Hifinews review D'Agostino Momentum amp

[microstrip]

A PDF of the review is available from Absolute Sounds. There is a sentence by Miller about "fractionally high hum and noise in this early sample" in the measurements box. Reading the subjective report makes it plain that this was a problem that Mr. Kessler either failed to detect or failed to disclose.

Many excellent sounding amplifiers have similar noise specifications and, depending on the speakers efficiency, this can be difficult to detect in listening sessions. Also unless you have the noise spectra you can not conclude anything other than Miller wise sentence.

Miller used an AP measuring system. I do not have full the details about the test, but this type of noise due to a defective transformer screen will depend a lot on the earth connections of the system and the output impedance of the system driving the amplifier. You can have situations where, depending on the characteristics of preamplifier, you have hum and noise on the speakers in same situations and complete silence in others.

KK reports he used the Momentum with the Sophia 3 (87 dBW according to Wilson specifications) that have a small dip in FR at 50Hz (European mains) at 50 Hz in the Stereophile published reviews. Such level of hum could be difficult to detect in these conditions.

Dan Agostino kindly explained to this forum what happened. If the editor of Hifi News or Dan feel that this is a relevant issue he should ask for a second amplifier to repeat the measurements and publish the corrections in the the magazine.

 

[Orb]

True fishnchips,
but as I explained all reviewers have some kind of personal trait - meaning that their review still relies upon their tolerance and thresholds.
As I mentioned it seems to me KK is more laid back to noise than many others are, and this is something I have seen in other reviews, he is not deliberately misleading but this to me is an indication of perception bias-preference that all of us suffers and not necessarily in the same way.
Look at how many like-dislike the various amp-speaker-etc designs.
Regarding my comment relating to your statement:

Reading the subjective report makes it plain that this was a problem that Mr. Kessler either failed to detect or failed to disclose

As a subscriber you would know that any early samples are always mentioned, but there is no point in mentioning more than once, unless it affects the reviewer and noise is not one that does with KK, but it is not a problem if it is made clear in the measurements.

Relating to Hifinews, I think you will find they may had got the exclusive as I think it was the UK magazines and this distributor that highlighted Krell in the days before it even took off in the US.
If it is used at shows, then why not review it but mention it is early sample - but maybe this is a debate for a more general thread on that subject.
Anyway I doubt it will affect sales and probably give them a boost in terms of notice, the dealer I use already is setup to be a seller.

Thanks
Orb

 

[MylesBAstor]

True fishnchips,
but as I explained all reviewers have some kind of personal trait - meaning that their review still relies upon their tolerance and thresholds.
As I mentioned it seems to me KK is more laid back to noise than many others are, and this is something I have seen in other reviews, he is not deliberately misleading but this to me is an indication of perception bias-preference that all of us suffers and not necessarily in the same way.
Look at how many like-dislike the various amp-speaker-etc designs.
Regarding my comment relating to your statement:

As a subscriber you would know that any early samples are always mentioned, but there is no point in mentioning more than once, unless it affects the reviewer and noise is not one that does with KK, but it is not a problem if it is made clear in the measurements.

Relating to Hifinews, I think you will find they may had got the exclusive as I think it was the UK magazines and this distributor that highlighted Krell in the days before it even took off in the US.
If it is used at shows, then why not review it but mention it is early sample - but maybe this is a debate for a more general thread on that subject.
Anyway I doubt it will affect sales and probably give them a boost in terms of notice, the dealer I use already is setup to be a seller.

Thanks
Orb

Yes Riccardo of Absolute Sounds was one of Krell's best dealers and obviously picked up Dan's new line

 

[fishnchips]

Apparently you guys somehow know what Kessler can or cannot hear. I envy your powers, but I'm afraid we're on different pages.

 

[Orb]

I KNOW what he reports and see a trend when it comes to certain traits in equipment.
It is not complicated to correlate his reviews to measurements if you read many of that person's articles, one can work out trends.
This is applicable to all reviewers as long as they are consistent, which KK is along with a few others.

I appreciate you feel differently and have made it clear from the very beginning with your 1st post in this thread, so is there a need to continue this re-iteration of posting.
Thanks
Orb

 

[fishnchips]

He is consistent alright. He never finds any flaws in any gear. All he ever heaps on is praise, albeit in degrees: plain praise, lavish praise and transcedental praise. I guess this makes it really easy to work out "trends".

 

[kevinkwann]

He is consistent alright. He never finds any flaws in any gear. All he ever heaps on is praise, albeit in degrees: plain praise, lavish praise and transcedental praise. I guess this makes it really easy to work out "trends".

What? Are you suggesting critical thinking from an audio critic? That's heresy I tell you, heresy!

