Shindo Lab preamplifier

[Salvof]

Hello everyone,
Yesterday I used a Shindo Mazeris Bellevue pre-amplifier in my house, instead of my Classe' Audio dr6 and this was defeated easily. For the record, the power amp used is a Conrad MV60SE and Altec 19 speakers.
Now I would like to buy a Mazeris right away, but I would like to know from the more experienced if the new Aurieges or the old Mombrison is better than the Mazeris.
Obviously the preamplifier must necessarily have an MM phono.
Thank you all.

 

[bonzo75]

Hello everyone,
Yesterday I used a Shindo Mazeris Bellevue pre-amplifier in my house, instead of my Classe' Audio dr6 and this was defeated easily. For the record, the power amp used is a Conrad MV60SE and Altec 19 speakers.
Now I would like to buy a Mazeris right away, but I would like to know from the more experienced if the new Aurieges or the old Mombrison is better than the Mazeris.
Obviously the preamplifier must necessarily have an MM phono.
Thank you all.

The old Monbrison used to be very good value as a one box phono - pre. I did not think higher models of Shindo worth it as they were coloured for me. The only other one box phono preamp I know at good price value is EAR.

Alternatively, Misho (audioantiquary) in Bulgaria makes great phono and preamp that he sells directly for 4k euro each. There is no retail margin. He is also an Altec and other vintage expert and voices on Altec speakers. His 10w power amp which he sells for 10k was sufficient to drive the Altec 817. If you buy from him you will get good advice and help in future if you want to stay on the Altec line and upgrade your speakers. His 817s are one of the top 5 systems I have heard, and he is going to build the A5 or A7 this year, so I will look to hear it as smaller size. I have compared his phono with Allnic H7000 and it held its own. I thought I would recommend this even though it is two boxes but given the direct sales price not as expensive, and since you were in Altecs.

Visit last month here https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/zero-distortion-altec-assault-redux-orchestra-and-rock.35975/

Visit 3 years ago here https://www.whatsbestforum.com/thre...and-the-magic-of-misho-audio-antiquary.30339/

 

[Salvof]

The old Monbrison used to be very good value as a one box phono - pre. I did not think higher models of Shindo worth it as they were coloured for me. The only other one box phono preamp I know at good price value is EAR.

Alternatively, Misho (audioantiquary) in Bulgaria makes great phono and preamp that he sells directly for 4k euro each. There is no retail margin. He is also an Altec and other vintage expert and voices on Altec speakers. His 10w power amp which he sells for 10k was sufficient to drive the Altec 817. If you buy from him you will get good advice and help in future if you want to stay on the Altec line and upgrade your speakers. His 817s are one of the top 5 systems I have heard, and he is going to build the A5 or A7 this year, so I will look to hear it as smaller size. I have compared his phono with Allnic H7000 and it held its own. I thought I would recommend this even though it is two boxes but given the direct sales price not as expensive, and since you were in Altecs.

Visit last month here https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/zero-distortion-altec-assault-redux-orchestra-and-rock.35975/

Visit 3 years ago here https://www.whatsbestforum.com/thre...and-the-magic-of-misho-audio-antiquary.30339/

Thanks a lot Bonzo

 

[montesquieu]

I had both the Auriges L and Monbrisson on extended loan - both quite old examples at least cosmetically, possibly also internally, different to current models of these names.

At the time I was looking to upgrade my EAR 912. (After much exploration I ended up with an Audiopax Model 5 pre and Allnic head amp + phono stage, six boxes replacing a single box!).

The Monbrisson was nice tonally, great timbre and texture, but in terms of sounstage i found it narrow, perhaps even somewhat mono with some source material - at the time I wondered if something was broken with it, but seemingly not. The Auriges was better in this department, but still, I thought, unconvincing. Neither had sufficient inner detail in my setup. The EAR 912 (which has a really well executed LCR stage, by far the best element of the 912's performance) was significantly better than the internal phono stage in the Monbrisson when used on its own as an external to the other two.

I understand the attraction of the Shindo gear, similar to Leben (of which I've owned quite a a few components myself) and I suppose Kondo as well (likewise) - beautifully constructed Japanese craftsman-made equipment, simple, classic circuits, handmade or carefully chosen active components - but viewed objectively I'm not sure the grand idea/image/aspiration is always matched by the sonic reality.

 

[Salvof]

I had both the Auriges L and Monbrisson on extended loan - both quite old examples at least cosmetically, possibly also internally, different to current models of these names.

At the time I was looking to upgrade my EAR 912. (After much exploration I ended up with an Audiopax Model 5 pre and Allnic head amp + phono stage, six boxes replacing a single box!).

The Monbrisson was nice tonally, great timbre and texture, but in terms of sounstage i found it narrow, perhaps even somewhat mono with some source material - at the time I wondered if something was broken with it, but seemingly not. The Auriges was better in this department, but still, I thought, unconvincing. Neither had sufficient inner detail in my setup. The EAR 912 (which has a really well executed LCR stage, by far the best element of the 912's performance) was significantly better than the internal phono stage in the Monbrisson when used on its own as an external to the other two.

