Emm labs DA2 v2 upgrade

[George K]

For the past 3 months I am listening to the DA-2 mostly on my dealer's setup and for a few days on my system.
I can say it's the best digital I've ever heard hands down. I use to have dCS gear for many years and I am planning to trade-in my Rossini with the DA-2 soon. Can't be without it.

I think maybe the 100K+ MSB is the only competitor but then again the $$$$$ are 2 much.

Digital is at its better days!

I wish I could also afford the matching transport.

 

[Yuen A.]

For the past 3 months I am listening to the DA-2 mostly on my dealer's setup and for a few days on my system.
I can say it's the best digital I've ever heard hands down. I use to have dCS gear for many years and I am planning to trade-in my Rossini with the DA-2 soon. Can't be without it.

I think maybe the 100K+ MSB is the only competitor but then again the $$$$$ are 2 much.

Digital is at its better days!

I wish I could also afford the matching transport.

Hi George K,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the DA2. Please tell us a bit more about the EMM DA2 vss Rossini. Thanks.

 

[awsmone]

For the past 3 months I am listening to the DA-2 mostly on my dealer's setup and for a few days on my system.
I can say it's the best digital I've ever heard hands down. I use to have dCS gear for many years and I am planning to trade-in my Rossini with the DA-2 soon. Can't be without it.

I think maybe the 100K+ MSB is the only competitor but then again the $$$$$ are 2 much.

Digital is at its better days!

I wish I could also afford the matching transport.

It’s interersting that of people I know who have the DA2 not many mention the transport

I don’t have the transport, would love to own it, but at the price point , I cannot justify it

My DA2 is just singing these days, and I think more about cabling to and from it than the DA2 itself , pretty much run everything 2dsd into it

What are people using as USB cable? A Lan or hdmi input upgrade would be awesome!

 

[marty]

What are people using as USB cable? A Lan or hdmi input upgrade would be awesome!

Agree that LAN or HDMI would be a nice upgrade, particularly LAN.

As far as USB cables, I've tried several and I am most impressed with the Stealth Audio Select T. The placement of the filter is critical but rather easy to identify by moving it in 1/2 inch increments and listening for improvements. My filter is about 60% of the length from the computer to the DAC but YMMV. When it's right, the staging is remarkably good in spatial detail as well as timbre.

My sense is that you're either a dCS guy or you're not. I am not. Too sterile. The DA2 is more musical by far with a superior top end. (Perhaps I could be an MSB DAC guy, but my grandkid's college fund is the higher priority. (Besides, not sure i want to pay 100K for a DAC that the Moore's law of DACs suggest will surely be bettered in a few years at a far lower price.)

 

[asiufy]

You all know MSB makes the $40k MSB Reference, right? I keep seeing references to a $100k DAC, but the Reference, that I'm listening to right now, is an incredible product, and very much worth a listen.


cheers,
alex

 

[microstrip]

(...) My sense is that you're either a dCS guy or you're not. I am not. Too sterile. (...)

My opinion is that it is not about being a DCS guy or not - the question is having a system that can accept the DCS or not. Perhaps it is not a good match to your system - for example IMHO the Vivaldi prefers the new Wilson tweeters. But current DCS products are not intrinsically sterile - on the contrary they show enormous detail in a way it rebuilds the original envelopment of the recording in a very rich way.

 

[Yuen A.]

It’s interersting that of people I know who have the DA2 not many mention the transport

I don’t have the transport, would love to own it, but at the price point , I cannot justify it

My DA2 is just singing these days, and I think more about cabling to and from it than the DA2 itself , pretty much run everything 2dsd into it

What are people using as USB cable? A Lan or hdmi input upgrade would be awesome!

To me a transport is essential (I am using the Emm labs TSDX) because I listen exclusively to SACDs. I have a large collection of SACDs (approaching a thousand, mostly classical), and many of them sounded awesome thru the TSDX -DA2 (firmware upgraded) (all components on Critical Mass Systems maxxum racks) - Constellaton Audio Centaur - Magico Q1 and Magico Q- sub 15 subwoofer. For example, I was listening the Paul O'Brien's Long May You Sing album (Stockfisch SACD) recently, and it sounded so real, so palpable, every nuance could be heard!

 

[BMCG]

My opinion is that it is not about being a DCS guy or not - the question is having a system that can accept the DCS or not. Perhaps it is not a good match to your system - for example IMHO the Vivaldi prefers the new Wilson tweeters. But current DCS products are not intrinsically sterile - on the contrary they show enormous detail in a way it rebuilds the original envelopment of the recording in a very rich way.

i love the way in which music comes from my system: dcs/spectral/mit/avalons...what some decry as "sterile"

to my ears...and many (not all) of those who've parked themselves on my couch...the emotional connection is emphatic.

immersive...visceral...goosebump evoking..permagrin eliciting..

not : anodyne..sterile...etched...harsh.....

music comes from the system...not an individual component...

fettling/sculpting/choosing/trialing/connecting and above all listening...has arrived at an emotional experience that resonates/evokes/realises joy...

YMMV...

 

[Yuen A.]

My opinion is that it is not about being a DCS guy or not - the question is having a system that can accept the DCS or not. Perhaps it is not a good match to your system - for example IMHO the Vivaldi prefers the new Wilson tweeters. But current DCS products are not intrinsically sterile - on the contrary they show enormous detail in a way it rebuilds the original envelopment of the recording in a very rich way.

Hi microstrip

The fact that a DCS needs careful matching is itself an indication that it has the tendency towards sterility. The predisposition to favor one component over another is also dependent on what we listen to mostly. Those of us who listen to acoustic music (mostly) tend to prefer the tonal balance of the EMM Labs. It closely approximate what we hear at the concert halls.

