Audionet Scientist Series: Humboldt Integrated vs Stern and Heisenberg Separates : Having Your Cake and Eating it Too?
- Thread starter musicfirst1
- Start date
I ended up with a Antipodes K50.
This one box / two computer, server / player is easy to set up with multiple software options, but needs to be left on- at 72 hours it is all warmed up and sounds fantastic!
For Tidal & Qobuz streaming i use the Aqua LinQ + Aqua Formula xHD Rev 2 combo.
What i like best about this combo is the I2S connection between the 2 units therefore you avoid USB connection.
Also being able to use AQPlayer core makes a big difference in sound quality for peolple streaming only.
If you also do local playback you'd better get Antipodes, Pink Faun or 432 Evo music servers.
What i like best about this combo is the I2S connection between the 2 units therefore you avoid USB connection.
Also being able to use AQPlayer core makes a big difference in sound quality for peolple streaming only.
If you also do local playback you'd better get Antipodes, Pink Faun or 432 Evo music servers.
Last edited:
I had a brief audition of the Humboldt at home. Unfortunately, we didn't have too much time but I could get a sense of its sonics that I will try to share here. My integrated is a Diablo 300 so I could compare them directly.
The Diablo is not a small amplifier but the humboldt dwarfs it in comparison. It's big and heavy and makes no apologies for it.
Get ready to replace your rack.
When we started playing music, it was not right. The sound was a bit glassy, no soundstage, not the expected dynamics.
I had a hunch it came from the power cable and decided to swap it for something else.
It was immediately better, I think this amp needs a lot of juice and a small gauge to perform fully.
The first thing that struck me and the first word that came to mind was liquidity.
The sound is just flowing, it made the diablo sound mechanical in comparison, it really sounds effortless and fluid.
If I had to compare the two, think of the diablo as an older Audi RS3 or RS4 and the Humboldt as a Porsche Taycan Turbo S.
Quiet, linear, smooth, powerful, fast, stable, refined. Must be a german thing.
The second thing that I noticed was how polished the sound is. An image that came to mind is one of a perfectly polished steel ball bearing.
It is very solid yet there's absolutely no grain, no edges, no coloration, nothing. Never bright nor shiny either.
The third attribute that popped out is the lightness. Everything seems to float around with ease.
Another image that came to mind is think of the diablo as a homemade whipped cream you do at home with a whisk and the Humboldt as a very light chantilly from a 3 michelin star restaurant.
The texture and density from the humboldt is light, airy and nimble, the diablo is dense in comparison.
Fourth. The soundstage. I would say the soundstage grew in all directions by a factor of 2.
The combination of lightness and fluidity really helped in expanding the sound and filling up the room and not at the expense of precision.
Everything is perfectly placed but nothing is forced on you.
Fifth. Bass. If you think the diablo was good with bass control and definition, well the humboldt completely made any bloom disappear around bass notes and limited resonances. A lot of bass definition which eventually helped all the way up.
Overall, I think I probably only heard a small percentage of the amp capability, I think this is a piece that you can take quite far if you spend the time to find the right synergies with it. To put it in another way, I don't think the limitations will come from this device but from the components around it.
I wish I had more time to listen, I would probably have been able to dive deeper into tone, textures, microdetails, etc but hopefully I will as I have started negotiating with the dealer.
The Diablo is not a small amplifier but the humboldt dwarfs it in comparison. It's big and heavy and makes no apologies for it.
Get ready to replace your rack.
When we started playing music, it was not right. The sound was a bit glassy, no soundstage, not the expected dynamics.
I had a hunch it came from the power cable and decided to swap it for something else.
It was immediately better, I think this amp needs a lot of juice and a small gauge to perform fully.
The first thing that struck me and the first word that came to mind was liquidity.
The sound is just flowing, it made the diablo sound mechanical in comparison, it really sounds effortless and fluid.
If I had to compare the two, think of the diablo as an older Audi RS3 or RS4 and the Humboldt as a Porsche Taycan Turbo S.
Quiet, linear, smooth, powerful, fast, stable, refined. Must be a german thing.
The second thing that I noticed was how polished the sound is. An image that came to mind is one of a perfectly polished steel ball bearing.