I understand the attraction of the Shindo gear, similar to Leben (of which I've owned quite a a few components myself) and I suppose Kondo as well (likewise) - beautifully constructed Japanese craftsman-made equipment, simple, classic circuits, handmade or carefully chosen active components - but viewed objectively I'm not sure the grand idea/image/aspiration is always matched by the sonic reality.

Thanks a lot

 

[BruceD]

Hello, I'd gather from the above comments your Mazeris Bellevue maybe a better option to seek out Preloved rather than the newer breed of Shindo Pre's--the Auriges I owned gave up the similar impression of Montesquieu -unconvincing.

As an aside, with the UK out of the EU does that mean the ROH's Solder fiasco is now dead in the UK --and the "banned" Mfgs' e.g Shindo--can export product there again?

Good Luck
BruceD

 

[Salvof]

I had both the Auriges L and Monbrisson on extended loan - both quite old examples at least cosmetically, possibly also internally, different to current models of these names.

At the time I was looking to upgrade my EAR 912. (After much exploration I ended up with an Audiopax Model 5 pre and Allnic head amp + phono stage, six boxes replacing a single box!).

The Monbrisson was nice tonally, great timbre and texture, but in terms of sounstage i found it narrow, perhaps even somewhat mono with some source material - at the time I wondered if something was broken with it, but seemingly not. The Auriges was better in this department, but still, I thought, unconvincing. Neither had sufficient inner detail in my setup. The EAR 912 (which has a really well executed LCR stage, by far the best element of the 912's performance) was significantly better than the internal phono stage in the Monbrisson when used on its own as an external to the other two.

I understand the attraction of the Shindo gear, similar to Leben (of which I've owned quite a a few components myself) and I suppose Kondo as well (likewise) - beautifully constructed Japanese craftsman-made equipment, simple, classic circuits, handmade or carefully chosen active components - but viewed objectively I'm not sure the grand idea/image/aspiration is always matched by the sonic reality.

So is the leben sound similar to the shindo sound?
Can you tell me about it?
Why could I think of replacing my peamp and power amp with the Leben 600, instead of putting a pre shindo with the conrad johnson power amp.
Regards

 

[Conde]

I've had a Shindo Vosne Romanee preamplifier now for more than 7 years and have been very happy with it. I haven't considered an upgrade as I don't believe there are many preamplifiers that would make me happier. Before purchasing, I heard the Monbrison, Masseto, and Vosne Romanee at PitchPerfect Audio (https://pitchperfectaudio.wordpress.com) in Los Angeles. Matt Rotunda at Pitch Perfect Audio is a good resource for explaining the differences in what each Shindo model offers, if you are unable to listen to other models. Some models might have compatibility issues with amplifiers due to challenging output impedance. That hasn't been an issue for me though.

There are other considerations for using Shindo, such as using their power cords and interconnects. If not their own interconnects, it is best that the ICs have switchcraft connectors. Vendors other than Shindo that have switchcraft connectors include Auditorium 23 and Luna. I use Shindo ICs for my preamp connections.

 

[mtemur]

I understand the attraction of the Shindo gear, similar to Leben (of which I've owned quite a a few components myself) and I suppose Kondo as well (likewise) - beautifully constructed Japanese craftsman-made equipment, simple, classic circuits, handmade or carefully chosen active components - but viewed objectively I'm not sure the grand idea/image/aspiration is always matched by the sonic reality.

With all due respect Kondo is not like any of those Japanese companies, both sound wise and construction wise. IMHO Shindo is better than any Leben or Luxman. For my ears the best Leben is CS 300x. New Air Tights have a relatively modern sound and better than the old ones.
None of them have any similarities with Kondo which is arms and shoulders above.

 

[Rensselaer]

I never heard the Monbrisson, but did have an opportunity to listen to the Shindo Masseto Pre in my system. I plugged it into my Nelson Pass' First Watt F3, speakers were a pair of open baffle Quasar II's (a design of Bert Doppenberg's of Oris Horns, Nunspeet, Netherlands), using Lowther PM2A's with silver voice coils and no "Hi-Ferric" for the mids/highs. The cartridge was the original Sumiko Sho MC.

My thoughts were that the Shindo Masseto was the best pre-amplifier that I ever heard, but at that time £10,000.00 was too expensive for my wallet (my car gave up and needed replacing).

Others like that one too, one enthusiast:

 

[montesquieu]

With all due respect Kondo is not like any of those Japanese companies, both sound wise and construction wise. IMHO Shindo is better than any Leben or Luxman. For my ears the best Leben is CS 300x. New Air Tights have a relatively modern sound and better than the old ones.
None of them have any similarities with Kondo which is arms and shoulders above.

Never heard an Air Tight preamp or phono stage that didn't sound broken - awful stuff, great cartridges though.

As for Kondo, they play the game very well, and indeed it can be argued that they created it - a visit from an M77 preamp remains a highlight, and I would probably have one if could sensibly afford it - but it's still the same game albeit played at a higher level.

However, to be honest, I'm far less convinced by Kondo's more recent stuff (as heard at Munich) than the older kit that made their name. Presumably they are giving their customers what they want though.

