Aries Cerat Kassandra II Ref DAC: Wow!

morricab

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Stop the nonsense. i was never a dealer and you live in CH so you know that this is non-viable wth the cost of living here. You KNOW I work in Pharma like Audiophile Bill and indeed spent the entire afternoon in the Swiss Biotech conference in Eysins. I, like many people got a demo unit Dac to listen to as a favour and returned the favour by sending it to interested people to listen to. The Dac is not my property and goes back to Lukasz or gets sold locally. I have ZERO financial interest and indeed pay a penalty as my wife complains about the clutter of storing it! On the other hand, you went for countless weeks here touting the Aries brand without disclosing your dealer status.

I never said you didnt like the Lampi, I said dont say its a slam dunk without mentioning that you never did a head to head and that you only know the lower Atlantic line.

I dont have anything to hide and I am very vocal about the stuff I like, like Job amps, iFi products, Heil speakers, Swisscables, Lumenwhite TT, Stenheim speakers, Dartzeel amps and Danalog Dac, CH M1 amp, Illusonic IAP processor, Goldmund active speakers and a few others I KNOW well.

Finally, I am open about not hearing the Aries, but have chatted with Believe Hifi and Stavros online enough to understand the design principles and the passion involved. I know it HAS to be a great set of products and indicated before that I would like to make it to Regensdorf this year to hear in person.

I announced what I was doing once a company with my name attached was established firmly. Not before.

It was my understanding that you were a Lampizator dealer but if you say you are not I accept that. i know you have a pharma job, I also have, as you know, a day job...no need to make a living from it . Just following were the passion leads...

As for the rest? Well I will look forward to seeing you at the show.
 

wisnon

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Never was. Not sure who could have told you that. Couldnt be Chris, as he knows it for certain that I am not. There is no Lampi dealer in CH, it is direct sales only.

No way would I complicate my tax situation for playpen money! Canton Vaud is rabid about tax, maybe unlike Zurich.

I will certainly try to make it to Regensdorf this year, though it pales in comparison to Warsaw. Indeed it has been abandoned by many Swiss barnds like Goldmund, CH, Rowen, Dartzeel, FM, and Stenheim.
 

flyer

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You compared them in someone else's system...and that someone else didn't agree with you. I compared them in my own, stable, well defined system that I used for reviewing and thousands of hours of listening. I compared them against my reference, vinyl.

+1 morricab

I effectively, maybe being too circumstancially or too diplomatic because I otherwise find bonzo a nice guy, fully disagreed with the conclusions drawn by the (in)famous comparison. My words were either misquoted ('I could not hear a difference') or not heard (when pointing at a substantial SPL difference when doing the comparison), etc. i will not go through this whole thing again. Bonzo came in to prove to himself that GG with 242 bettered the Kassandra and so he did, in his way, consciously or subconsciously, with or without a personal interest, whatever.
But I know one thing, when at the very very end I managed to sit in the middle, just for once, after being a host for 4 hours, I was set aback by the conclusions of Bonzo as I suddenly could hear the difference with my own ears. He writes that I agreed that the Lampi was more 'compact'. A nice way of putting that the Lampi soundstage was (to me, much) more limited compared to the Kassandra which had a true side-to-side soundstage and depth without the hole in the middle and realistic density to the instruments. This is where he wrote: "So I gave up bothering."... yeah, my one minute was bothersome :).

I do not have the perfect hearing, nor is my preference the only truth. It is highly likely that Bonzo preferred the GG with the 242 over the Kassandra, I do not doubt that. I only doubt the way it is being extrapollated for the wider community without mention of the conditions surrounding a comparison.

Luckily we do not all hear in the same way or life would be monotonous.
 

bonzo75

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Wow Wow Wow...what a collective attempt to invalidate the comparison from AC dealers...I hoped you would not have jumped in, Michel, I seriously do...with Brad and me it has always been on, beyond AC and Lampi.

