Innuos Pulsar ????

[Rexp]

So I would agree my Zenth MKIIse with the PhoenixUSB (PN) clearly sounds better then the Pulsar without a PN. The PN fleshes out far more music density within the soundstage envelope. There just is a lot more going on from the musicians, and the music makes more sense, sometimes more musicians become more apparently within the mix. Without the PN, I was listening to a song, and it sounded like an acoustic guitar with perhaps some effects or reverb, trailing it. When I installed the PN, I could clearly hear that there were actually two guitars, playing in perfect pitch and harmony, and in tune with each other it was the same level of improvement (but not necessarily the exact same sound) adding the PN to either Innuos. This is about musical clarity and engagement. The PN, at least in my system also improved with the addition of a SR Purple fuse, and an upgraded power cord and the use of a second, same high-quality USB cable in the signal path. Unfortunately, on the PN side, the costs do add up. But also viewing from cost standpoint, if you have to add a outboard or server or NAS to play your files plus an additional upgraded power cord, Ethernet cable and possibly an upgraded power supply, that makes a pretty good case for a Zenith with everything in one chassis. I am not advocating for buying a five year old Zenth MKIIse, this is just my personal experience.

Can you share the track where you heard the two guitars more clearly? Thanks!

 

[Ron Resnick]

The PhoenixUSB costs about three times as much as my PULSEmini. Do you know of a similar-acting reclocker for around $750?

 

[Tuckers]

At least they could implement regular Phoenix USB.

In my conversations with Innuos, the only difference between the Phoenix USB and the Phoenix Lite in the Pulsar is one less power supply. I have my Pulsar on order now.

 

[matthias]

The PhoenixUSB costs about three times as much as my PULSEmini. Do you know of a similar-acting reclocker for around $750?

Ron,
maybe this:

3R USB RENAISSANCE MK2 BLACK STAR - Ideon Audio

3R USB Renaissance mk2 Black Star The high-end game changer The 3R Range: the master of magic re-generating, re-clocking, re-driving the USB source signal. An affordable USB conditioner device to Re Drive – Re Clock – Re Generate the USB signal. Highly improves signal transmission from the USB...

ideonaudio.com

Matt

 

[matthias]

In my conversations with Innuos, the only difference between the Phoenix USB and the Phoenix Lite in the Pulsar is one less power supply.

Exactly this difference seems to be important.

Matt

 

[VoicesInMyHead]

I've been using Innuos PhoenixNET and PhoenixUSB as well as Sean Jacobs designed PSU's to power my server/streamer solutions for quite some time, my experience with all of these is that good power makes a big difference here, it could actually be the products that has answered best on fuse upgrades and a good power cables in my system.

The Phoenix products don't come cheap, and then adding a $3000 power cable makes it even worse and you start thinking if money could perhaps be better spent somewhere else, but still it does make a difference that is difficult to ignore.

I'm just trying to make a point that good power seems to be a real thing with Innuos products.

 

[b345t]

The PhoenixUSB costs about three times as much as my PULSEmini. Do you know of a similar-acting reclocker for around $750?'

I'm not sure on how good it is vs the PheonixUSB, but given my current experience with how good both Waversa LAN (ext2 and reference) products worked in my system, I would advise you to try a Waversa ext usb.

 

[tedwoods]

This is an interesting discussion, but one must bear in mind also that due to the two-tier nature of USB, much in USB sound quality depends as much on the DAC side implementation of USB as on the server/streamer side one, which would translate to certain systems needing as much of a USB "boost" -so to speak- as they can get to sound their best while others less so.
But while this is undoubtedly a real world necessity for some systems, it does not immediately make it a rule of thumb that can be applied in a more generalized manner.
So, from a methodological standpoint, the differences experienced in some systems would probably reveal more about these system's particular USB realities, unique for every system (a USB Achilles heel of sorts) than pertain to actual reference points relating to equipment properties.
Unfortunately, I cannot offer any comparative observations, since I have nothing to compare my Pulsar with at the moment, but the uplift in SQ is of such a nature, since it applies to a wider set of parameters than one would usually expect, that cannot be attributed to just one single aspect (e.g. Phoenix lite) and it'd rather point towards more elaborately calculated design goals (evolved mobo, ssd, power supply, layout, software, etc) that act in tandem to deliver this outstanding result.

 

[tedwoods]

Yes, just @tedwoods please provide info about your NAS and power cords of NAS when you will be ready to share your findings.

Hi there!
Sorry to disappoint but nothing spectacular here: my NAS is a quite pedestrian QNAP HS-264 in absolutely stock form.
Cheers,
Ted

 

[matthias]

Unfortunately, I cannot offer any comparative observations, since I have nothing to compare my Pulsar with at the moment, but the uplift in SQ is of such a nature, since it applies to a wider set of parameters than one would usually expect, that cannot be attributed to just one single aspect (e.g. Phoenix lite) and it'd rather point towards more elaborately calculated design goals (evolved mobo, ssd, power supply, layout, software, etc) that act in tandem to deliver this outstanding result.

I completely get your point, there is just a delta between the performance of the PhoenixUSB and PhoenixLite which raises some questions. One question is why didn't Innuos offer the Pulsar a full PhoenixUSB solution? Did they do it to maintain the hierarchy between their best streamer and their best server? Certainly the Statement is much superior so there wouldn't be much of a competition if they offered the Pulsar a full PhoenixUSB solution.