It is very solid yet there's absolutely no grain, no edges, no coloration, nothing. Never bright nor shiny either.
The third attribute that popped out is the lightness. Everything seems to float around with ease.
Another image that came to mind is think of the diablo as a homemade whipped cream you do at home with a whisk and the Humboldt as a very light chantilly from a 3 michelin star restaurant.
The texture and density from the humboldt is light, airy and nimble, the diablo is dense in comparison.
Fourth. The soundstage. I would say the soundstage grew in all directions by a factor of 2.
The combination of lightness and fluidity really helped in expanding the sound and filling up the room and not at the expense of precision.
Everything is perfectly placed but nothing is forced on you.
Fifth. Bass. If you think the diablo was good with bass control and definition, well the humboldt completely made any bloom disappear around bass notes and limited resonances. A lot of bass definition which eventually helped all the way up.
Overall, I think I probably only heard a small percentage of the amp capability, I think this is a piece that you can take quite far if you spend the time to find the right synergies with it. To put it in another way, I don't think the limitations will come from this device but from the components around it.
I wish I had more time to listen, I would probably have been able to dive deeper into tone, textures, microdetails, etc but hopefully I will as I have started negotiating with the dealer.
Last edited:
I kind of like the idea of an integrated offering this level of performance.
I was contemplating the idea of gryphon essence pre + amp but I believe sonically the Humboldt should be above.
According to many reviewers too, it seems you'd be hard pressed to find separates in the same price range that would beat it.
I heard someone replaced his soulution 5 separates for the humboldt and was happy with the change.
Do you have any recommendations for separates?
It depends on your location. In the United States I would look at Boulder's latest 1000 series. If you are in the EU the Soulution, and Dartzeel are popular for good reason. Vitus has a pretty high end integrated as well. These are all likely to be different flavors of good and great..
I can see the Humbolt being a great place to stop, especially if you just had a great in home audition.
I can see the Humbolt being a great place to stop, especially if you just had a great in home audition.
I'm not in the US so Boulder is not a great buy here in terms of value.
It is my feeling that to surpass this unit with separates, you'd have to spend a lot more. Like Stern / Heisenberg more
To me, the Scientist "house" sound combines the power / control of Soulution /Dartzeel with the liquidity and fullness of sound from the Vitus, hence its appeal.
An italian magazine measured the Humboldt.
I translated from Italian so it's not perfect but it's readable.
The whole review is actually quite complete.
This review is also nice
I translated from Italian so it's not perfect but it's readable.
The whole review is actually quite complete.
This review is also nice
https://en.audionet.de/wp-content/uploads/OZ-audionet-AR427mac-8.pdf
This article makes a very good point- when they started, they connected up multiple sources, using more than one set of RCAs . They thought Humboldt sounded great, but a little unimpressive in the treble such that it fell slightly below reference level. Then they disconnected the others and went to a single pair of RCAs and thought it was the best Integrated they'd ever heard.
My experience is the same- I find that using one single pair of RCAs sounds better than two pairs (no matter WHAT is connected to the second pair) - I don't know why this happens.
Also, I find RCA (or "cinch") connectors are better than XLR.
For me, when two sources are connected (obviously only one is selected) it sounds really really good- when only ONE source is connected: it's magic! Pellucid, accurate, dreamy, relaxing, saturated realistic sound full of unforced detail. Just so good.
I've never heard any 100K amps, but if they are better than Humboldt then they are almost unbelievable!
This article makes a very good point- when they started, they connected up multiple sources, using more than one set of RCAs . They thought Humboldt sounded great, but a little unimpressive in the treble such that it fell slightly below reference level. Then they disconnected the others and went to a single pair of RCAs and thought it was the best Integrated they'd ever heard.
My experience is the same- I find that using one single pair of RCAs sounds better than two pairs (no matter WHAT is connected to the second pair) - I don't know why this happens.
Also, I find RCA (or "cinch") connectors are better than XLR.
For me, when two sources are connected (obviously only one is selected) it sounds really really good- when only ONE source is connected: it's magic! Pellucid, accurate, dreamy, relaxing, saturated realistic sound full of unforced detail. Just so good.
I've never heard any 100K amps, but if they are better than Humboldt then they are almost unbelievable!