For those who do not know, Flyer trusted my listening enough that he bought Analysis Omega just on my say so, even when I had warned him against the unmodded one, and based on my recommendation, he decided to audition both YG Hailey and Stenheim Alumine 5 and became a dealer for Stenheim. So now, all of a sudden, one year later, he disagrees only with the Lampi compare.

for those who want to read flyer's disagreements the day after the compare, which I wrote after sharing the write up with him, feel free to do so here http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showt...mega-Rockports&p=436628&viewfull=1#post436628

As you can see, it was all friendly till Brad jumped in.

To your comment, I have zero personal interests, and get no cashback, nor have I bought anything from the distributor except the dac - so far have no interest in streamer or amps or cables. My discount would probably be approx 75 - 80 percent of cost, which started with Lampi 5 and since then have been upgrades. And that's from a distributor, I should have bargained for 60.

Luckily you hear the same way I do. Also can you please say why you changed the bias of the dac twice, is that because it sounded less without the bias change?

I have been with other non-dealers who have heard the Lampi and other stuff. You will find that Barry2013, Shakti, UK Paul, Bill, Christoph, acousticsguru, all of us more or less heard the same in other non Lampi compares, and where relevant, in Lampi compares - it is not really difficult whne you are playing the same music. Your purchases based on my recos are evidence enough. So all we disagree with is now the Lampi with 242? Wow.

ps: I have total respect for you and would not have liked this post. So I implore you to let me and Brad stay at it. As you can see, I have not even mentioned that compare myself, it was Brad who keeps bringing it up, and in two other posts I actually said the only alternative was the Aries Cerat dac.

Also, you did travel to Henk's on my suggestion. I must have really really bad listening.

I recommend the Lampi for the same reason I recommend Shun Mook and Apogees - best thing for hifi.

That said, if anyone wanted to trade in my dream analog for my Lampi, I would switch easily, so I am quite open it is not better than vinyl
 

morricab

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Wow Wow Wow...what a collective attempt to invalidate the comparison from AC dealers...I hoped you would not have jumped in, Michel, I seriously do...with Brad and me it has always been on, beyond AC and Lampi.

For those who do not know, Flyer trusted my listening enough that he bought Analysis Omega just on my say so, even when I had warned him against the unmodded one, and based on my recommendation, he decided to audition both YG Hailey and Stenheim Alumine 5 and became a dealer for Stenheim. So now, all of a sudden, one year later, he disagrees only with the Lampi compare.

for those who want to read flyer's disagreements the day after the compare, which I wrote after sharing the write up with him, feel free to do so here http://www.whatsbestforum.com/showt...mega-Rockports&p=436628&viewfull=1#post436628

As you can see, it was all friendly till Brad jumped in.

To your comment, I have zero personal interests, and get no cashback, nor have I bought anything from the distributor except the dac - so far have no interest in streamer or amps or cables. My discount would probably be approx 75 - 80 percent of cost, which started with Lampi 5 and since then have been upgrades. And that's from a distributor, I should have bargained for 60.

Luckily you hear the same way I do. Also can you please say why you changed the bias of the dac twice, is that because it sounded less without the bias change?

I have been with other non-dealers who have heard the Lampi and other stuff. You will find that Barry2013, Shakti, UK Paul, Bill, Christoph, acousticsguru, all of us more or less heard the same in other non Lampi compares, and where relevant, in Lampi compares - it is not really difficult whne you are playing the same music. Your purchases based on my recos are evidence enough. So all we disagree with is now the Lampi with 242? Wow.

ps: I have total respect for you and would not have liked this post. So I implore you to let me and Brad stay at it. As you can see, I have not even mentioned that compare myself, it was Brad who keeps bringing it up, and in two other posts I actually said the only alternative was the Aries Cerat dac.

Also, you did travel to Henk's on my suggestion. I must have really really bad listening.

