No way to make it better!

DaveyF

Well-Known Member
Jul 31, 2010
6,129
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La Jolla, Calif USA
Anyone here heard of Polymer audio? http://polymeraudio.com Their new flagship speaker is apparently so good that they say this: "no way to make it better at our present understanding of loudspeaker engineering."

This company will be presenting their MKS Superlative speakers featuring:
1. Diamond tweeter AND DIAMOND MIDRANGE drivers, over 12 carats in all.
2. Connectors made from 100% silver.
3. A cabinet machined entirely out of low-resonance, metal alloys including the intricate internal framework.
4. Diffraction control using both felt and beveled cabinet edges.
5. A crossover system that weighs more than most amplifiers incorporating over 40 lbs. of pure copper.
6. $38K price tag

At our next audio meeting I will get a chance to hear these. Should be a very interesting meet.

Do we have a new competitor to Magico and YG?
 
Yeah that reminds me of the old chemistry joke.

[Student] Professor, professor, I've just synthesized the ultimate reagent that will eat though anything!!!!

[Professor] Oh, what do you hold it in?
 
From the sound of it they're fabulous, but it would be good to hear their true potential with an active crossover, time alignment etc.
 
I reckon this is what a lot of high end manufacturers will state : no way to make it better at our present understanding of loudspeaker engineering."

From the looks it seems they are using accuton diamond membranes /units and scanspeak bass , these accutons are synthetic (grown ) diamonds .
Do you also value their weight in carats , never heard that before , anyway 12 carats that would be 2,4 grams
what, membrane weight?
Never heard the speakers ???
Some artificial diamond/carbon made structures are actually harder then the natural stuff
The speakers look nice and solidly/well made , only thing missing would be some big woofers:D
 
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I reckon this is what a lot of high end manufacturers will state : no way to make it better at our present understanding of loudspeaker engineering."

From the looks it seems they are using accuton diamond membranes /units and scanspeak bass , these accutons are synthetic (grown ) diamonds .
Do you also value their weight in carats , never heard that before , anyway 12 carats that would be 2,4 grams
what, membrane weight?
Never heard the speakers ???
Some artificial diamond/carbon made structures are actually harder then the natural stuff
The speakers look nice and solidly/well made , only thing missing would be some big woofers:D

Should be an interesting speaker to hear. I wonder if it will have the nasty "ringing" that I have heard with so many speakers that utilize the ceramic drivers. We shall see.
 
This is an unusually strong review...where the only speaker to which he compared this $29k speaker was the Wilson Alexandria 2...saying the Polymer was totally unchallenged by it, other than dynamic scale.
And this speaker has been superseded by the one Davey is going to hear...

http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue34/polymer_logic.htm

The reviewer bought the pair and made a point to say no discount.
 
Should be an interesting speaker to hear. I wonder if it will have the nasty "ringing" that I have heard with so many speakers that utilize the ceramic drivers. We shall see.

When is your next audio meeting when you will be hearing it? Most intrigued.
 
Anyone here heard of Polymer audio? http://polymeraudio.com Their new flagship speaker is apparently so good that they say this: "no way to make it better at our present understanding of loudspeaker engineering." . . . .

By "OUR" the company is referring to "THEIR" understanding because they really can't speak for other companies. . . .
 
When is your next audio meeting when you will be hearing it? Most intrigued.

Lloyd, I'm going to hear the Polymer's this Sunday.Dan Khesin ( I think he's one of the principal's of this company) is flying out from Florida to introduce and demo the speakers for us. ( The SDMAG ).
 
Lloyd, I'm going to hear the Polymer's this Sunday.Dan Khesin ( I think he's one of the principal's of this company) is flying out from Florida to introduce and demo the speakers for us. ( The SDMAG ).

great! look forward to reading all about it...tomorrow or as soon as you can!
 
Jazzhead, I think the flagship is the MKS Superlative and not the Logic Mk11. I believe I will be hearing the MKS Superlative tomorrow, we shall see:)

Most intrigued!!! Yes, i think that is the way i read the website as well...the MKS Superlative is their reference...though they claim both are references depending on useage?

anyway...Davey - can you ask them when their Sub is going to be ready? I would love to hear not just the speaker but the speaker and sub. Is it active? Does it have specific crossover settings to go with the Superlative and MkII? presume so.
 
Should be an interesting speaker to hear. I wonder if it will have the nasty "ringing" that I have heard with so many speakers that utilize the ceramic drivers. We shall see.

I agree again on your comment Davey (regarding the residual ringing of some ceramic drivers), actually I had a visit from a friend some weeks back who is quite familiar to the sound of the Eidolon, and in some way preferred the integration of my Ascents from which the earlier were based on.
 
Lloyd, I shall make a point of asking about the Sub and when it will be ready.
I'm also not sure as to the ancillary gear that will be used...but I will make a point to note what it is.
 
Lloyd, I shall make a point of asking about the Sub and when it will be ready.
I'm also not sure as to the ancillary gear that will be used...but I will make a point to note what it is.

Davey - Thank you!!! That is great. Due to the comments about scale in the review...i would be most interested in knowing about the speakers paired with the sub.
 
