Burmester 911 mk3
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Hi
I would like to listen to a Burmester /Magico system. I don’t think the 911 would have any problem driving the Q series.. The Q5 in a large room may require the bridged/monos .. and even there. If Spectral can adequately drive Magico and I know they do so will the 911. Several years ago we had a shootout and we had a Spectral DMA-180 vs the Burmester 911 on a MBL 101 .. The Spectral was straining even at moderately high volume level .. Not the 911
The Q5 is inefficient but all the others "Q" are moderately efficient and relatively well - behaved impedance-wise none going under 2.8 Ohms (Q3) . I would go without much hesitation
BTW ... The Q3 made a strong impression on me. There is something right about the Q3 and this at first listen, from the first note ... An absence of extraneous "noise" for the lack of a better word .. Music just come out whatever the SPL, no shuffling , no cabinet noise no driver noise. This absence of "noise" becomes more remarkable when you listen to other speakers ... with the Q3 you hear just the sound of the recording with nothing else added, just the facts and the clean facts... An impressive speaker. ... Very high on my list.
Since this is a Burmester thread, I am closing on an agreeable Burmester deal; still don't have adequate room but what the heck! It'll stay in storage for a while
I would like to listen to a Burmester /Magico system. I don’t think the 911 would have any problem driving the Q series.. The Q5 in a large room may require the bridged/monos .. and even there. If Spectral can adequately drive Magico and I know they do so will the 911. Several years ago we had a shootout and we had a Spectral DMA-180 vs the Burmester 911 on a MBL 101 .. The Spectral was straining even at moderately high volume level .. Not the 911
The Q5 is inefficient but all the others "Q" are moderately efficient and relatively well - behaved impedance-wise none going under 2.8 Ohms (Q3) . I would go without much hesitation
BTW ... The Q3 made a strong impression on me. There is something right about the Q3 and this at first listen, from the first note ... An absence of extraneous "noise" for the lack of a better word .. Music just come out whatever the SPL, no shuffling , no cabinet noise no driver noise. This absence of "noise" becomes more remarkable when you listen to other speakers ... with the Q3 you hear just the sound of the recording with nothing else added, just the facts and the clean facts... An impressive speaker. ... Very high on my list.
Since this is a Burmester thread, I am closing on an agreeable Burmester deal; still don't have adequate room but what the heck! It'll stay in storage for a while
Frantz,
I would write the same words on the Aida's when properly amplified - once I got used to its absence of noise, I feel difficult to go to other great speakers, that can even have other better characteristics. It is the only speaker that does not make me permanently think about full range electrostatics - 80% of my audiophile life was spent with ESl63 or SoundLabs.
I would not mind evaluating a complete Burmester system on the Aida's ...
I am getting more and more interested by the Aida. I have had a certain amount of prejudiced against Sonus Faber, I must admit. I did find their sound in the late 90's too much of a colored one. Call it the cinemascope type of over saturation of musical colors (if that makes sense
) ... I did like the Sonus Faber Electa Amator immensely, one of the few mini-monitors I could live with and happily then ... I didn't like the Extrema which by the way I heard with Burmester 909 and of course with the 911 .. I have been told SF sound has changed toward more neutral while maintaining the richness of tones SF has been famous for. One more thing: I was however pleased by the mid-bass of a large SF, The Cremona I think , but the mid and highs were syrupy IMO ... then again it might have been the tube amps that was used to drive them ...Now what do you mean by properly amplified? Are they (Aida) a difficult load? I know you love ARC (same parent company I think) but I have heard reports of these sounding great with Krell, d'Agostino and some other SS and tubes amplifiers and electronics.
Since we tease each other regularly I would not call the ESL 63 full range ... The Soundlabs ? Oh Yeah! Seem to be the case for all their models
Bob Grossman (Philadelphia Orchestra) is getting the 911 to wrap up his AVShowrooms review of the excellent Genesis 5.3 (I'm jealous).
I really like them with ARC, Jeff of Toneaudio tested them with Pass. Ivan of Audioaficionado has them with three Burmester 911 mk3 in a full Burmester system and it seems Myles liked it. They also sounded very good with the DartZeel NH108b in my room, but I felt they would need more power - the soundstage does not expand as well as with other amplifiers I have used. Two premier 350 solid state amplifiers from conrad johnson operated in by-amplifcation with the ART series 3 also sound great. Curiously the d'Agostino stereo was a disaster in my system - maybe a mismatch with the ARC preamplfier and source.
