Soundlab Audiophile G9-7c: a 30-year odyssey fulfilled

[Mrmb]

Some speaker design companies use Crown amps as well, as every designer has his/her sonic priorities. My point was that these top of the line speakers deserve the "best" amps, which to my ears the Benchmark gear does not qualify as such, and not because of its "moderate" cost. However, if folks enjoy their system's sound with the Benchmark amps, who am I to argue....

Agreed!

However, when considering amps, using one's generalized reference and experiences with amps and speakers is one thing. But of course, all speakers are different and different amps will sound worse or better, depending upon the combo. Add in personal audio preferences based on experience, and the results can be all over the map. Extrapolate that logic to electrostatic speakers (as opposed to more conventional types) and it becomes even more difficult, to impossible, to draw conclusions from amp experiences limited to say, cones and domes (as a type).

Thus, it is very important to audition the amp/speaker combination before any personal conclusions can be drawn. At least, that has been my experience. I've been surprised many times by combos that may on the surface, seem tenuous.

 

[godofwealth]

I'm waiting for my electrician to install two dedicated 20-amp lines to my listening room, so I can run my big ARC 750 SE's. I tried to run them on my 15-amp sockets, and they trip my fuse breakers after a few minutes! Meanwhile, I've been enjoying the SL's with the Mola Mola solid state electronics (the Makua all-in-one preamp with a built-in Tambaqui amp and a Roon endpoint, as well as a really great phono stage, with the Kaluga mono blocks). The Kaluga's are rated 400 watts into 8 ohms, and double into 4 ohms, but I find solid state watts somewhat less powerful than an equivalent tube amp (for reasons that aren't obvious to me, but high end is all about nuance!). The Kaluga's weigh a small fraction of the 750 SE's and run much cooler, so they are my go-to amplifier for warm weather months. They are about the size of the Benchmark's, but a combination of class A/D, instead of the Benchmark's class AB. Measurement wise, they are probably even lower distortion than the Benchmark, which is saying something. But, I don't hold out much stock in distortion measurements, since speakers have far higher levels of distortion than any amplifier. The room colors the sound even more, so unless the amplifier is really badly broken somehow, distortion is irrelevant as far as I am concerned.

I have a lovely JJ 322 SET tube amplifier that just came back from a servicing at George Meyer AV in LA. It had developed a problem, where one of the capacitors blew. George Meyer AV said it was the nicest amplifier they had heard in a long time (the exact words of the technician who worked on it was "this is a f***ing gorgeous sounding amplifier!"). But it only produces 20 watts per channel, not enough for the big SL's! Enough for my little Quad 57s, though.

 

[Mrmb]

They are about the size of the Benchmark's, but a combination of class A/D, instead of the Benchmark's class AB.

FYI: According to Benchmark, the ABH-2’s “combine class-AB, and class-H topologies”.

 

[Mrmb]

The Kaluga's are rated 400 watts into 8 ohms, and double into 4 ohms, but I find solid state watts somewhat less powerful than an equivalent tube amp (for reasons that aren't obvious to me, but high end is all about nuance!).

The following explanation is compliments of Atma-sphere's Ralph Karsten, from his Audiogon post here ( "Electrostatics and tubes" ).

Ralph's explanation is also the reason why amp usage results with non-electrostatic speakers do NOT necessairly correlate to electrostatics in general and SoundLabs specifically and why comments regarding amps and other speaker types, may, or may NOT be at all relevant:

The advantage ESLs have over other kinds of speakers is the fact that the Modus Operandi of operation is powered. In a conventional speaker the voice coil moves when current is put through it in response to the magnetic field that is present. That magnetic field sags a bit when this happens,resulting in compression. In addition the voice heats up slightly with power, resulting in something called thermal compression.

ESLs don't have this problem so are one of the more dynamic speaker technologies out there. The real issue is driving them because they don't adhere to the Voltage rules which most speakers do. In that rule where the speaker is 'Voltage driven', its expected that the amp can behave as a Voltage source, which is to say it can put out the same Voltage regardless of the speaker load impedance.

