Audio Research REF6 vs. REF10 Preamp
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Hakan, you are doing us a wonderful service by comparing these. I will be really curious to learn your thoughts as I am interested in these preamps.
I had the opportunity to do a direct comparison of the ARC REF6 and REF10 preamps in a system that included an ARC REF CD9 player, ARC REF 150SE amp, Wilson Alexia speakers and Nordost loom of cables.
The REF10 preamp had a smoother and more refined midrange and treble, lower reaching and more robust deep bass, and a soundstage with substantially more width and depth than the REF6. However, what I wasn't expecting was the REF6 preamp's very different sonic signature. The soundstage was much more forward than the REF10, the attacks were more abrupt and the mid-bass was punchier, creating a very vibrant and more aggressive sound. In some ways this provided more immediacy to the music but at the expense of some edginess compared to the REF10's silky smooth midrange and treble. The best single word I can use to describe the REF6's sound is "ballsy", while the best single word to describe the REF10's sound is "refined".
The presentation of the REF10 and REF6 were different enough that I would say it comes down to a matter of personal taste as to which one a listener would prefer. While I really liked and could be happy with the overall sound of the REF6, being a lover of jazz vocals, jazz piano, jazz guitar and small jazz combos, the REF10's sound really did it for me.
Best,
Ken
The REF10 preamp had a smoother and more refined midrange and treble, lower reaching and more robust deep bass, and a soundstage with substantially more width and depth than the REF6. However, what I wasn't expecting was the REF6 preamp's very different sonic signature. The soundstage was much more forward than the REF10, the attacks were more abrupt and the mid-bass was punchier, creating a very vibrant and more aggressive sound. In some ways this provided more immediacy to the music but at the expense of some edginess compared to the REF10's silky smooth midrange and treble. The best single word I can use to describe the REF6's sound is "ballsy", while the best single word to describe the REF10's sound is "refined".
The presentation of the REF10 and REF6 were different enough that I would say it comes down to a matter of personal taste as to which one a listener would prefer. While I really liked and could be happy with the overall sound of the REF6, being a lover of jazz vocals, jazz piano, jazz guitar and small jazz combos, the REF10's sound really did it for me.
Best,
Ken
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Yes, the REF10 is really fine but at less than half the price, the REF6 is amazing too. I could see those who primarily listen to Rock and Roll possibly preferring it due to its more aggressive sonic signature.
There are currently some misconceptions out there that the REF6 has some technological advancements over the REF10. After researching it, I found this to be untrue. The REF6 technology is purely trickle down from the REF10. However, the REF6 does have material advancements over the REF5SE. To break it down, the REF5SE uses, per channel, one 6H30 tube for its input stage and one 6H30 tube for its output stage. The REF6 uses, per channel, two 6H30 tubes for its input stage and one 6H30 tube for its output stage. The REF 10 uses, per channel, two 6H30 tubes for its input stage and two 6H30 tubes for its output stage. Yes, the REF10 is essentially two REF5SE's, but the REF10SE or REF11, whenever it comes out, will not be two REF6's. This is because the REF6 bridges the gap between the REF5SE and REF10. The REF6 has improved coupling capacitors and power supply over the REF5SE but the REF10 already has these improvements or better. From my discussions with ARC, the REF10SE or REF11 is a long way off because they are still improving other components in their line from trickle down technology based on the REF10's design.
Best,
Ken
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An excellent post Ken, you have summarised the similarities and dissimilarities quite succinctly.
Having spent some time with my previous 5se, and latterly with the 10, tube rolling either or both with NOS vintage 6550's and a little more trixily, pre 1990's 6h30 DR's I can attest to an evolution in both single and double PS modules, however IMHO even more exponentially with the latter, you have not yet heard what the 10 is capable of on stock Valvage alone.
Having spent some time with my previous 5se, and latterly with the 10, tube rolling either or both with NOS vintage 6550's and a little more trixily, pre 1990's 6h30 DR's I can attest to an evolution in both single and double PS modules, however IMHO even more exponentially with the latter, you have not yet heard what the 10 is capable of on stock Valvage alone.