I recommend the Lampi for the same reason I recommend Shun Mook and Apogees - best thing for hifi.

That said, if anyone wanted to trade in my dream analog for my Lampi, I would switch easily, so I am quite open it is not better than vinyl

Small point of clarification: You may not have financial vested interest here but you most definitely have reputational capital invested. It is clear with your blog that you feel qualified to go visit people and place judgement on that system. That's fine, but do the people you visit know they are going to potentially be heavily criticized? Maybe now they do...but before? When I reviewed gear, the manufacturer knows that there is a chance for review to go sour. They want the publicity though and are willing to risk it. I won't comment further on Flyer's comments...suffice to say he seems to have let his pent up frustration with that day loose and it would have been better to be more direct with you from the outset rather than months later.

The ironic thing is that of all the people on this forum, you, Flyer and myself are probably the closest to agreement on sound quality (not counting the US guys like Steve and DDK) who post regularly. Like different schisms of Islam or something. Because I can readily agree with you that Apogees sound great (having owned them myself and stayed friends with the whole Apogee crew up in the Netherlands and down here), Lampizator sounds great, certain newer horns (like Tune Audio Anima, hoRNs by Auto Tech Universum etc.) sound great and that good SET amps are the way to go...at least with horns. I have no doubt that you would find my system at least enjoyable if not fantastic and once you build something of your own I am sure I would be able to return the compliment. We don't agree on the absolute hierarchy but the main ingredients we are in pretty close agreement.
 

bonzo75

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Small point of clarification: You may not have financial vested interest here but you most definitely have reputational capital invested. It is clear with your blog that you feel qualified to go visit people and place judgement on that system. That's fine, but do the people you visit know they are going to potentially be heavily criticized? Maybe now they do...but before? When I reviewed gear, the manufacturer knows that there is a chance for review to go sour. They want the publicity though and are willing to risk it. I won't comment further on Flyer's comments...suffice to say he seems to have let his pent up frustration with that day loose and it would have been better to be more direct with you from the outset rather than months later.

The ironic thing is that of all the people on this forum, you, Flyer and myself are probably the closest to agreement on sound quality (not counting the US guys like Steve and DDK) who post regularly. Like different schisms of Islam or something. Because I can readily agree with you that Apogees sound great (having owned them myself and stayed friends with the whole Apogee crew up in the Netherlands and down here), Lampizator sounds great, certain newer horns (like Tune Audio Anima, hoRNs by Auto Tech Universum etc.) sound great and that good SET amps are the way to go...at least with horns. I have no doubt that you would find my system at least enjoyable if not fantastic and once you build something of your own I am sure I would be able to return the compliment. We don't agree on the absolute hierarchy but the main ingredients we are in pretty close agreement.

Have I criticized any owner here? Have I even criticized AC? By saying Lampi with 242 is better that's a criticism? You are reading it that way because you have vested interest. If you actually read that report, it shows that tweaking both is changing the game. Which is what audiophiles need to take away. Differences between Koetsu and Colibri are not going to harm anybody's market. They are data points. Even a respected audiophile like Mike has done nothing to change the market for any components because he has liked one and not the other. All of us enjoy forumming, comparing, writing. There are some who are more strongly worded than others

And so that others know, I bought a coralstone to compare to Atlas and Shelter Harmony, lost money. Bought a colibri for a compare, sold it off. Bought a SPU a95 for a compare, will sell it off. Bought an Ayon Orthos XS purely to check on how it runs on Duettas because I could not compare it anywhere, and sold it off, lost money. I spend around 10k a year, maybe slightly less, just traveling for compares. Some of it is learning, sometimes I see a certainty

Compares is what I like doing and enjoy, in case you read only my Lampi posts. There is zero other interest. That's my hobby. All of you are in hifi for some OCD or the other. In fact my biggest issue with Pacific is that it is not transportable due to size, for shootouts.