ESLs have an impedance curve isn't based on a driver in a box. So there's no box resonance although there typically is an impedance peak in the bass region like many box speakers. But unlike box speakers they need to have power in that peak; in a box speaker this impedance peak is a resonance (a region of higher efficiency) so you want to throttle back the power so as to not play too much bass. If the amp behaves as a Voltage source then this happens.

So ESLs work better with amps that do not behave as a Voltage source. That's one of the reasons they can often work better with tubes. But ideally the tube amp should make constant power with respect to load and to do that the amp has to be either zero feedback or have equal amounts of Voltage and current feedback (which is rare; I don't think any such amps are in production today).

Obviously this makes finding the ideal amp for an ESL a bit tricky. But once you have the right combination they can be pretty hard to beat at any price.

 

[godofwealth]

I agree with Ralph’s assessment. I’ve used electrostatic speakers over 35 years with almost every type of amplifier technology. Generally they do sound their best with tubes. What I’m finding with SL over the past couple of weeks is that they sound better with the Mola Mola amplifiers than my Quads ever did. One reason I think is that Quads seem to have a slightly brighter tonality in the midrange due to the delay line circuitry and possibly inferior electronics. My SL’s have a massively overbuilt electronics module that itself weighs as much as a power amplifier (~ 40 pounds). Roger West himself builds these and it’s massively overbuilt with a huge toroidal transformer and high quality caps. Quads are built to a much cheaper price point. I think if you are pressed on space or budget, I’d go with getting the largest SL you can fit in your room, and skimp instead on a power amplifier. A Benchmark might even be fine or even cheaper alternatives. There are professional amplifiers from Crown that literally cost only a few hundred dollars and are very rugged. Mola Mola amplifiers unfortunately are really pricey. You don’t need to spend that much. I suspect even Quad solid state electronics, like the 909 or 606, might work fine.

 

[godofwealth]

Here’s my recommendation for a low- priced front end for my SL’s: a Eversolo DMP-A6 that gives you a Roon endpoint, a state of the art DAC and balanced preamplifier with the ability to take a 4 TB NVME drive to locally store music; and the cheapest solid state amplifier you can find that can swing enough voltage in the bass where the impedance is around 30-40 ohms. I have a D-Sonic that’s class D and is spec ‘ed at 1500 watts per channel. That is only around $1500 per channel. You might not need that much power. A 300 watt D-Sonic might suffice. I got a pair of Crown XLS 2100’s that cost $250 per amplifier! Pro amplifiers are dirt cheap compared to audiophile amplifiers. And they are incredibly rugged with a lot of protection to survive being thrown around. Crown amps are fan-cooled so you have to be careful not to get the larger wattage ones where the fans are too loud. Adcom amplifiers might work well. I owned a couple of their models 40 years ago!

The point to note is with streaming, front-ends are now dirt cheap and amplifiers are as well. Save the vast amount of your budget for the SL’s, which are indeed very expensive but worth every penny if you value a full-range electrostatic with low distortion.

 

[godofwealth]

Back to music, which ultimately is what we’re here for! A revelation for me came from listening to Buena Vista Social Club, Ry Cooder’s breakthrough album featuring senior citizen singers and performers from Cuba whom the world had forgotten. Many of them subsequently found fame and issued individual albums. One of my favorites in this genre is the breathtaking voice of Omara Portuondo. Wow! What a singer! The recording’s opening track is a good test of your speaker’s low-frequency response. The third track generally has me dancing around my listening room. If listening to this track doesn’t get you up on your feet, a check with your physician might be warranted. Or you need a better hifi system! On the big SL’s, this album will get you grooving to this “big band” Cuban album. A desert island disc!

 

[godofwealth]

And of course we now have to follow Omara’a album with the original Buena Vista Social Club, Ry Cooder’s breakthrough album of senior citizen Cuban singers and pianists like Ibrahim Ferrer, Ruben Gonzalves, Omara Portindo et al. who overnight became such a sensation with this recording that they ended up doing a live performance at Carnegie Hall. Sonically this was a low budget recording but the sheer vibrancy of the music lifts it to world class music. One finds music of this caliber only once in a generation. On the big SL’s, the analog recording shows its limitations but the clarity of the voices and diverse instruments all come through vividly. This is a recording that makes you realize you’re only as old as you feel. These eighty something singers and performers put twenty something musicians to shame. What an album!