My understanding is that the issue doesn't come from plugging multiple sources but just XLR vs RCA and that RCA sounds better on this amp.
Do you mean that when you plug two devices in RCA on two different inputs it sounds better if you unplug one? That's odd
"""
The listening sessions started with the Playback Design MPD-8 DAC connected in balanced, not because I consider this type of connection superior in absolute, but simply because I had available XLR terminated cables long enough to avoid excessive contortions. Apart from the strange behavior of the volume knob, for which the amplifier showed signs of life starting from about -35 dB, the performance was immediately interesting, showing what is one of the qualifying features of the Humboldt, namely a delivery capacity that makes it appear "infinite".
At any level you play it, even very loud, this amp handles dynamic variations with exciting naturalness. In some ways it reminded me of a car I owned many years ago, which with its 3500 c.c. always gave the feeling of having ample margin to push it further; moreover, given the sporty nature of that car, it was never boring to drive. Here, the Humboldt is never "soft", on the contrary it is fast and responsive, but unlike other cars that tend to "throw them in your face", here they are expressed without too much clamor, just with grace and naturalness. Again, I was struck by the ability to articulate the bass range and the energy associated with it that made the four woofers of my Vivid Audio Kaya 90 "fly". In particular, I am referring to those moments when the double bass section plays at a low level, building a sort of sound carpet on which the rest of the score unfolds.
Here, in these moments one can clearly perceive the body, the texture, the color of the instruments, without any effort and without having to go looking for them; they are there, with all the energy of which they would be capable, if it were not that in that precise moment they are playing softly. Shifting the focus of the analysis towards the higher registers I found that the string sections were a bit less in focus than I'm used to hearing them with my reference amplification; this happened not on one track in particular but in general. The same could be said for the piano, which seemed slightly less focused or, if you prefer the expression, lacking in detail.
This seemed strange to me, as both the source and the speakers are above suspicion; anyway I replaced the DAC but, also with the Aqua La Scala MKII, the sensation remained the same. A marked improvement was manifested when I switched to the turntable where the problem completely disappeared, revealing a dreamy midrange. However, I must point out that in this case I was using one of the unbalanced inputs, as my Allnic has no balanced outputs.
At that point I thought of doing a test: connecting also the DACs in unbalanced. The move proved to be decisive, as all the doubts I mentioned earlier completely disappeared, allowing me to better enjoy the different sonic personalities of the two excellent DACs.To be sure that the problem was not attributable to a specific cable, I performed listening tests with another set of interconnects of which I have both versions, RCA and XLR, confirming what I found previously. In particular, I was able to appreciate a midrange really admirable and out of the ordinary: rich in detail and color, able to return the subtlest textures of any instrument in an admirable way, giving the sound almost a sense of palpability.
This is particularly beneficial for string instruments such as guitars, where you can lose yourself in savouring the timbral details, the speed of the pizzicato, the correct temporal decay of the sounds. One more thing about my system, aided by the Humboldt, with regards to the spatial image restitution capabilities: at these levels you can expect excellent performances and in fact my expectations were not disappointed.
With the "right" tracks, not only each instrument is placed in the right position on the three axes in space, but you can also perceive a record stability and a beautiful ability to return the contours of each sound contribution, making it easy to read even the most intricate and complex sound amalgam. I have no doubt in asserting that the Audionet Humboldt is a neutral and analytical amplifier.
Adjectives that could suggest a certain coldness but this is not the case. On the contrary: a cold, detached amplifier could not induce hours and hours of passionate listening as it happened with the Humboldt. In conclusion, I think this is the umpteenth proof that the superintegrated typology, of which this Audionet is one of the best representatives, really makes sense. It's just a pity that the prohibitive cost limits dramatically the diffusion.
"""
I have not heard seperates that come close within the Humboldt‘s price range. It is an awesome amp, not just an excellent integrated amp
.
Last edited:
How long was the break in? Was it painful or it was ok?I have not heard seperates that come close within the Humboldt‘s price range. It is a awesome amp, not just an excellent integrated amp
Which interconnect and power cables are you using?
 | Steve Williams Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator |  | Ron Resnick Site Owner | Administrator |  | Julian (The Fixer) Website Build | Marketing Managersing |