The Aida's can be a real though load - it depends on the settings. Once you switch the back units on and take the level controls from the minimum the impedance starts lowering significantly. And the efficiency is lower than specified - around 90 not 92dB/W.
The full range was a mistake - I meant electrostatic panel covering the full range of the speaker. BTW, SoundLab manufactured an hybrid, the Dynatast - I never listened to it.
Hi Peter,
I just want to say I love your videos on youtube. Great job and I can see that it makes you happy
IMO Aida isn't worth the price. There are many better speakers on the market today at this price level. For Example WA Alexia or Magico Q3 (half price of Aida) are better for me. Seriously.
Back to the Burmester - which cables do you use guys with yours Burmester gears? I heard many opinion that Burmester is insensitive for good and expensive IC cables, but loves the best AC and speakers cables.
I just want to say I love your videos on youtube. Great job and I can see that it makes you happy
IMO Aida isn't worth the price. There are many better speakers on the market today at this price level. For Example WA Alexia or Magico Q3 (half price of Aida) are better for me. Seriously.
Back to the Burmester - which cables do you use guys with yours Burmester gears? I heard many opinion that Burmester is insensitive for good and expensive IC cables, but loves the best AC and speakers cables.
Hi Peter,
I just want to say I love your videos on youtube. Great job and I can see that it makes you happy
IMO Aida isn't worth the price. There are many better speakers on the market today at this price level. For Example WA Alexia or Magico Q3 (half price of Aida) are better for me. Seriously.
I'm glad I waited until somebody else wrote exactly my thoughts
The Aida is an extremely overpriced speaker. Nothing with such an obvious roll off should cost that much.There's absolutely no comparison between the Q3 and an Aida, the Q3 beats it handily in all aspects.
panjan, if you were impressed with the Soulution+Q7, what you'll get with Burmester+Q7 is likely less transparency, but much, MUCH more punch and bass/midbass weight, which is a Soulution deficiency.
alexandre
Panjan,
All we need now is someone telling that (I am partially quoting your post) " IMO WA Alexia (or Magico Q3) isn't worth the price. There are many better speakers on the market today at this price level. For Example XXX or ZZZ (half price of the WA Alexia (or Magico Q3)) are better for me. Seriously."
Then we will have a speaker much better than the Aida at 1/4 the price. If some one also adds his constructive and well thought comments we will soon have speakers at 1/8 , 1/16 or even 1/32 of the price of the Aida's bettering it . Seriously.
I'm glad I waited until somebody else wrote exactly my thoughts
Alexandre,
Perhaps the Aida's are not your cup of tea, and I can easily accept it, but I would like to add the Aida's are well known for the extreme quality of their treble. And if you need more treble they have a tilt up control. And yes, used with the DartZeel NH108b that can sound rolled off if they are not used with speaker cables that compensate for the treble finesse and delicatessen of both speaker and amplifier.
Attachments
microstrip,
Sorry, but I don't know what you mean
For me Aida is maximum overpriced. No energy, no brightness, muddy, fuzzy soundstage. Only a violin played well on these speakers. But remeber - this is only my opinion.
Can I ask what was the complete system being used with the Aida's? I can understand that you prefer a more energetic speaker but your description suggests a poor setup - Aida's are known for an airy sound and exceptional soundstage. And also for sounding miserable in poor or inadequate setup's - like most great speakers, as the Q7. (May be we should move to an Aida thread, this is a Burmester thread, that has been reported to sound excellent on the Aida's).
microstrip,
I haven't, unfortunately, heard the Aida with the darTZeel. I wish I did, as perhaps some of the darTZeel goodness might've rubbed off on it Just joking!
I've heard it with AR Ref 250 + AR Anniv. 40th pre, AR CD 8, in a treated room in a NYC dealer. Played lots of different stuff, and it sounded to me like a big Futura, with less punch, though. I've also heard it with McIntosh 1.2kW. The less said about this the better.
I still think, for my taste (and my pockets), it's extremely overpriced.
Maybe in a different setup, in a different room. As I said in the "aural memory" thread, impressions is usually what we end up with, and for me, the impressions weren't good, at all.