Iirc this was a review from 2007 , this is the discontinued polymer logic , the mk2 version uses indeed the scanspeak berylium (as do a lot of other manufacturers , or use parts of it )
The mks is diamond mid and highs , and believe me those units are expensive especially the mid units !!!
Very well constructed speakers by the way and costly , milling aluminium or alu alloy from the thickness as the front baffle is done is not cheap and i know from expirience :eek::p
Is the flagship speaker the Polymer Logic MK II ... if so website states ... the tweeter to be 1 inch pure beryllium and not diamond . Here's a related review from PF on the original Polymer Logic.... http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue34/polymer_logic.htm
 
Iirc this was a review from 2007 , this is the discontinued polymer logic , the mk2 version uses indeed the scanspeak berylium (as do a lot of other manufacturers , or use parts of it )
The mks is diamond mid and highs , and believe me those units are expensive especially the mid units !!!
Very well constructed speakers by the way and costly , milling aluminium or alu alloy from the thickness as the front baffle is done is not cheap and i know from expirience :eek::p

Yes...i think you are right on the review. As for the construction...thanks for that...i was wondering about that myself. It is certainly a sign they are seriously committed. The question is how does it sound! ;) Hopefully, the solid construction is a promising start. We shall soon find out from Davey!
 
Yes...i think you are right on the review. As for the construction...thanks for that...i was wondering about that myself. It is certainly a sign they are seriously committed. The question is how does it sound! ;) Hopefully, the solid construction is a promising start. We shall soon find out from Davey!

Here are a few pictures from today's event: photo 1.jpg photo 2.jpg photo 3.jpg photo 4.jpg

Ancillary gear was a pair of Linn Klimax amps, a Cirrus DAC, Pranawire ( these are something else) cabling, Mac Book Pro playing FLAC files and MP3's.

I will follow up this post with my thoughts shortly. I have to collect all of my thoughts as these speakers have left me with VERY mixed impressions!:confused::confused:
 
Where to start with my impressions of these speakers.....
In my over 30 years as an a'phile, I have never heard a speaker that is more perplexing!
On the one hand, the diamond drivers are some of the most revealing that I have ever heard. To hear how the tweeter handles transients and detail is somewhat of an eye opener. The sound of a brush on a drum head is almost real. The sound of air escaping from female singer's throat is stunning. IMHO, the diamond drivers are almost revelatory. OTOH, the fact that they are so immensely revealing also leads them to show up ANY weakness in the upstream components and this weakness shows up as a "hardness" ( diamonds are the hardest known substance) that I think would be VERY unpleasant for the long term. The MKS is beautifully constructed with great attention to detail....immense rigidity of the cabinet. Therein lies my second issue...they are simply too small to present what I feel is a life size image. Similar issue that I have heard with many speakers that are too small for the room that they are presented in. They can drop down into what seems like the mids 30's in the bottom end, BUT the bottom end is nowhere near as resolved as the rest of range served by the diamond drivers. Listening carefully, I could hear the x-over and clearly the two areas of presentation were not of the same cloth.
Dan Khesin, the designer and CEO of the company had some very interesting thoughts on the driver's and the choice of same. The mids( diamond drivers) and the tweets ( diamond tweets) are VERY expensive...to reproduce the bass drivers in diamonds is, according to Dan, NOT financially an option as the drivers increase in price exponentially as they increase in size. So,one of the compromises are the choice of the bass driver's. The cabinet is made from an aluminum sheet that is, again according to Dan, more inert and of a higher quality than the T6061 aluminum that is used by Magico and YG. I can believe this, as the finish work is absolutely first class.
BUT here's why I am still shaking my head.....The 'life' or warmth that I like and look for in a speaker is missing entirely from these speakers. Purely analytical and revealing BUT lacking in a certain " humanity" that i listen for in music. To some the "humanity" or warmth of reproduction is a "coloration". Not to me. For some reason, I kept on thinking these speakers are the Halcro's of the speaker world..cold and analytical, yet showing tremendous "spec's". How much of this had to do with the ancillary gear and room is a good question. I suspect a lot, BUT I have a feeling that going to the n'th degree to get rigidity in all things cabinet and driver may not hold the path to the holy grail. IMO, these speakers are so VERY close to doing some things so well and yet they lack something that would want me to take them home. The size/footprint seems wrong as is the blend between the drivers,OTOH the design screams 'high tech' and quality is obviously there, the end result....Not my cup of tea.
OTOH, would I LOVE to hear these diamond driver's in another enclosure that is larger and has better integration with the bass driver's ( whatever they may be)...an enclosure that gives a little more warmth to the presentation-- you betcha.:)
BTW, I had a very pleasant chat with a fellow attendee who owns both the Wilson Alex 2's and Marten Coltrane's. He felt that these Polymer's KILLED his Alex 2's in several areas, particularly in the ability of the diamond driver's to reveal information. An interesting perspective, because when i asked him If he had heard the new XLF's he said he had and that in his opinion, the new tweeter did NOT change the overall presentation of the Wilson speaker. He is now trying to sell his Alex 2's!
I'm not sure I agree with him here!
 
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