 

[George K]

Replying on various commmets above, just my 2 cents:

dCS have great products like Vivaldi and MSB as well. I had and still have dCS gear for many years and I prefer the Music approach of the DA-2. Its more involving and has a "wholeness" or continuity as HP used to say. Rossini although it's great and "right" couldn't connect me with music and tempo as DA-2 did.

About its matching transport, I wish I could afford it. For the time being I use a dCS Puccini for transport.

About USB cables: my choice is Stealth Select like Marty. Power cord latest Stealth Dream and LAN cable Wireworld Cat8 with Artisitc fidelity GISO to my streamer.

 

[awsmone]

Thanks for your USB recommendations

I am not into criticising other equipment

However since I modified my speaker cabling for the Goldmund’s, the DA2 has gone to another level of micro detail, and organic flow

It’s truly extraordinary product

I am looking for a transport for my sacd collection

 

[Yuen A.]

Replying on various commmets above, just my 2 cents:

dCS have great products like Vivaldi and MSB as well. I had and still have dCS gear for many years and I prefer the Music approach of the DA-2. Its more involving and has a "wholeness" or continuity as HP used to say. Rossini although it's great and "right" couldn't connect me with music and tempo as DA-2 did.

About its matching transport, I wish I could afford it. For the time being I use a dCS Puccini for transport.

About USB cables: my choice is Stealth Select like Marty. Power cord latest Stealth Dream and LAN cable Wireworld Cat8 with Artisitc fidelity GISO to my streamer.

Hi George K,

Thank you so much for your thoughts on DA2 vs Rossini

The differences between most DACs and the DA2 are: With the DA2 you get a greater sense of dynamic ease, harmonic complexity, micro detail and it can pick up a lot of ambient resonance off the stage and hall.

 

[awsmone]

Hi George K,

Thank you so much for your thoughts on DA2 vs Rossini

The differences between most DACs and the DA2 are: With the DA2 you get a greater sense of dynamic ease, harmonic complexity, micro detail and it can pick up a lot of ambient resonance off the stage and hall.

Good summary, the harmonic complexity micro detail and ambience are excellent

 

[Yuen A.]

Good summary, the harmonic complexity micro detail and ambience are excellent

Thanks awsmone.

To test how good the DA2 is - listen to this SACD (or download/stream): Eine Alpensinfonie Richard Strauss, Sao Paulo Symphony Orchestra, Frank Shipway (BIS-1950) - esp. Track 18 (Calm Before the Storm) and Track 19 (Thunder and Tempest, Descent). A terrifying experience (play it loud) but yet the DA2 reproduced it with ease! (However, the rest of your sound system must be at the cutting edge)

 

[marty]

I am looking for a transport for my sacd collection

I use the TX2 but I can't tell you much about it other than it seems to be quite good feeding my DA2. One wonders if the "EMM link" is nothing more than an I2S connection and if so, would another transport work with the optical EMM link? Can you get the SACD output for other transports to feed the DA2 such as those from PS Audio or the excellent Oppo transport? My guess is that there are superb transport choices out there that cost far less than the TX2 but I have no experience in this area.

 

[Bar81]

I use the TX2 but I can't tell you much about it other than it seems to be quite good feeding my DA2. One wonders if the "EMM link" is nothing more than an I2S connection and if so, would another transport work with the optical EMM link? Can you get the SACD output for other transports to feed the DA2 such as those from PS Audio or the excellent Oppo transport? My guess is that there are superb transport choices out there that cost far less than the TX2 but I have no experience in this area.

Unless you could get a similar fiber optic connection, that would probably be difficult. And it certainly wouldn't be an OPPO or PS Audio in any case, something more along the lines of a TEAC mechanism further up the chain than the VOSP in the TX2. If you have a TX2, it's worth considering the Aural Symphonics Optimism Lotus cable as an upgrade over the EMM cable - much more open - and in the world of cables pricing is "reasonable".

 

[marty]

I don't know much about TEA transports. I thought the TX2 used their top transport. What is further up the line than the VOSP transport?

 

[awsmone]

I tried Oppo with st optical out, it didn’t work with me

When Emm labs etc used double st optical they were compatible is my understanding, but when Emm labs and PDS went to single cable they must have developed different protocols, even PDS has two different protocols for older and newer products...

I think TEAC keep their top version in House and don’t sell to anyone, the one they sell to Emm labs and DCS is not their top version, it’s possible in the past they did, but not now I believe for a long time..

 

[GSOphile]

Even if it worked, isn't there a DRM legal issue associated with using one manufacturer's transport to supply SACD input to another manufacturer's DAC?

 

[Bar81]

I don't know much about TEA transports. I thought the TX2 used their top transport. What is further up the line than the VOSP transport?

Everything; it's their lowest end transport. I've attached an old brochure from Esoteric to give you an idea.

View attachment TransportsEsoteric0408pq.pdf

It's not that it's a bad transport, far from it; it's just not one of those heroic TEAC transports you read about and that were in my old Wadia players for example. In any case, if the TX2 did actually use their top end transport, then it would be double the price - those TEAC assemblies used to sell for something like $5,000 in bulk 10 years ago, no idea what current price is with in inflation. Doesn't matter anyway as TEAC stopped selling them to third parties years ago and now no longer even sells the VOSP - that's the reason the TX2 is a limited edition (and why EMM Labs is unlikely to make any more transports or CD players) - EMM Labs essentially used their final units to make the TX2 (the production run is limited to 40 or 50 units, can't remember which - never to be produced again). DCS has had to, for example, develop an entirely new transport mechanism using a Denon optical pickup I believe for their Rossini transport in order to play SACD and even that's all plastic and nothing like the TEAC mid-level mechanism they used to use when TEAC still sold them such assemblies.