I understand you have one at home, where you can play at all, move it around, change cables, etc. I'm sure you're getting great sound from it, but that doesn't mean it can't be an overpriced speaker, and if you put a Q3 in there, you might as well agree with us
alexandre
I haven't, unfortunately, heard the Aida with the darTZeel. I wish I did, as perhaps some of the darTZeel goodness might've rubbed off on it
Just joking!I've heard it with AR Ref 250 + AR Anniv. 40th pre, AR CD 8, in a treated room in a NYC dealer. Played lots of different stuff, and it sounded to me like a big Futura, with less punch, though. I've also heard it with McIntosh 1.2kW. The less said about this the better.
I still think, for my taste (and my pockets), it's extremely overpriced.
Maybe in a different setup, in a different room. As I said in the "aural memory" thread, impressions is usually what we end up with, and for me, the impressions weren't good, at all.
I understand you have one at home, where you can play at all, move it around, change cables, etc. I'm sure you're getting great sound from it, but that doesn't mean it can't be an overpriced speaker, and if you put a Q3 in there, you might as well agree with us
alexandre
(...) I understand you have one at home, where you can play at all, move it around, change cables, etc. I'm sure you're getting great sound from it, but that doesn't mean it can't be an overpriced speaker, and if you put a Q3 in there, you might as well agree with us
alexandre
Alexandre,
I have listened to the several Magico Qx's in the same setup I usually listened to Aida's. IMHO the only one that really is on par with the Aida's is the Q7. Perhaps the Q5 would be also a great speaker for me if it was not for the exclusion of reasonable power tubed amplifiers.
Properly amplified the Aida has a scale quite similar to the Alexandria X2 or my SoundLab's in my room - the smaller speakers do not manage to fill the whole space in a similar way. My personal feeling based on only a few listening sessions is that I would prefer the Alexia to the Q3 by a wide margin in this aspect.
But, as usual, these are only my preferences with my preferred music. Not enough to say that X is better than Y. In my country the same distributor handles Wilson Audio, Magico and Sonus Faber - this makes listening to them much easier.
Back to the 911 mk3. I must listen to it sometime!
All I can say is lucky you! Being able to listen to all these top brands, and decide what works best for you!
alexandre
panjan - as I told you numerous times in our conversations, you need to get the speakers FIRST. It doesn't have to be the Q7 (although the Q7s are probably as good as you can get right now) - it applies to any speaker you are gonna get.
When you have the speakers, you need to borrow the lines you are interested in and listen for yourself. With the exeption of Gryphon, all the brands you are interested in - Soulution, Burmester, Dag Momentum, Vitus, darTZeel (stereo only) - are available locally for audition.
3 days of listening in your system, will tell you much more than 3 months spent on researchnig the forums.
When you have the speakers, you need to borrow the lines you are interested in and listen for yourself. With the exeption of Gryphon, all the brands you are interested in - Soulution, Burmester, Dag Momentum, Vitus, darTZeel (stereo only) - are available locally for audition.
3 days of listening in your system, will tell you much more than 3 months spent on researchnig the forums.
Hi Elberoth,
It's nice to see you here
As you know, on "our" pl forum it's hard to get reliable information and sometimes it doesn't brag about what you listened to, where, and what is your opinion about it.
I have to limit my choice for 3-4 amps. I did a little research and I'll get to listen MP-M201, 911mk3, Gryphon Colosseum or Mephisto. The NHB-458 will be tough, but I wonder about ordering without listening session... Big cojones? Maybe But I don't think that I'll be disappointed. If Dartzeel will be not good, I'll sell this amp with a little loss in value... I hope
I order my Q7s soon (next week probably). I start to built my listening room at the moment.
Back to Burmester - still one of the best one-comapany full system I've heard. IMO better than more expensive Soulution, which I thought as the best recently.
It's nice to see you here
As you know, on "our" pl forum it's hard to get reliable information and sometimes it doesn't brag about what you listened to, where, and what is your opinion about it.
I have to limit my choice for 3-4 amps. I did a little research and I'll get to listen MP-M201, 911mk3, Gryphon Colosseum or Mephisto. The NHB-458 will be tough, but I wonder about ordering without listening session... Big cojones?
Maybe But I don't think that I'll be disappointed. If Dartzeel will be not good, I'll sell this amp with a little loss in value... I hope I order my Q7s soon (next week probably). I start to built my listening room at the moment.
Back to Burmester - still one of the best one-comapany full system I've heard. IMO better than more expensive Soulution, which I thought as the best recently.
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