If you and I have differences, they are not about AC and Lampi - I agree we agree on 97% of stuff including liking Apogee and horns, though in reverse order at times, and not liking the rest of the costly toy boxes, but it is the other 3%. You come on as too strong to promote your own recommendational agenda - running SETs on Apogees, calling that small Odeon you have a horn, and incessantly trying to invalidate my Lampi compare. You should have let it go as a post. There will be another one here or there by some other owners over the months to come.
 

morricab

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Have I criticized any owner here? Have I even criticized AC? By saying Lampi with 242 is better that's a criticism? You are reading it that way because you have vested interest. If you actually read that report, it shows that tweaking both is changing the game. Which is what audiophiles need to take away. Differences between Koetsu and Colibri are not going to harm anybody's market. They are data points. Even a respected audiophile like Mike has done nothing to change the market for any components because he has liked one and not the other. All of us enjoy forumming, comparing, writing. There are some who are more strongly worded than others

And so that others know, I bought a coralstone to compare to Atlas and Shelter Harmony, lost money. Bought a colibri for a compare, sold it off. Bought a SPU a95 for a compare, will sell it off. Bought an Ayon Orthos XS purely to check on how it runs on Duettas because I could not compare it anywhere, and sold it off, lost money. I spend around 10k a year, maybe slightly less, just traveling for compares. Some of it is learning, sometimes I see a certainty

Compares is what I like doing and enjoy, in case you read only my Lampi posts. There is zero other interest. That's my hobby. All of you are in hifi for some OCD or the other. In fact my biggest issue with Pacific is that it is not transportable due to size, for shootouts.

If you and I have differences, they are not about AC and Lampi - I agree we agree on 97% of stuff including liking Apogee and horns, though in reverse order at times, and not liking the rest of the costly toy boxes, but it is the other 3%. You come on as too strong to promote your own recommendational agenda - running SETs on Apogees, calling that small Odeon you have a horn, and incessantly trying to invalidate my Lampi compare. You should have let it go as a post. There will be another one here or there by some other owners over the months to come.

Sorry, but you can easily run Apogees on SETs in a small room like I had and it works very well indeed. Same goes for Acoustats. Regarding my Odeons, you seem to know a lot about my speaker even though you for sure have never heard this model. You have a blind bias there. I call my "small" Odeon (if a 130cm tall 75Kg speaker can be called small) a horn because that is EXACTLY what it is. The tweeter is front horn loaded and the woofer is back horn loaded...simple as that and with a 98db/watt sensitivity as verification that it is not a vented box design. Ask around to those who have heard it...small it does not sound. Does it sound as big as an AG Trio? No, but more coherent than any AG demo I have heard yet.

The fact is that Wisnon pointed out that your blog shows "conclusively" that Lampi GG was better than Kassandra. I merely pointed out that it was your viewpoint (only after going to 242 tubes) that was being touted as "conclusive" and that the other listener there did not agree (which he obviously does not). Beyond that I have only pointed out that there were ZERO controls on the listening demo making it a meaingless comparison. You draw rather strong conclusions based on a flawed listening session. You are wrong if you think you have no bias there...any psychologist will tell you otherwise. That is not to say Flyer or myself are not also biased...any psychologist will tell you that too.
 

bonzo75

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Sorry, but you can easily run Apogees on SETs in a small room like I had and it works very well indeed. Same goes for Acoustats. Regarding my Odeons, you seem to know a lot about my speaker even though you for sure have never heard this model. You have a blind bias there. I call my "small" Odeon (if a 130cm tall 75Kg speaker can be called small) a horn because that is EXACTLY what it is. The tweeter is front horn loaded and the woofer is back horn loaded...simple as that and with a 98db/watt sensitivity as verification that it is not a vented box design. Ask around to those who have heard it...small it does not sound. Does it sound as big as an AG Trio? No, but more coherent than any AG demo I have heard yet.