Matt

 

[Ron Resnick]

Ron,
maybe this:

3R USB RENAISSANCE MK2 BLACK STAR - Ideon Audio

3R USB Renaissance mk2 Black Star The high-end game changer The 3R Range: the master of magic re-generating, re-clocking, re-driving the USB source signal. An affordable USB conditioner device to Re Drive – Re Clock – Re Generate the USB signal. Highly improves signal transmission from the USB...

ideonaudio.com

Matt

Thank you.

 

[Vule]

I completely get your point, there is just a delta between the performance of the PhoenixUSB and PhoenixLite which raises some questions. One question is why didn't Innuos offer the Pulsar a full PhoenixUSB solution? Did they do it to maintain the hierarchy between their best streamer and their best server? Certainly the Statement is much superior so there wouldn't be much of a competition if they offered the Pulsar a full PhoenixUSB solution.

Matt

One day it will appear in the form of SE though.

 

[matthias]

One day it will appear in the form of SE though.

Yes, and the Phoenices will get ARC6 modules to have a straight upgrade path, both are quite old now, considering that Ideon Audio launched a new reclocker for 6k.


Matt

 

[Tuckers]

much in USB sound quality depends as much on the DAC side implementation of USB as on the server/streamer side one, which would translate to certain systems needing as much of a USB "boost" -so to speak- as they can get to sound their best while others less so.

Yes, this is the real rub I think. Every quality DAC has its own way of streamlining USB, which will probably give varying results on how an upstream USB streamlining process works. For instance there a re DACs like Lampizator that are focused on the analog portion of the signal, vs DACs that have technically flexed their muscle around their own USB implementations.

 

[Lukasaudio78]

I've been using Innuos PhoenixNET and PhoenixUSB as well as Sean Jacobs designed PSU's to power my server/streamer solutions for quite some time, my experience with all of these is that good power makes a big difference here, it could actually be the products that has answered best on fuse upgrades and a good power cables in my system.

The Phoenix products don't come cheap, and then adding a $3000 power cable makes it even worse and you start thinking if money could perhaps be better spent somewhere else, but still it does make a difference that is difficult to ignore.

I'm just trying to make a point that good power seems to be a real thing with Innuos products.

Hi, which fuses and PC do you use? In which units to change fuses (Purple for example) would be the biggest effect by priority?

 

[VoicesInMyHead]

Hi, which fuses and PC do you use? In which units to change fuses (Purple for example) would be the biggest effect by priority?

I had SR Purple in both Phoenix products and I changed them at the same time so no idea about how to prioritise between them.

I use Sablon Audio for all my cables. The power cable is quite special with the huge Bocchino plugs.

I’m currently looking over my entire digital setup where I’ve sold/selling everything with an idea of “starting over” from scratch. (PhoenixUSB for sale in Europe, PM if interested)

 

[Di-fi]

The PhoenixUSB costs about three times as much as my PULSEmini. Do you know of a similar-acting reclocker for around $750?

Hi Ron,
Many choices, to add an other one:
Based on the stellar performance of the X-SPDIF 2 I would recommend the X-SPDIF 3, even without listening @ $499.95. Eventually you can improve the SQ with a better 12V power supply unit.

The new X-SPDIF3 USB digital audio interface allows your computer, tablet or mobile phone to easily output high-quality digital audio signal to peripheral digital audio devices, transmit in USB asynchronous mode, and achieve from USB input to Optical/Coaxial/AES/IIS-LVDS output interface conversion.

X-SPDIF3 | USB Interface

www.matrix-digi.com

 

[Di-fi]

In my conversations with Innuos, the only difference between the Phoenix USB and the Phoenix Lite in the Pulsar is one less power supply. I have my Pulsar on order now.

Housed in it's own box the PhoenixUSB can just excel by itself, as opposed to being integrated. As a PhoenixUSB it is not the same device anymore with two independent Statement-level linear power supplies, one dedicated to the OCXO clock and the other used for powering the USB chip/5V USB line. "The final function of this Innuos is to provide an extremely clean 5V supply to the DAC. The powerline between USB devices is a major conduit for noise to get from the source to the converter, by reducing this the PhoenixUSB reduces the amount of noise entering the DAC".
Only as as a PhoenixUSB the clock will regenerate the signal in order to reclock it as accurately as possible and with as little noise as possible and do exactly what is was made for so you will hear more of everything (as long as your setup allows of course).

Based on the positive reviews that also confirms how important linear power supplies are for audio. Sean Jacobs LPS units are one of the best available.

 

[Di-fi]

One question is why didn't Innuos offer the Pulsar a full PhoenixUSB solution?

In addition to sidestepping a potential price increase of around $1500-2000 (?) for the Pulsar with PhoenixUSB (IF the integrated USB clock could deliver the same sound quality), this adjustment arrives at an alternate price point.
For now the price could be attributed to the modular nature of the Pulsar's USB output, (but lesser SQ).
As soon as it becomes accessible, users have the option to upgrade to their favored output, all conveniently powered by a single Sean Jacobs Linear power supply.

 

[Ron Resnick]

Hi Ron,
Many choices, to add an other one:
Based on the stellar performance of the X-SPDIF 2 I would recommend the X-SPDIF 3, even without listening @ $499.95. Eventually you can improve the SQ with a better 12V power supply unit.

X-SPDIF3 | USB Interface

www.matrix-digi.com

Thank you.

How do you think that compares, in sonic effect, to the Mutec 3+ USB?