Interesting Perspective on Our Hobby
- Thread starter miniguy
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What it comes down to is too much money chasing audio products. Rising population and new groups such as Asia account for it too. Also the technology age,but no doubt buying new is inflated....ride the wave.
Wow, great text!
I particularly liked his closing paragraph:
"But there is a difference: society accepts $2 million cars and $3500 strappy sandals and $1500 fountain pens and $10,000 wines. When it comes to luxury purchases, only audiophiles are scorned or regarded as certifiable. And it’s been this way ever since hi-fi began because of a simple fact: we have always failed to communicate why anyone else should lust after what we lust after. And this has to change."
I see enough of this here.
cheers,
alex
I particularly liked his closing paragraph:
"But there is a difference: society accepts $2 million cars and $3500 strappy sandals and $1500 fountain pens and $10,000 wines. When it comes to luxury purchases, only audiophiles are scorned or regarded as certifiable. And it’s been this way ever since hi-fi began because of a simple fact: we have always failed to communicate why anyone else should lust after what we lust after. And this has to change."
I see enough of this here.
cheers,
alex
What I can't understand is why in the audiophile world people get so mad about stuff that they think is over priced. We have a lot of victims that have never bought anything... No one ever stops to think about the fact that people are running a business, not a charity, in niche market. You pay higher mark-ups every day for everyday things; because that's how the business functions.
I know. It's because in the audiophile world, it's OK to say "all amps sound the same", or "a $300 DAC is all you need", so immediately, anything costing more than a few hundred bucks become "luxury" and "stupid".
That's why our hobby is not one, but many.
cheers,
alex
How does one value pleasure, the whole point of any hobby? The costs aren't limited to money, there's time and in extreme cases even risk of life and limb. Whatever is involved in any hobby the value scale is sure to differ from that of regular working life. The keener interest demands it. As such, I think it but natural that the application of say, BOM to discussions is unrealistic. Surely if this is to be the universal standard, Art would be the worst "offender". Clearly we humans seek more than the most basic of utilities. A surfer might go off into the wild where he could drown or get malaria to catch that wave. A diver someplace a hundred miles from a decompression chamber to see a wreck. A watch guy might spend years researching and learning the histories of calibres and such. A car guy taking over a decade on a restoration done by himself in his garage. Wine guys will go to vineyards where weather has been good and buy batches before they've been fully aged and bottled. On Netflix I watched a show about a guy that built his own Fokker Tri-Plane. Are we audio people really THAT crazy? I think not.
What's interesting is seeing a bunch of guys with different hobbies in the same room. It can be downright hilarious. Just last week I (audio) was with a gun collector, a couple of wine guys and a vintage car guy, all are into art and watches, myself probably the least into watches. You get a bunch of guys indeed calling each other crazy, and its probably true! The thing is, nobody judges and everybody has a good time. Crazy is more compliment than insult. The mutual admiration is not based on what the individuals have amassed by way of goods but rather for the passion of the individuals to learn and experience something new. Of course if you stick one person who has no hobbies at all in that group and the dynamic can change really quickly. Anybody with a hobby understands that not all things are the same.
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What's interesting is seeing a bunch of guys with different hobbies in the same room. It can be downright hilarious. Just last week I (audio) was with a gun collector, a couple of wine guys and a vintage car guy, all are into art and watches, myself probably the least into watches. You get a bunch of guys indeed calling each other crazy, and its probably true! The thing is, nobody judges and everybody has a good time. Crazy is more compliment than insult. The mutual admiration is not based on what the individuals have amassed by way of goods but rather for the passion of the individuals to learn and experience something new. Of course if you stick one person who has no hobbies at all in that group and the dynamic can change really quickly. Anybody with a hobby understands that not all things are the same.
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In my 30's I knew too many. I literally watched joy return to their lives when they took something up.
took up a hobby that is. Popular ones remain photography, biking, diving, running. One friend, a TV commercial director, got into scale model assembly a year later and woah! Museum quality!
My father told me how he was once at a dinner party, met a couple of the guests, and discovered that all three of them were passionate about Morgans. They carried on for a few minutes until my father realized that he was talking about his car, while one of the other guys was talking about sailboats and the third guy thought they were discussing horses. A bit strange, and very funny. They shared an interest in wine.
On the money side of things , generally , if you buy wisely , you only lend money to the system.
Just about all my audio life I have bought and sold gear at almost no loss to myself ..
when I shuffle off this mortal coil , my heirs will realise almost all the dosh that I have put into my current system.
In the interim , I have 3-5 hours of pleasure a day from my "investment"
Just about all my audio life I have bought and sold gear at almost no loss to myself ..
when I shuffle off this mortal coil , my heirs will realise almost all the dosh that I have put into my current system.
