Observations and Suggestions

Ron Resnick

Site Co-Owner, Administrator
Jan 25, 2015
6,538
969
113
Beverly Hills, CA
#1
We love WhatsBestForum.com. We only want to make this a better community for all of us collectively: better by improving understanding and communication between and among members; better by reducing avoidable frustrations and unnecessary conflicts.

To this end we have a few observations and suggestions. These are observations and suggestions for each of us to think about and to bake into our thought process and writing process before we post and as we post.

1) You are not objectively correct, and the other person is not objectively wrong. Please stop arrogantly thinking that you are objectively correct. This is a subjective hobby. There is virtually no objective truth in a subjective hobby.

Even science and engineering topics do not always enjoy complete agreement among scientists and engineers. Subjective preferences about audio components and sound and music are not susceptible of any kind of objective right and objective wrong; almost nothing in this hobby is objectively correct or objectively incorrect.

Please don’t make the juvenile mistake of thinking that you have any objectively correct answer beyond your personal opinion on the matter.

Almost everything we post should be prefaced, either explicitly or implicitly, with “in my opinion . . .” Because that’s all most of this is: merely our personal subjective opinions.

2) If you don’t have the answer to a question, please don’t pretend that you do. If a member asks a question about a particular component or what a particular component sounds like, what is the point of replying to that inquiry if you have never heard the component in question? If you have not yourself ever heard or auditioned a particular component in question please be very circumspect about replying to that inquiry.

If someone asks about component X, and you don’t know anything about component X, please don’t reply. This means YOU!

Please don’t respond by writing “I don’t know anything about component X, but I have heard component Y and you should get component Y.” If you want to reply in an inane way like this, please do it as a private message, not as a public post.

3) Not every question occasions your inflexible, never changing answer. Many of our members love horn loudspeakers driven by SET amplifiers. That is great. But “horns and SETs” are not the answer to every question

Please be introspective enough to understand and respect the fact that not every question has the same answer -- your personal pet answer.

4) Because this is a subjective hobby rarely any topic or question properly or reasonably occasions a truly black versus white view. If a member likes horn loudspeakers and doesn’t like cone loudspeakers it helps no one to make broad proclamations like “horn speakers are great” or “this box speaker sucks.”

If a component is offered in the marketplace it very likely means that somebody bought it, and therefore somebody likes it. There is no objective sense in which a component “sucks.” Re-read 1) above.

Thank you for considering these observations and suggestions in your future activity on WBF.

With warmest regards,

Ron and Steve
 
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cjfrbw

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
2,309
107
63
Pleasanton, CA
#2
Does this mean I can't pass decisive judgment on equipment I've never seen or heard in person, or tell people that have seen or heard it that they are completely wrong about it?

What a bummer.
 
Feb 8, 2011
21,354
470
83
Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
#3
Carl, just use good common sense. :) Weight all the balances of all world's people and make comments only to please them all, including yourself. :cool: Play the winning hand @ all times.
Be on the right side, Michael's side...in heavy rotation...Fremer. :D

And spin LED Zeppelin.
 
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Mike Lavigne

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 25, 2010
7,573
672
113
#4
not to be a sh*t stirrer, as i'm typically on the 'adult' side of things and too PC mostly, but a bit of snarky-ness and being a smart ass is healthy from time to time. it ought to be done in the appropriate 'not too dark ........and........ 'not taking yourself overly serious' mode of course.

but let's not tighten things up too much and take away our life and energy. closer to the edge........is about right.

the community collectively should self regulate itself mostly. as i think it does. people who were not formerly self aware will not suddenly become self aware and get the above messages anyway. or they already would have.

not that mods and admin's don't have responsibilities.....they do.

YMMV.
 
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ddk

Industry Expert
May 19, 2013
3,911
424
83
Utah
#5
I agree with Mike, high end is a hobby, it's luxury, it's an obsession and the forum is where we interact. Sometimes it's friendly and sometimes it isn't but for the most part it's family. You'll stifle it and take the fun if you want to control and censor it to one standard, live and let live Ron variety is the spice of life. Let the children play :)!

david

PS. I also disagree that everything is only an opinion, there's a lot of knowledge and experience being shared on this forum.
 
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Bodhi

Active Member
Apr 20, 2014
819
248
43
Melbourne, Australia
#6
I've been guilty of praising one brand of panel speakers (which i've never heard), whilst conversely calling into question the cost/performance of another brand of panel speakers (which i've also never heard), and rationalising my comments because i've heard Infinity IRS-V's, owned other Infinity speakers & a smattering of Maggies and other planar/ribbbon speakers. So although Ron & Steve aren't directing their advice at any members in particular, I take their point.
 
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Folsom

VIP/Donor
Oct 26, 2015
3,585
289
83
Eastern WA
#7
I think we keep it pretty darn civil, even when we disagree. And we do disagree on things. You won't like this but, IMO the board has been really peaceful since Blizzard "left" and Amir went to form his own forum (that is a fairly successful one, where people that think alike get along well).

So while I sometimes share similar thoughts, I have to stop back and appreciate the forum as it already is, too.