 

[cjfrbw]

He is consistent alright. He never finds any flaws in any gear. All he ever heaps on is praise, albeit in degrees: plain praise, lavish praise and transcedental praise. I guess this makes it really easy to work out "trends".

I thought the seance-ing of a deceased prominent audiophile was a nice touch, as if the deceased would automatically concur with KK's enthusiasm without reservation. That establishes a fluffy pedigree without cost or challenge.

 

[mauidan]

The real and only question is this: why did the EIC choose to publish a review where the product suffered from hum problems w/o sorting out the problem?

There's no other mysterious conspiracies here: basically, HFN was trying to scoop the world with a review of Dan's amplifier and had access to from the UK distributor.

And as Dan has told us, the problem is a problem no more.

+1

 

[Orb]

Not directed at devert-Myles but the other few last posts.
Guys please stay on topic as it is starting to get irritating that we are moving so far off track, if you really cannot let this go then open a new thread otherwise I will ask admins to cut-delete all posts after a certain point and for them to be dumped into a new thread with the name "Why must I re-iterate negative and possibly biased points that have nothing to do with the actual product thread"
As I mentioned before in this thread, if you have grief with the actual reviewer-reviewers start a new thread or update an existing one that is focused on that subject (plenty of them here).

Thank you
Orb

 

[fishnchips]

Ah, yes, threats. Truly "what's best in audio".

 

[Orb]

OMFG I just knew you could not let it lie fishnchips.
It is not a threat but trying to make you see freaking common sense and forum politeness.
I raised this thread for the Momentum, that you then continue to derail with your own diatribe, and being blunt your own bias as well (which can be seen after your 1st post in this thread relating to generic comments on reviewers).
It is funny how many intelligent-objective people never notice their own pride-prejudice, and bias....
Hopefully I can get posts from a certain point moved to a new thread, if so look for your most recent comments in there.
Thank you.

Orb

 

[fishnchips]

OMFG I just knew you could not let it lie fishnchips.
It is not a threat but trying to make you see freaking common sense and forum politeness.

Shouldn't this be "freaking" forum politeness, O Your Freakin' Gosh? (I suspect this is what your "OMFG" exclamation means). Worry not, dear friend, I'm not going to swear back at you, Gosh darn it. I'll start a new friggin' thread: http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showt...ic-flaws-in-audio-equipment&p=54237#post54237

 

[RBFC]

Unless someone has something to contribute pertinent to the discussion of the Momentum Amps, please refrain from posting in this thread. I hope that Dan D. will return and offer a bit more information.

Lee

 

[Steve williams]

If no further posts that are on topic, I am prepared to close the thread. Let's keep the insults out of this please

 

[RBFC]

I have some questions exactly on topic. The HFN review under discussion awards an 89% score. Here are my questions:

• Does anyone know what a score of 100% means?
• Does anyone know if a score higher than 89% (say, 91% or 93%) has ever been awarded to an amplifier?
• If so, can anyone tell (by reading the relevant reviews) what are the precise reasons a 93% amp is better than an 89% amp?

All these questions are best presented in a dedicated thread about review scores, and not in the D'Agostino amplifier thread.

Lee

 

[Steve williams]

Already done

 

[mauidan]

Got Bonnie Raitt's "The Lost Broadcast" CD that KK recommended in his review today.

Good call KK!

 

[caesar]

Mr. D'Agostino,

Welcome to the conversation. Sorry for the long list of questions, but audio "journalists" and reviewers rarely ask the important ones. Other that financial reasons, what are your objectives with these amps? What is it about this design that is different than your previous Krell designs? Are you trying to re-create a live experience in the home or are you trying to precisely reproduce every detail on the recording?

What new things have you learned? When did you get these insights (and how?) and why didn't you implement them in your Krell amps? How are your amps different and better than other mega buck amplifiers from Balaboo, Levinson, Technical brain, Soulution, etc.?

Also, as mentioned in a post above, you run your amps with a very efficient set of Wilson speakers? Why run such efficient speakers with such a powerful amp, when Steve Williams runs them with Lamm amps that produce 15 or 20 watts per channel? Did you voice your amps with other speakers? Do they work well with power hungry elecrostats or Magneplanars? Why didn't you design your amps for even more power? Fremer runs his Wilsons with an amp 3 times more powerful than yours.

Why did you price these amps as you did? What determines/ drives the high price? How big is your operation? Do you build these in your home basement or garage? How long are you going to be in the game for? Serious customer would like to know if you still have the passion or if you will sell a couple of dozen and then take off sailing around the world.

Thanks! I hope you succeed!!!

Come on Dan! If you were giving a seminar you would be asked these or similar questions by anyone other than a lackey.