The fact is that Wisnon pointed out that your blog shows "conclusively" that Lampi GG was better than Kassandra. I merely pointed out that it was your viewpoint (only after going to 242 tubes) that was being touted as "conclusive" and that the other listener there did not agree (which he obviously does not). Beyond that I have only pointed out that there were ZERO controls on the listening demo making it a meaingless comparison. You draw rather strong conclusions based on a flawed listening session. You are wrong if you think you have no bias there...any psychologist will tell you otherwise. That is not to say Flyer or myself are not also biased...any psychologist will tell you that too.

And I did say it was reverse when we had the 45s, AC was better (and flyer said he did not hear a difference there though I think he was being polite). Wisnon said that because you brought in Lampi in your previous post out of context. As a dealer you should be careful of doing any such compares.
Also he was citing from memory of a post read a year ago - I doubt he went back to verify exactly what it said.

Regarding the Acoustats, the Kronzilla integrated on it made my ears and acousticguru's bleed - it had low midbass, thin, low soundstage and was losing control on orchestral, a bit harsh, as compared to the other more powerful integrated.
 

853guy

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Hello gents,

Knowing each of you personally (although to greater and lesser degrees), I’ll stick my nose in to say this:

It all comes down to respect.

Respect is earned not by what one says, and certainly not by how many words or posts one takes to say it, but by actions. I have spent many hours in the company of Flyer, and a few in the company of Morricab, both of whom have come to represent Aries Cerat as a commercial concern. They are gentlemen, and although opinionated individuals, have displayed the type of integrity I consider worthy of respect. That they have skin in the game should not invalidate their opinions, but rather shows that after much evaluation, have considered their product lines carefully, thoughtfully, and believe they serve the best interests of their clients at their respective price points. Certainly, if money was the only concern, they would stand to make more by adopting brands that have greater cache and marketability. Do they have a vested interest? Yes, and have declared such.

Personally, I think the “compares” thing is best to be seen for what it is: One guy’s opinion based on preference. Without more robust consideration of impedance and level matching and system set up (so much more crucial for vinyl), all that’s happening is the assigning of preference. Internet opinions don’t hold much water other than the bucket they’re delivered in, and usually that bucket is the size of one guy. Even in cases in which opinions align, they are no more of less than that. That these preferential encounters provide valuable data points for us as a community is without question, and I’ve personally appreciated Bonzo’s attempt to hear gear that mainstream hi-fi media often bypass. That these opinions may change over time, as evidenced in Bonzo’s recent Koetsu encounter suggests that we hold them lightly, lest they take hold of us and we feel the need to defend them at all costs.

Is one approach more worthy of respect than the other? Not necessarily. It depends on the integrity of the individual in the moment, measured by their consistent actions over an elapsed period of time. That Flyer felt the need to clarify the situation surrounding Bonzo’s visit to hear the Kassandra in the midst of a culture that feeds on click-bait and salubrious declarations bordering on hyperbole is understandable - he has a lot more to lose personally by misappropriations of comments by various factions all contesting in the name of defending their own preferences than most others. Personally, I don’t see it as an attempt to “invalidate the comparison” - simply the need to recontextualize it because the internet continues to prove it has no mechanism for providing any of its own. The only context that matters to me is integrity and I have witnessed Flyer’s firsthand and repeatedly. To me it seems to be a commodity worth acquiring since it appears to be in short supply these days.

My hope is that going forward, those who are curious have a chance to evaluate the Kassandra for themselves (since this is, after all, a Kassandra thread), and realise that while words pale in comparison to actions, their ability to influence opinion is nevertheless undeniable, and we should be wary of their impact, especially in cases in which their effect on ourselves is less costly than their effect on someone else. In other words, it all comes down to respect.

I offer this as one man’s perspective, and limited to that.

Be well, friends.