You can read much more about the history of the album and the performers here:

Buena Vista Social Club - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Mrmb]

Here’s my recommendation for a low- priced front end for my SL’s: a Eversolo DMP-A6 that gives you a Roon endpoint, a state of the art DAC and balanced preamplifier with the ability to take a 4 TB NVME drive to locally store music; and the cheapest solid state amplifier you can find that can swing enough voltage in the bass where the impedance is around 30-40 ohms. I have a D-Sonic that’s class D and is spec ‘ed at 1500 watts per channel. That is only around $1500 per channel. You might not need that much power. A 300 watt D-Sonic might suffice. I got a pair of Crown XLS 2100’s that cost $250 per amplifier! Pro amplifiers are dirt cheap compared to audiophile amplifiers. And they are incredibly rugged with a lot of protection to survive being thrown around. Crown amps are fan-cooled so you have to be careful not to get the larger wattage ones where the fans are too loud. Adcom amplifiers might work well. I owned a couple of their models 40 years ago!

The point to note is with streaming, front-ends are now dirt cheap and amplifiers are as well. Save the vast amount of your budget for the SL’s, which are indeed very expensive but worth every penny if you value a full-range electrostatic with low distortion.

Although I am not now following your recommendations, in the past I have definitely agreed with them!!

I began the journey down the audio rabbit hole beginning in my very early teens, by buying drivers and installing them in cardboard boxes trying to better the audio coming from my radio. Then, I could only afford free equipment brochures and as such, I could only afford to lust after equipment. But lust I did, I simply craved more accurate, better in-home reproduction!!

Several years later after college and a decent job, I was able to afford some of what I saw in those now decade old brochures.

Ironically, when shopping for my first system and long before SoundLab was created, I listened to a pair of JanSzen electrostatic speakers that literally sparked when they played loud and had little bass, but BOY was that midrange to die for!! It was what I was seeking, but couldn't find! Decades later, I realized that Dr. Roger West of SoundLab, was involved with JanSzen in its early years. For me, that cinched it and I bought SoundLabs unheard! But I'm getting ahead of myself.

As I reached my 50's I had good audio equipment, but thought my glass is becoming less than half full, my hearing may be in jeopardy, why not go for all the gusto that I could afford.

Then, I had Martin Logan ESL's and an Aragon 4004 amp. After hearing Audio Research amplification on my Logan's, I recognized that music could sound more like the live music I was hearing at my son's band practices. Thus, I auditioned several amps, with a Levinson being my first truly high-end amp. The moral: don't listen to what you can't afford (grin).

From there, I moved slowly forward, getting Apogee speakers and high end CDP's (my first was a Meridian and it was a revelation and then a Wadia) and then getting back into spinning vinyl with a Galibier Quatro turntable, Tri-Planar tonearm & Dynavetor cart.

Even later, I also had 2-different Lampizator DAC's, a dCS DAC and now an EMM Labs DV2 DAC/preamp that is directly driving my Atma-sphere MA-1's. Fronting the DV2 DAC is EMM's NS1 streamer, which is proprietarily linked (& isolated so) to the DV2 DAC. A Roon ROCK NUC (with 200k tracks) is located away from the audio room and is directly Ethernet connected to the NS1 streamer

With that said, the law of diminishing returns sets in once one goes beyond a certain cost/quality point. Prior to crossing that point I agree, great, superb sound can be had for much less. But once one crosses the rubicon into the realm of the truly high end and the funds are available, there is no turning back and for me happily so.

Getting back to SoundLabs, from my beginning in this hobby, speaker selection was paramount. Putting ones money in speakers is important. Driving the speakers with quality material and good pre and amplification are important, but not the end all be all, if funding is critical.

So yes, Crown amplification and other amps that will drive the SoundLabs are recommended. In fact, from years ago, I recall that the SoundLab factory did use Crown.

