Yeah but the Vega (another Asian competitor) hides the circuit in a shiny box and gives it a fancy name. So I'm not sure what's in there.
Chinese DAC shames a few heavy hitters
- Thread starter nc42acc
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Yeah but the Vega (another Asian competitor) hides the circuit in a shiny box and gives it a fancy name. So I'm not sure what's in there.
Gustard X20U is not the only China-made dual-ESS9018 usb DAC. There are several similar products in Mainland China but the most popular one in Hong Kong is the LKS MH-DA003.
It is of bigger size than the Gustard X20U and contains a bigger power-supply section.
The original onboard clock chip is the Crystek 957 already, further upgrade not needed.
There are 4 opamps in the analog section. They are on opamp sockets so opamp-rolling is just plug-&-play.
The USB card is the Amanero from Italy.
LKS provides an upgrade option on another aspect : A modified Amanero usb reception card which has Crystek 957 femto clock chips onboard and a dedicated psu board for Amanero :
It is of bigger size than the Gustard X20U and contains a bigger power-supply section.
The original onboard clock chip is the Crystek 957 already, further upgrade not needed.
There are 4 opamps in the analog section. They are on opamp sockets so opamp-rolling is just plug-&-play.
The USB card is the Amanero from Italy.
LKS provides an upgrade option on another aspect : A modified Amanero usb reception card which has Crystek 957 femto clock chips onboard and a dedicated psu board for Amanero :
Yes I'm quite familiar with that one as well. I was wondering how it would compare against the Gustard. The only thing, it doesn't have the modular boards, or the discrete output stage. But it does have DIP8 socketed opamps. This guy here replaced them with the killer Sonic Imagery's I linked to earlier in the thread:
I wonder anybody have done a comparison between Sonic Imagery opamp & Burson's new Gen5 opamp?
Yes there has been. The sonic's kill everything out there. Even the Sparko's which also kill the Bursons. They are also not shy to provide a comprehensive datasheet
Subjective tastes may differ, but these are my results based on experience. Sparko's highly recommended as well though. Much smaller size too.
I will say between the Dexa's, Bursons, Sonic's and Sparko's, they are all much better than any IC I've tried.
Yes there has been. The sonic's kill everything out there. Even the Sparko's which also kill the Bursons. They are also not shy to provide a comprehensive datasheet
Subjective tastes may differ, but these are my results based on experience. Sparko's highly recommended as well though. Much smaller size too.
I will say between the Dexa's, Bursons, Sonic's and Sparko's, they are all much better than any IC I've tried.
What's wrong with the best of the integrated circuit op amps?
If you want to be specific, here is one in my stuff:
http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/lme49860.pdf
Yes there has been. The sonic's kill everything out there. Even the Sparko's which also kill the Bursons. They are also not shy to provide a comprehensive datasheet
Subjective tastes may differ, but these are my results based on experience. Sparko's highly recommended as well though. Much smaller size too.
I will say between the Dexa's, Bursons, Sonic's and Sparko's, they are all much better than any IC I've tried.
I may take you on that and try Sonic Imagery opamps.
Is it better to try on I/V or LPF or both? As a matter of fact, Sonic Imagery would not fit on both...
In the picture you posted was I/V, right?
From what I hear it's not what's on the datasheet's where the problem lies, it's what's not on the datasheet. I won't claim to be an expert on all the details, but from what I was told it's the performance under 100Hz that causes trouble with IC opamps.
Yes quite familiar with that opamp. But see above comment.
Sonic Imagery 994, Sparko Lab's SS3602 and TI LM4562. The 3 subjects in my last round of opamp testing.
What kind of trouble does the performance under 100Hz cause?
What do you see in your testing?
Here's the source of that picture. The guy goes into pretty good detail about the configuration and why he chose the SI 994's over the others. Maybe the Sparko's would fit in the I/V place and the SI's in the 2nd??
http://www.head-fi.org/t/745032/lks-audio-mh-da003/75
It was explained to me, but I don't remember the vivid details, so I'm not the best one to ask on this. Something about heat that's generated inside the IC that can't be dissipated as well as a discrete circuit can. The class A bias up to 30Ma may help as well.
All I can say is the SI LAB's 994's measure impeccably, and sound much better than the LM4562's in my application. Comparing the 2, the LM4562's have a bit of a plasticy sound to them. Although hard to tell until they are both compared.
This guy has a few things to say about them in this application starting on post# 89
http://www.head-fi.org/t/745032/lks-audio-mh-da003/75
(reads some posts)
Ok, well, I suppose I won't worry about it.
You made me think of these lyrics, though:
Me see a neon moon above
I searched for years I found no love
I'm sure that love will never be a product of Plasticity
You should try them out in your application and share your thoughts. What kinda gear do you build?
No, not a builder/modder for audio.
I was just wondering what, in your opinion, would be obviously wrong with my reasonably well measuring but maybe a bit mundane DAC2 since it has LME49860 after the Sabre chip.
What DAC is it? Benchmark DAC2? If so and you're adventurous, you could always swap them out for these. Might as well do the clock while your at it as well. Probably have to go with the Sparko's though as they are close together.
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That's my box.
If the op amps were socketed, I might try.
I could swap those out, but one of my basic rules for easy living is "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."
Am looking to mod one of these bad boys. Here are some things I want to try:
Better fuse
Change magnetic hardware holding tranformers to non magnetic (if applicable)
Add WA Quantum chips to DACs and capacitors
Add several Mad Scientist Magic Tubes
Damp parts
Change 3 clocks to Crystek clocks
If the output stage is using op amps for IV conversion (more than likely) then eliminate them and install a single discrete output stage on each phase wired with state of the art caps to the output jacks.
Other options possible
These mods should completely transform the DAC to another level. I have been manufacturing and modding digital gear since the dawn of the digital age.....yes, I modded the first Philips CD players that came out. If it beats the Yggy and Vega stock then it might play with the $10,000+ DACs with mods......this could be mind blowing.....I cannot wait to work on one.
I am thinking about $450 my cost in parts and around $450 in labor. First person to send me one will get it done for $100 labor!!!!!!
Better fuse
Change magnetic hardware holding tranformers to non magnetic (if applicable)
Add WA Quantum chips to DACs and capacitors
Add several Mad Scientist Magic Tubes
Damp parts
Change 3 clocks to Crystek clocks
If the output stage is using op amps for IV conversion (more than likely) then eliminate them and install a single discrete output stage on each phase wired with state of the art caps to the output jacks.
Other options possible
These mods should completely transform the DAC to another level. I have been manufacturing and modding digital gear since the dawn of the digital age.....yes, I modded the first Philips CD players that came out. If it beats the Yggy and Vega stock then it might play with the $10,000+ DACs with mods......this could be mind blowing.....I cannot wait to work on one.
I am thinking about $450 my cost in parts and around $450 in labor. First person to send me one will get it done for $100 labor!!!!!!
Sounds good. But just after you finish, they will come out with the X30 with the 9038Pro's
The 9018's aren't even in the catalog anymore. I'm sure manufacturers will just blow out the remaining inventory, and come out with new DAC's using the 9038 Pro.
It will probably be another 8 years till the successor of the 9038pro. Maybe you should wait for the 1st Gustard using it.