853guy
 

bonzo75

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Personally, I don’t see it as an attempt to “invalidate the comparison” - simply the need to recontextualize it because the internet continues to prove it has no mechanism for providing any of its own. The only context that matters to me is integrity and I have witnessed Flyer’s firsthand and repeatedly. To me it seems to be a commodity worth acquiring since it appears to be in short supply these days.

My hope is that going forward, those who are curious have a chance to evaluate the Kassandra for themselves (since this is, after all, a Kassandra thread), and realise that while words pale in comparison to actions, their ability to influence opinion is nevertheless undeniable, and we should be wary of their impact, especially in cases in which their effect on ourselves is less costly than their effect on someone else. In other words, it all comes down to respect.

I offer this as one man’s perspective, and limited to that.

Be well, friends.

853guy

Well then, flyer should have clarified that on the thread where I shared the post, not now throwing guesses now a year later as to why I took the Lampi there. Regarding the fact this is a Kassandra thread, is exactly what we meant - Brad should not have brought in Lampi out of context.

And yes, personally I have much more interest in analog these days to really concern myself over any digital, so for me these threads are headaches. All recent Lampi - Cerat mentions have been pulled out by Brad, you can check. Btw, I actually recommended the Aries pre with some fellow Lampi owners because it matches so beautifully with 242s.
 

morricab

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And I did say it was reverse when we had the 45s, AC was better (and flyer said he did not hear a difference there though I think he was being polite). Wisnon said that because you brought in Lampi in your previous post out of context. As a dealer you should be careful of doing any such compares.
Also he was citing from memory of a post read a year ago - I doubt he went back to verify exactly what it said

I am sure he was being polite.
You know this for a fact or are you now reading minds? He told you he was citing from memory or that is your interpretation?

Regarding the Acoustats, the Kronzilla integrated on it made my ears and acousticguru's bleed - it had low midbass, thin, low soundstage and was losing control on orchestral, a bit harsh, as compared to the other more powerful integrated.

Whatever. My KR + Acoustat system was copied by at least 3 other people while I had it...I mean literally copied (one guy even copied the cables and digital source). This was by people with far more expensive systems that dumped them to make it (or added it to their collection of systems). Most who heard it were deeply influenced by it and one guy's girlfriend said pointedly to him "why can't your system sound like this...its so much more realistic". Now that was a shocker! It was not low in the midbass nor was it low in the soundstage (I assume you mean not deep with the word low). It had deep and expansive soundstage. If anything the mid-bass was almost too powerful because of a room mode (62Hz), which I cut at the target frequency by about 8db with a digital eq. When I added the really big panels (Acoustat Spectra 4400) as subwoofers, I had a system that was 20 to 20 nearly flat with awesome power being driven by two KR VA350is (Frequency divider at that time was an Accuphase F25 I got from Japan). A weak sounding system it was not and sounded bigger and more powerful than even my Infinity IRS Beta system (whatever its other flaws, sounding powerful was its fortè). And that is powerful indeed. All I can surmise is that you were pushing the system too hard. You cannot get 110 db peaks with big symphony...it will clip and get harsh sounding. But you can listen quite satisfyingly with peaks around 95db and lower (very low in fact and it stayed together.). Maybe you like it loud?
 

bonzo75

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Whatever. My KR + Acoustat system was copied by at least 3 other people while I had it...I mean literally copied (one guy even copied the cables and digital source). This was by people with far more expensive systems that dumped them to make it (or added it to their collection of systems). Most who heard it were deeply influenced by it and one guy's girlfriend said pointedly to him "why can't your system sound like this...its so much more realistic". Now that was a shocker! It was not low in the midbass nor was it low in the soundstage (I assume you mean not deep with the word low). It had deep and expansive soundstage. If anything the mid-bass was almost too powerful because of a room mode (62Hz), which I cut at the target frequency by about 8db with a digital eq. When I added the really big panels (Acoustat Spectra 4400) as subwoofers, I had a system that was 20 to 20 nearly flat with awesome power being driven by two KR VA350is (Frequency divider at that time was an Accuphase F25 I got from Japan). A weak sounding system it was not and sounded bigger and more powerful than even my Infinity IRS Beta system (whatever its other flaws, sounding powerful was its fortè). And that is powerful indeed. All I can surmise is that you were pushing the system too hard. You cannot get 110 db peaks with big symphony...it will clip and get harsh sounding. But you can listen quite satisfyingly with peaks around 95db and lower (very low in fact and it stayed together.). Maybe you like it loud?