I've heard of, but am not familar with your other "low cost" suggestions. But I imagine they would be either a good start, or an ending point for many, not so audiophoolish as I.

Chasing an ever improving goal can be the unecessary bane of this hobby. But we humans love the chase and once caught, we look to chase again. But that needn't be so, especially if we enjoy the music as is, which is what we should all be seeking.

 

[godofwealth]

My JJ 322 SET amp returned from its repair. A little cosmetic bruising sadly, but shipping 100-pound amplifiers is subject to shipping mishandling. Sounds gorgeous as only a 300B SET can. Running it my Quad 2805s. Not enough power to make the big SL’s shine, I think.

 

[godofwealth]

The conductor less Orpheus Chamber Orchestra has made many lovely recordings, including this one of Dvorak serenades. Lush strings, wonderful tunes, what’s not to like? On the big SL’s, DG’s recording comes off very well. The balance is close but the strings are full-bodied and there’s plenty of dynamics.

 

[godofwealth]

Staying with Dvorak, here’s an unusual and delightful chamber music album performed by four siblings featuring Dvorak’s music for bagatelle. Nicely recorded in 24-bit 96 kHz. I find myself largely enjoying each of these albums and getting lost in the music to the extent that it’s hard to focus on audiophile matters. That’s perhaps the best compliment I can pay to the big SL’s.

 

[godofwealth]

Here’s a lovely piece of music by Bloch, sad and mournful, played beautifully by a young cellist. Haunting melody. Sounds poignant on the big SL’s.

 

[godofwealth]

Dvorak owed his early success to Johannes Brahms who recognized the prodigious talent in the young Bohemian composer. As Brahms health was failing, he retired from his compositional duties. Then he heard the beautiful playing of clarinetist Muhlfeld. He came out of retirement to compose three immortal compositions for clarinet, including this clarinet sonata. This ECM recording is beautifully balanced and the clarinet is not closely miked but bathed in a nice ambience. Timeless music from one of the great masters at the height of his creativity. The recording sounds splendid on the big SL’s.

 

[godofwealth]

And we close another listening session with another resplendent recording of Stile Antico recorded by Harmonia Mundi at 24-bit 88.2khz resolution. I assume this recording was originally a DSD recording transcribed to PCM. The music features one of the great renaissance choral composers. The voices sound closely miked but on the big SL’s, the reproduction is superb with not a hint of brightness. A desert island disc.

 

[ChrisSoundLab]

It has taken me some time to catch up on a lot of business including following this most positive thread for Sound Lab. I just wanted to clear up a couple of things mentioned quite a few days back - I am Chris, and so pleased that the installation to godofwealth went so smoothly. Yes, I have been representing Sound Lab in Japan for the past 13 years, but from last year I am acting as distributor for Sound Lab and have two very active dealers both of whom have demonstration models. They are listed in my website. All the models you see on my website represent the new method of classification for the models so there is fast and easy navigation to understand the height and width and consequent radiating area. Also please know that I can accept any orders for SL anywhere in the world and direct orders thru our dealers if their service can apply to your situation. We have new packing materials with laser cut foam. Dr. Vinyl (Jose, dealer in Maryland) will have 2 models at Capital Audiofest next month - the same as godofwealth has just received (G9-7C) and also a close to medium size G8-5C model. You can find info on my FB page (Sound Lab Electrostats) A photo attached of the cherry G9-7C being built for the Capital show for reference. There are some very exciting new developments coming in the next year. I hope it is OK that I have posted these comments here... Sound Lab needs to find a way to reach people - new ears as well as old, and I am simply looking for a way forward to keep Roger and Brett busy - suggestions welcome!

