Well, ..... i pass
Cables are the worst , then CD players

You may have nailed it


Alexandre in what system did you compare the Chinese amp to the other? Same system? Same Room? Same speakers?

 

[opus111]

I remember a similar thread in a local forum, when someone posted the internals of an expensive GamuT amp. Coincidentally, people compared it to the internals of a beefy Xindak amp. Having heard both, I know which one I'd buy, and it's not the chinese brand

Xindak amps have nice quality parts in them - for example JFET input stage and lateral FET drivers - and generally speaking the mechanics are nice too. They're just not very adept at putting them all together to sound great. Which makes them an excellent choice for modders - I got my baby Xindak integrated (A06) to really sing with some layout and circuit tweaks.

 

[asiufy]

No, different systems, but both set up by the respective brands' importer, so it wasn't someone mix'n'matching at random. The Xindak was setup with Thiel 2.4 (and Xindak pre), and the GamuT was all-GamuT, with the old GamuT Phi bookshelves.
Notice I didn't say either one was bad. Just that looks don't tell the whole story, same as measurements don't tell the whole story.
Unlike the Emotiva, I think the Xindak was (more than) worth its price, as the finish was decent, and the sound was very good also, and the price extremely reasonable.


alexandre

 

[microstrip]

Is it only me or anyone else also feels disappointed by those internals ? The amps looks gorgeous on the outside, and one would expect the internals to be equally impressive, but the amp looks quite oridinaty inside. They should definately keep them dressed up

We can feel the opposite - if something looking so ordinary inside sounds so good, it means that there is something exceptional about the electronic design. I know electronic components can be very cheap - I do not feel impressed by dozens of electrolytic capacitors or many large transformers! But as many others I love to see pictures from the inside of equipment. Pure audio voyeurism!

 

[NorthStar]

I've heard it albeit in a completely unfamiliar system and show conditions at that. If it were a Doctor it was following the Hippocratic oath, it did no wrong. If I were offered a chance to try it at home, I wouldn't turn that offer down.

Bob, it's in the 20k range IIRC.

---- Thx Jack; seems a bit overpriced to me.

 

[NorthStar]

That Emotiva amp is $1,449.00 in retail

---- ...Less, when on sale. :b ...Actually $1,279.00 right now.
=> http://shop.emotiva.com/products/xpr1

______________

...And the Constellation Audio Centaur is $20,000. :b ...But then, it must sound mucho bettero.

______________

Build quality; how can we really tell the sound by a simple interior peek?
I am totally certain that a $20,000 stereo amp sounds much better than a 'simple' $1,279 monoblock amp ($2,558/pair).

 

[NorthStar]

I believe good/clever quality design and soundquality go hand in hand , plus the fact that it is perfectly understandable for a buyer to want to know what makes a product so expensive , in the audiophile world there is a lot of hocus pocus around and i believe advantage is taken from that ,whether intentionally or not .

---- Yes, and furthermore; internal quality parts IMPLEMENTATION, along with solid external build.

 

[NorthStar]

Aren't we getting in dangerous territory here? Remember when wizard posted inside pics of the FMA amps, and people found them "too simple"?

Obviously everybody wants a neat and good looking amp, inside and out. But it's like great measurements, it's a "nice to have", but what matters in the end is the sound.

I remember a similar thread in a local forum, when someone posted the internals of an expensive GamuT amp. Coincidentally, people compared it to the internals of a beefy Xindak amp. Having heard both, I know which one I'd buy, and it's not the chinese brand


alexandre

---- Alex, what's wrong with "chinese brand"? :b

 

[NorthStar]

Xindak amps have nice quality parts in them - for example JFET input stage and lateral FET drivers - and generally speaking the mechanics are nice too. They're just not very adept at putting them all together to sound great. Which makes them an excellent choice for modders - I got my baby Xindak integrated (A06) to really sing with some layout and circuit tweaks.

---- Richard, what do you think of MOSFET design amplifiers?
{Got one of those in storage, and it has a very sweet sound; read 'smooth' and easy for the ears, and soul.} :b

 

[puroagave]

i heard the constellation gear driving the magico s5 at last year’s Newport show and it was easily in my top 5 of best sounding rooms.

i once had a fascination (obsession?) at peeking under the hood of everything that passed through my listening room. i was guided by some good techs that showed me what to look for/at and guess what, there was little correlation between the insides and how it sounded. case in point early VTL stuff looked like it was made at home on the kitchen table. the chassis were rough and ill-fitting, the artwork for pcbs looked hand drawn with a sharpie. little or no attention was paid to efficient layout (ever heard of autoCAD?) the solder flux was left on the boards, in general it looked sloppy yet it was some of the most fabulous sounding gear i owned at the time.

 

[NorthStar]

i heard the constellation gear driving the magico s5 at last year’s Newport show and it was easily in my top 5 of best sounding rooms.

i once had a fascination (obsession?) at peeking under the hood of everything that passed through my listening room. i was guided by some good techs that showed me what to look for/at and guess what, there was little correlation between the insides and how it sounded. case in point early VTL stuff looked like it was made at home in someone’s garage. the chassis were rough and ill-fitting, the artwork for pcbs looked hand drawn with a sharpie. little or no attention was paid to efficient layout (ever heard of autoCAD?) the solder flux was left on the boards, in general it looked sloppy yet it was some of the most fabulous sounding gear i owned at the time.

---- Rob, you just scored one point there. :b

* BTW, I'm like you; I open ALL my electronic components, even my musical instruments (guitar amplifiers, mikes, guitars with interchangeable 'arms', electronic pedals, etc.), ... amps, preamps, CD/SACD players, BD players, cable connectors, etc.
I analyse all the parts and their sum. I read everything there is available to read (I go to places where others don't have any idea), and at the end I just try to make some wise choices (listening sessions included of course).

I ain't no audiophile expert, just an audio anal maniac with a musical passion.
I wish that I coud listen to all the electronics of the world, but I ain't immortal.

And everything I do, I do with with my deep passion for the music, for the art, and with all my heart and my own financial resources and knowledge.
The rest, I learn from you guys. :b

 

[andromedaaudio]

""" I ain't no audiophile expert, just an audio anal maniac with a musical passion.
I wish that I coud listen to all the electronics of the world, but I ain't immortal.""


Youre quite funny northstar, but.... since when are audiophiles experts??? " joke "

I am a factory mechanic by trade and taking apart machinery is my daily business , i like them something like the boulder nothing flimsy about that ," the last thing i want is also my stereo breaking down " in my free time )

 

[NorthStar]

-- Well, da was only a precision of only one type of audiophiles.

Audiophiles come in all classes, and levels of differentiation. :b
Not two are alike.

 

[Part-Time Audiophile]

i heard the constellation gear driving the magico s5 at last year’s Newport show and it was easily in my top 5 of best sounding rooms.

I heard this combo too, and it was likewise one of my favorites.

 

[KBK]

No I think they're saying that you don't need measurements anymore. All you need to do is pop the hood. It's always amazing to me that everyone knows more than the designer.

I, on the other hand, only need to pop the hood and take a look around, for a while, and then give a pronouncement of what the given amplifier will sound like. In most cases, I'll be correct. This only comes with much practice and single cause analysis in parts and aspects of design and execution.

Measurements tell little of how any amplifier sounds, said measurements being of an engineering and numerical orientation..and not being targeted toward what is important to the human ear. The measurements can tell the sound of the amp, but only if the measuring person is familiar with all the things I mentioned about popping the hood, and they are familiar with the fine details of how the ear works.

(I was just conversing with one of the Constellation design folks yesterday, which got me to searching them out on the interwebz)