I would say 85 to 90db. But that's where I always disagree with you, I like reserves, and I like drive. Even on small passages, at low volumes, SETs cannot drive such speakers. And I am all for SETs on horns, and will probably end up that way 99% if next room size allows.
 

morricab

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I would say 85 to 90db. But that's where I always disagree with you, I like reserves, and I like drive. Even on small passages, at low volumes, SETs cannot drive such speakers. And I am all for SETs on horns, and will probably end up that way 99% if next room size allows.

Well, you are always welcome to come and let me dispell you of the notion that my Odeons are not horns...:confused:
 

bonzo75

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Well, you are always welcome to come and let me dispell you of the notion that my Odeons are not horns...:confused:

Fair enough, next time I visit Christoph, who has bought the Universums, I will try to make it overnight. so can visit you the next day. That said, you should know my preference is to Universums and Trios more than Odeon 32 and 38 as well.
 

853guy

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Well then, flyer should have clarified that on the thread where I shared the post, not now throwing guesses now a year later as to why I took the Lampi there. Regarding the fact this is a Kassandra thread, is exactly what we meant - Brad should not have brought in Lampi out of context.

And yes, personally I have much more interest in analog these days to really concern myself over any digital, so for me these threads are headaches. All recent Lampi - Cerat mentions have been pulled out by Brad, you can check. Btw, I actually recommended the Aries pre with some fellow Lampi owners because it matches so beautifully with 242s.

Hi Bonzo,

I didn’t write the above as a defence of Flyer, or Morricab, or the Kassandra. I wrote it because I’ve heard the Kassandra three times now, and in all three cases in the company of Flyer.

I can’t nor want to speak for Flyer and what he “should” or “should not” have done in response to your blog post and subsequent posts here - that’s he’s attempting to provide additional context here seems reasonable to me in a thread dedicated to the Kassandra, and for the reasons I wrote above. Social media (including blogs and forums) is an avenue many of us are needing to learn to navigate carefully - I have certainly said things I later regretted and have needed to apologise for, and/or wished I had expressed differently or more clearly. Like I suggest, words are much easier to type than respect is to earn, and looking back on some of my exchanges I think I would have done better to let my silence do the talking than my fingers.

What I can confidently speak to is the way Flyer has related to me consistently over time, and that I consider they way he has done so to be exceptional among many of those with a vested interest - despite never having never bought/long-termed loaned/borrowed/home demoed a single piece of equipment from him. That I think the Kassandra is worth hearing, and for my money, is worth owning, may possibly be of little interest to anyone outside of those reading this thread, and perhaps, not even then.

Be well, Bonzo.

853guy
 

flyer

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Well then, flyer should have clarified that on the thread where I shared the post, not now throwing guesses now a year later as to why I took the Lampi there. Regarding the fact this is a Kassandra thread, is exactly what we meant - Brad should not have brought in Lampi out of context.

And yes, personally I have much more interest in analog these days to really concern myself over any digital, so for me these threads are headaches. All recent Lampi - Cerat mentions have been pulled out by Brad, you can check. Btw, I actually recommended the Aries pre with some fellow Lampi owners because it matches so beautifully with 242s.

My previous post was solely based on the statement by bonzo made in a post in this thread like: "And yes, Kassandra was better than GG with special 45s, though the GG was just superbly better with the 242s."

My post was to say that there is more than one truth... and has nothing to do with Wisnon or any other person making reference to this comparison.