 

[godofwealth]

Here’s a lovely DSD recording of Brahms Violin Sonatas from Praga, a Czech label that’s issued a lot of wonderful SACDs of chamber music. A violin is really hard to reproduce well. In this recording, the mikes have been placed well away from the instruments to get a nice sense of the ambience of the venue. Even the piano is not closely miked, but sounds much more like pianos do in a concert. There is no stereo information from a piano in a concert for the simple reason that pianos are always placed perpendicular to the stage to allow the audience to see the pianist playing. Recordings destroy this natural monophonic sound of pianos in concert halls by sticking microphones into the throat of a piano and make it sound like it’s playing with your head stuck inside a piano! Thankfully that’s not the case here. Lovely to hear this on the SL G9-7c and Brahms of course is one of the great masters, part of the triumvirate Bach-Beethoven-Brahms.

 

[godofwealth]

Arvo Part is my favorite “modern” composer who writes mostly religious music in an interesting ascetic formal style. I find his music deep and profound. In this beautiful recording from the Swedish label BIS, the Helsinki Chamber Choir accompanied by a quartet of violin, oboe, cello and bassoon, and an organ, give a heartfelt performance of this long 70-minute piece. Part is not a composer you want to listen without paying full concentration. He does not write for musical dilettantes. Part composed this piece called:

Passio Domini Nostri Jesu Christi secundum Joannem
per soli, coro misto, strumenti e organo (1982)
The Passion of Our Lord Jesus Christ According to John
for soloists, mixed choir, instruments and organ

BIS has issued many great recordings and uses the highest quality Neumann and Schoeps microphones. The massive organ climaxes are rendered beautifully on the big SL, as are the voices and the instruments. Music like this transports you into a spiritual realm. It’s sublime. It’s worth quoting the liner notes to describe Part’s compositional style in this piece:

Pärt developed a technique that he named ‘tintinnabuli’. The
word is derived from the Latin for ‘bell’ – ‘tintinnabulum’, and the technique was
designed to combine the liturgical associations of chant with the resonance of bells. Tintinnabuli textures are based on the pairing of two voices, denoted as M-voice (melody) and T-voice (tintinnabuli). The M-voice is a melody, often reminiscent of medieval chant. The T-voice is an accompaniment, made up only of notes from the chord of the home key, resulting in arpeggio movement. The two voices always work closely together, singing the same rhythm, and Pärt conceives the pairing as a single sonic unit.

 

[godofwealth]

Heinrich Schultz, a 17th century German composer, wrote a lot of delightful choral music including his Psalms for David. Here we have his funeral music, which doesn’t sound very somber and austere to my ears, but rather a celebration of a life well lived. This is a gorgeous 24-bit recording that comes across exceptionally well on the large SL panels as they can cope with a large vocal ensemble far better than my much smaller Quads that used to get stressed by massed voices. There’s a real sense of sitting up close to a large choir as I have done many times, once in Venice almost 30 years ago listening to some delightful Vivaldi. When you sit close to a choir you notice the variations in individual voices far more than if you sit at the back where the voices blend and the ambience smooths out the high frequencies. Here the recording engineer chose a close balance rather than an ecclesiastical acoustic.

 

[godofwealth]

And we end another musical soirée tonight with one of the most magnificent compositions in the chamber music oeuvre, the cello sonatas by Johannes Brahms, here performed by two musical giants, the cellist Mstislav Rostropovich and the pianist Rudolph Serkin. The opening of the first cello sonata has long been my demo disc for bass clarity of a loudspeaker. Rostropovich’s cello digs deep into the bass and many dynamic moving coil loudspeakers end up producing an undignified rumble of sound rather than a cello. What matters in bass is definition, not volume. Here the big SL’s show how to get deep bass right, projecting the cello into a nice ambient space whereas Serkin’s floats above. True to DG’s tradition, the musicians are miked very closely and this is not concert hall sound but rather living room sound as if these two legends were playing in your own living room.

In Brahms’ time, there were no recordings and educated families did not cluster around a television watching a ball game, but rather around a piano making music. How much we have lost as a society in these intervening centuries!

A magnificent recording by one of the greatest composers that ever lived at the height of his powers. Put this on your playlist to understand what a cello sounds like. Deep and sonorous, plumbing the depths of a musician’s soul.

Perhaps it’s a sign of my declining years, but I fear we will not have performers of this caliber ever again. We will only be able to listen to them on recordings.