In the interim , I have 3-5 hours of pleasure a day from my "investment"
I am, or have been, active in quite a few hobbies/activities over my life: high end audio; home theater; golf; wine; cars; cameras/photography; drones; (and a long. long, very long time ago, stamp collecting).
And BY FAR, the only hobby/interest on that list that has internal bickering (by those who supposedly are active in the hobby) at the extreme level is audio. Wine collecting has some snobs, but very few in my experience.
Tasting wine is certainly subjective (though, unlike us, they will subject themselves to blind testing); viewing a beautiful photo is certainly subjective; when I play golf with someone (or even discuss golf with someone) who is far superior to me (or has much better equipment), I never feel looked down upon. But, if requested, I can get all of the assistance I might wish. When I am flying a drone, along with others who have equipment and capability far superior to mine, I get offered assistance but never criticism.
While those outside the hobby might think someone has lost it who purchases a mega expensive wine, those in the hobby won't. Or a new car; or a new watch; or a new drone; or new new camera. But that is not the reaction you get in our hobby when someone purchases a $150,000 amp.
This is pure speculation on my part but the one differentiator with this hobby is the science/measurements vs subjective argument. It exists in no other hobby to the extent it does in this one.
And BY FAR, the only hobby/interest on that list that has internal bickering (by those who supposedly are active in the hobby) at the extreme level is audio. Wine collecting has some snobs, but very few in my experience.
Tasting wine is certainly subjective (though, unlike us, they will subject themselves to blind testing); viewing a beautiful photo is certainly subjective; when I play golf with someone (or even discuss golf with someone) who is far superior to me (or has much better equipment), I never feel looked down upon. But, if requested, I can get all of the assistance I might wish. When I am flying a drone, along with others who have equipment and capability far superior to mine, I get offered assistance but never criticism.
While those outside the hobby might think someone has lost it who purchases a mega expensive wine, those in the hobby won't. Or a new car; or a new watch; or a new drone; or new new camera. But that is not the reaction you get in our hobby when someone purchases a $150,000 amp.
This is pure speculation on my part but the one differentiator with this hobby is the science/measurements vs subjective argument. It exists in no other hobby to the extent it does in this one.
One thing I can never understand about audiophilia: so many people consider any sort of subjective disagreement as an attack on their world view, on their hearing, on their taste, on their intelligance, on their very person. Why? Are we really so small-minded and petty? On the flip side, there also seems to be an evangelical need to save people from themselves and their poor decisions when it comes to spending their own money. Why? So we can feel better about our own choices if others make the same decisions and spend their money on the same products?
Honestly, if I wasn't already in the club I don't know that I'd want to join.
Honestly, if I wasn't already in the club I don't know that I'd want to join.
Three things that don't help
1-the non sexy nature of this hobby
Ask any non audiophile and his or esp her view of us is a sad bunch of faintly unhealthy obsessives who sit in our own in the dark (guilty as charged!)
2-the lack of visuals/pizazz in this hobby
Cars, architecture, watches, shoes, jewellery, designer clothes, wine, good food
All this stuff has a visual/textural quality that immed portrays its cultural significance and is desirable by definition
3-the language we all use
When we talk about spending $00s-00000s to gain what outsiders view as OCD incremental impvts in attributes that can't be easily explained to outsiders like transparency or texture, we're roundly criticised
In a parallel universe, where the great and the good, and the rest of the population all listened more to music at home than on the go as a throwaway hobby
If the world hadn't moved on from tts, tube amps, big horns, I suspect the convergence of visual and tactile desirability of gear w a true cultural love for music and audiophilia might have meant our hobby did not get its undeserved label of sad and irrelevant
1-the non sexy nature of this hobby
Ask any non audiophile and his or esp her view of us is a sad bunch of faintly unhealthy obsessives who sit in our own in the dark (guilty as charged!)
2-the lack of visuals/pizazz in this hobby
Cars, architecture, watches, shoes, jewellery, designer clothes, wine, good food
All this stuff has a visual/textural quality that immed portrays its cultural significance and is desirable by definition
3-the language we all use
When we talk about spending $00s-00000s to gain what outsiders view as OCD incremental impvts in attributes that can't be easily explained to outsiders like transparency or texture, we're roundly criticised
In a parallel universe, where the great and the good, and the rest of the population all listened more to music at home than on the go as a throwaway hobby
If the world hadn't moved on from tts, tube amps, big horns, I suspect the convergence of visual and tactile desirability of gear w a true cultural love for music and audiophilia might have meant our hobby did not get its undeserved label of sad and irrelevant
Spirit, I don't disagree with your comments at all, but the funny thing is that whenever I try to demonstrate differences to an outsider, they get it straight away. Lots of people have said "I wouldn't have the ears to tell the difference", but then when actually confronted with a good system, they're blown away.
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