As a matter of fact, I did clarify this in the original thread but as I said, I probably was too diplomatic. But if you wanted to not read between the lines, you can. Reading this 'one truth' over and over again on this and a few other forums, without any circumstancial information given, is effectively inviting to be more explicit. That's it. And let's leave 'vested interests' out of this. I chose the brand because I was (and still am) blown away by its sonic quality, nothing more or less.

And Bonzo, I like you and I respect you. I know, respect is something you earn not a given in my opinion, but I have only that many cheeks to give... Anyway, to go back to my diplomatic mode, I will not respond to the allegations in your post. For example, as if all my choices are solely made based on your recommendations, if that is how you want to call it... come on, edit this and let's have a beer next time you are around in Belgium. We have over a thousand different brands of them :cool:

Btw, thanks for your recommendations on the Aries preamps!
 

bonzo75

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Feb 26, 2014
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Hi Bonzo,

I didn’t write the above as a defence of Flyer, or Morricab, or the Kassandra. I wrote it because I’ve heard the Kassandra three times now, and in all three cases in the company of Flyer.

I can’t nor want to speak for Flyer and what he “should” or “should not” have done in response to your blog post and subsequent posts here - that’s he’s attempting to provide additional context here seems reasonable to me in a thread dedicated to the Kassandra, and for the reasons I wrote above. Social media (including blogs and forums) is an avenue many of us are needing to learn to navigate carefully - I have certainly said things I later regretted and have needed to apologise for, and/or wished I had expressed differently or more clearly. Like I suggest, words are much easier to type than respect is to earn, and looking back on some of my exchanges I think I would have done better to let my silence do the talking than my fingers.

What I can confidently speak to is the way Flyer has related to me consistently over time, and that I consider they way he has done so to be exceptional among many of those with a vested interest - despite never having never bought/long-termed loaned/borrowed/home demoed a single piece of equipment from him. That I think the Kassandra is worth hearing, and for my money, is worth owning, may possibly be of little interest to anyone outside of those reading this thread, and perhaps, not even then.

Be well, Bonzo.

853guy

Fair enough, and I agree with what you said about him
 

morricab

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Apr 25, 2014
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Switzerland
Fair enough, next time I visit Christoph, who has bought the Universums, I will try to make it overnight. so can visit you the next day. That said, you should know my preference is to Universums and Trios more than Odeon 32 and 38 as well.

Well, if you aren't going to come in with an open mind then perhaps skip it. I have heard 32s in the right kind of room for them and it was phenomenally good. Universums might be better but maybe are not.
 

bonzo75

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Feb 26, 2014
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Well, if you aren't going to come in with an open mind then perhaps skip it. I have heard 32s in the right kind of room for them and it was phenomenally good. Universums might be better but maybe are not.

I don't have any open/closed stake here. I am just telling you what I heard. I have heard 38s at Christoph's, and 32s at Michael's. I like Unis much more. I can see what shortcomings of Unis are compared to Trio and Apogees and a couple of custom built one-off horns I have heard, but not w.r.t Odeons. I just told you that coz I do not want further displeasure in case I do not like it after listening to it. What would you say if I had new Magico model and invited you over? (not comparing Odeon to Magico, btw)
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
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I don't have any open/closed stake here. I am just telling you what I heard. I have heard 38s at Christoph's, and 32s at Michael's. I like Unis much more. I can see what shortcomings of Unis are compared to Trio and Apogees and a couple of custom built one-off horns I have heard, but not w.r.t Odeons. I just told you that coz I do not want further displeasure in case I do not like it after listening to it. What would you say if I had new Magico model and invited you over? (not comparing Odeon to Magico, btw)

Which gear at Michael's? Did he have the Incito + Lamms? I think that was well before when you were there and it was with Crimson SS pre and amps. You didn't hear a fraction of what is possible. As for the 38s at Christoph, it seems bass is a challenge in his room...I don't think the Universums will be any different.
 

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