The only point being made that I really think is worth going over is #2, just because some threads get watered down. But there is a very big complication in that it's rare that anyone has heard and directly compared the two things people are talking about. So all I can say is I appreciate when replies are kept somewhat tasteful (and they are not always). Information that's important about the product, and if someone heard one of them is not bad to have (or a comparison to a different than mentioned product).
 

Ron Resnick

Site Co-Owner, Administrator
Jan 25, 2015
6,538
969
113
Beverly Hills, CA
#8
. . . I also disagree that everything is only an opinion, there's a lot of knowledge and experience being shared on this forum.
Dear David,

Of course I agree that there’s a lot of wonderful knowledge and experience being shared on this forum. And it’s great that large subsets of us can coalesce in agreement around that knowledge and experience.

But that does not mean that the members concurring in that knowledge and experience are objectively correct, and that members who disagree with those views are objectively wrong.
 

Steve Williams

Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
#9
We have no intention of censoring anyone or anything. All we ask is that everyone read what they just typed before they hit the "post reply"button

not to be a sh*t stirrer, as i'm typically on the 'adult' side of things and too PC mostly, but a bit of snarky-ness and being a smart ass is healthy from time to time. it ought to be done in the appropriate 'not too dark ........and........ 'not taking yourself overly serious' mode of course.
so Mike, 2 weeks ago when one of the industry's biggest names called you a liar on this forum, I should not have reacted the way that I did by coming to your rescue :confused:
 
Likes: KeithR

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
11,386
1,343
113
London
#10
Ron and Steve, thanks for the OP. Imo, both of you should get horns. Looking objectively, Steve already has SETs.
 

Mike Lavigne

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 25, 2010
7,573
672
113
#11
We have no intention of censoring anyone or anything. All we ask is that everyone read what they just typed before they hit the "post reply"button



so Mike, 2 weeks ago when one of the industry's biggest names called you a liar on this forum, I should not have reacted the way that I did by coming to your rescue :confused:
we talked about that, as i recall. and one thing i said to you after i thanked you was i don't take myself too seriously and was not overly offended. Mikey does get cranked up easily and the fur flies.

but that was certainly beyond what i wrote above. you failed to copy the part of my post where i mention that mods and admins do have their responsibilities.

please read the spirit of what i wrote. i stand by that.
 

ddk

Industry Expert
May 19, 2013
3,911
424
83
Utah
#13
Dear David,

Of course I agree that there’s a lot of wonderful knowledge and experience being shared on this forum. And it’s great that large subsets of us can coalesce in agreement around that knowledge and experience.

But that does not mean that the members concurring in that knowledge and experience are objectively correct, and that members who disagree with those views are objectively wrong.
Dear Ron,
Why not? There are facts, realities, rights and wrongs in this hobby. There are subjective goals and preferences but that doesn't trump everything all the time. I don't understand why you're even bothered with this when the tendency among the community here generally is discussion not forceful submission, hardly ever a matter of right or wrong unless when BS is put forward as factual. Is there a reason why you started this thread?

david
 
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bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
11,386
1,343
113
London
#15
Dear Ron,
Why not? There are facts, realities, rights and wrongs in this hobby. There are subjective goals and preferences but that doesn't trump everything all the time. I don't understand why you're even bothered with this when the tendency among the community here generally is discussion not forceful submission, hardly ever a matter of right or wrong unless when BS is put forward as factual. Is there a reason why you started this thread?

david
Completely agree. I think they must have had a couple of complaints from owners of a certain brand name cone speaker who have less experience and are not objective seeing beyond what they own.
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
11,386
1,343
113
London
#16
Realistically I doubt anyone expects Ked not to look like a big proud nail standing above the rest everywhere he goes.
I would reply in detail but as of now I have too many posters to correct and too little time
 

BlueFox

Member Sponsor
Nov 8, 2013
1,196
45
48
Silicon Valley
#17
That’s a big list. After reading it, and all the responses, I forgot the details.
 

Ron Resnick

Site Co-Owner, Administrator
Jan 25, 2015
6,538
969
113
Beverly Hills, CA
#18
Dear Ron,
Why not? There are facts, realities, rights and wrongs in this hobby. There are subjective goals and preferences but that doesn't trump everything all the time. I don't understand why you're even bothered with this when the tendency among the community here generally is discussion not forceful submission, hardly ever a matter of right or wrong unless when BS is put forward as factual. Is there a reason why you started this thread?

david
Dear David,

It seems that I think there are fewer facts, realities, rights and wrongs than you think there are. :)

I started this thread “to make this a better community for all of us collectively: better by improving understanding and communication between and among members; better by reducing avoidable frustrations and unnecessary conflicts.”
 
Feb 8, 2011
21,354
470
83
Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
#19
One of the best people in the audio industry came here couple times over the years to share with us and he must feel much more comfortable on analog planet and much more relaxed and enjoying real life with the entire audio industry who have the utmost respect and friendship.
I would feel the same in his shoes.
 
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bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
11,386
1,343
113
London
#20
Dear David,

It seems that I think there are fewer facts, realities, rights and wrongs than you think there are. :)
Ron, that might be your opinion, but you are not objectively correct (point 1)
 
Likes: Folsom

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