 

[Juiced]

I had the shindo aurieges mm,
didn't cared for it phono as my Croft RIAA R sounded much much better.

Now i own the last gen of the Monbrison and the phono is next level!
For now it's paired with a modest ortfon blue mm and at some point i probably upgrade to the ortofon 250.
i like to keep it in the MM domain as i have tendency to break styluses.

here is a video i shot with a MC

 

[jep123]

Never heard an Air Tight preamp or phono stage that didn't sound broken - awful stuff, great cartridges though.

As for Kondo, they play the game very well, and indeed it can be argued that they created it - a visit from an M77 preamp remains a highlight, and I would probably have one if could sensibly afford it - but it's still the same game albeit played at a higher level.

However, to be honest, I'm far less convinced by Kondo's more recent stuff (as heard at Munich) than the older kit that made their name. Presumably they are giving their customers what they want though.

Regarding Kondo in Munich; For some years they teamed up with a German loudspeaker brand in a large room. IMO you can not judge Kondo based on what you heard there. It sounded ok, but clearly the system was underpowered with Kondo amps. Kondo makes marvelous sounding equipment, but needs to be matched with the right speakers.

 

[KeithR]

My favorite Shindo preamp was the Masseto. That and a pair of Lafons or a Haut Brion were my favorite Shindo systems, but I really required remote and never went that direction. The VR is a bit dark as I recall.

intersting that none of the 3 are made anymore.

 

[godofwealth]

I briefly considered Shindo, but was turned off by their penchant to use exotic tubes not easily sourced. I would worry in general about any product that used hard to find tubes. I’d rather stick with tried and trusted designs that use tubes in plentiful supply.

 

[bonzo75]

Regarding Kondo in Munich; For some years they teamed up with a German loudspeaker brand in a large room. IMO you can not judge Kondo based on what you heard there. It sounded ok, but clearly the system was underpowered with Kondo amps. Kondo makes marvelous sounding equipment, but needs to be matched with the right speakers.

the Kondo in Munich was quite poor. But the G1000, G10 and Kagura sound very good with the klangfilm bionor and the M1000 and Gakuon with the Sigma Vector is easily the best cone system I heard. Can you get good electronics for cheaper? Sure.

the old Kondo m7 and Kondo Neiro, are for me too laid back. There are many better electronics today

 

[AudioHR]

I had both the Auriges L and Monbrisson on extended loan - both quite old examples at least cosmetically, possibly also internally, different to current models of these names.

At the time I was looking to upgrade my EAR 912. (After much exploration I ended up with an Audiopax Model 5 pre and Allnic head amp + phono stage, six boxes replacing a single box!).

The Monbrisson was nice tonally, great timbre and texture, but in terms of sounstage i found it narrow, perhaps even somewhat mono with some source material - at the time I wondered if something was broken with it, but seemingly not. The Auriges was better in this department, but still, I thought, unconvincing. Neither had sufficient inner detail in my setup. The EAR 912 (which has a really well executed LCR stage, by far the best element of the 912's performance) was significantly better than the internal phono stage in the Monbrisson when used on its own as an external to the other two.

I understand the attraction of the Shindo gear, similar to Leben (of which I've owned quite a a few components myself) and I suppose Kondo as well (likewise) - beautifully constructed Japanese craftsman-made equipment, simple, classic circuits, handmade or carefully chosen active components - but viewed objectively I'm not sure the grand idea/image/aspiration is always matched by the sonic reality.

I just discovered this thread and wanted to comment and add to the conversation.

I have the latest version of the Shindo Monbrison, this version just has the MM phono stage. I believe they felt that an outboard MC could be preferable to what they were providing at this price level. The newer version is also slightly different internally. I could not say how the old and new compare as I have not heard the older version.

While there always seems to be something better or pleasing out there I am quite taken by the excellent sound I am enjoying from my system. Presently I have the Cortese 300b and Coherent Audio Neo 18 speakers. The sound is not of the sonic spectacular variety, so no (overly ?) prominent low end or etched (bright) treble. There is lots of inner detail and what I would describe as an organic musical sound.

You mentioned that you found the Monbrison soundstage narrow. I am not finding that at all as mine is impressively wide and deep. Perhaps what you are finding is speaker or speaker placement related. Or perhaps you have experienced much better systems than me and have more to compare to.

 

[AudioHR]

Never heard an Air Tight preamp or phono stage that didn't sound broken - awful stuff, great cartridges though.

As for Kondo, they play the game very well, and indeed it can be argued that they created it - a visit from an M77 preamp remains a highlight, and I would probably have one if could sensibly afford it - but it's still the same game albeit played at a higher level.

However, to be honest, I'm far less convinced by Kondo's more recent stuff (as heard at Munich) than the older kit that made their name. Presumably they are giving their customers what they want though.

I really don't have much experience with the Air Tight components but since you mentioned the Munich Show I heard them in the Wolf Von Langa, Precision Control, Air Tight room. It was definitely amongst the best sound I heard that week. Personal preference perhaps but I wouldn't mind exploring this brand a little further.