Thanks Harlequin for the tube rolling suggestions. It will be interesting to try these options and experience the lift in performance that NOS vintage tubes can provide to an already terrific sounding component in the REF10.
Best,
Ken
Thank you for your review Ken. I am not surprised that the REF 10 would be more of everything that is good especially considering the gulf in price. I am sure it is a phenomenal preamp and would expect nothing less from ARC.
One thing that cannot be overlooked is that every component will sound somewhat different in a given application. I consider it an important and final step in the decision making process to demo a given component in my own room before drawing a conclusion.
For some perspective here is my impression of the REF 6 in comparison to the REF 5SE. My system is comprised of an ARC REF 6 and GS150 amp, source is a Lumin S1 DAC, Acoustic Zen Crescendo MKII speakers. Cables are Acoustic Zen Absolute Copper and power cords are Shunyata Alpha HC. Source componets are connected to a Shunyata Triton on its own deadicated 20 amp. The GS150 is connected directly to its own dedicated 20 amp outlet.
Immediately the first thing I noticed was the soundstage was set further back. The soundstage width and height also reach further than they did with the REF 5 SE. The REF 6 is also quicker sounding than the 5. The REF 6 floats very solid images between the speakers. The bass noticeably extends further and is tighter with the REF 6 in place.
In comparison the REF 5 is more forward sounding and somewhat looser in the low bass. Compared to the REF 6 I would say the exact opposite is true. Something really impressive to me is the delivery of musical information from the REF 6. It is much more holistic, cut from the same cloth if you will, and comes across as more of a musical event than a summing sounds. With the REF 6 everything is more lifelike in its delivery. It sounds sweeter, but realistic at the same time. The mid-band is also fuller sounding and lends weight in the region where the human voice resides. I have not heard a more lifelike presentation of the human voice until hearing the 6 in my system.
Labeling the REF 6 as better suited to rock is a miss categorization in my opinion. Of course when the music calls for it, say something like Dire Straits, dynamics and grit are on full display. In contrast nuance and delicacy are appreciable, especially on albums like Patricia Berber’s Modern Cool. I listen mostly to classical music and large orchestral suites and find the combination incisive, dynamic and very melodic. If you want to hear an orchestra with all its life like dynamics the REF 6 is just amazing at conveying this information!
Finally I’ll just add that I am listening to much more of everything musically and don’t feel beholden to a specific genre of music. To me this is the highest compliment I can give a piece of equipment.
All the best,
Eric
Hi Eric,
Thanks for your excellent review comparing the REF6 and the REF5SE. Very interesting reading. Just for the record, I was not pigeon holing the REF6 just as a "rock and roll" preamp. I've done extensive auditioning with it and it sounds great on every type of music. My point was compared to the REF10 for jazz, it's no contest. However, for rock and roll, the REF6 more than holds its own and some listeners may even prefer it.
Best,
Ken
I would echo the above comments. I would also opine that the Ref 6 presented music in a more relaxed and at ease manner compared to the ref 5SE. Piano key carries more of a weight and at the same time, floats effortlessly. I used the ref 6 to drive dan d'agostino momentum stereo amp.
Reviving an old thread. Sold my Ref 5SE and will be installing the new Ref 10 on Saturday when I get back to California. I am so excited!!!
Congratulations Sharp! You’re going to love the REF10. Every time I listen to mine, it blows me away with its sound quality. Keep in mind that it takes 600 hours for the capacitors to fully break in, so you will hear fluctuations in sound quality until then. Mine now has nearly 1100 hours and it sounds phenomenal.
Enjoy,
Ken
My Ref 10 phono is stunning. Could not be more happy. I still don't understand how they keep the noise floor so low in a tube phono stage (even though ARC cheats a bit with extremely low-noise FETs used in the high- gain section). Dynamics and imaging are really mesmerizing.
PS - Hi Ken! (Its FlexAud from AS.)
Hi Paul,
Congrats on the REF10 Phono! It is a stunning component and as you said, super quiet. Your vinyl rig must sound incredible. Glad to see you posting again!
All the best,
Ken
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