Where Do You Buy Your Coffee Beans

ack

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May 6, 2010
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It's my experience, if you pull your own espresso shots, that the grinder is important in order to deliver the right fineness without heating the beans. However, grain size, volume of ground coffee are related to the oiliness. Plus you need to tamp the puck properly, ideally 30 lbs of pressure - which is why I got an Espro tension tamper that delivers a consistent tamp. I find that after hitting the button on my semi-automatic Salvatore Espresso machine, there should be at least 7-8 seconds before any liquid comes out and for a double shot, it should take more than 20 seconds from start, ideally 24-28. Thus you get a properly extracted shot and good crema. Since I also prefer lattes, I steam the milk and have pretty much figured out, by holding the pitcher (or nowadays I steam milk in my big coffee mug) how hot is just right. Over 160F and the milk tastes burnt - which is what happens at least half the time when I get a drink at a coffee house. There are people who are a magnitude more paranoid/detailed oriented than me - coffeephiles are just like audiophiles. They get into factional measurements of water temp, flushing the unit first if it is a heat exchanger, etc. The king of the hill for a home unit is the La Marzocco GS3 at 6500; La Cimbili is also good. As for grinders, I have a Mazzer Mini doserless and it's awesome - the only one better, but uglier, is the Versa Dynamics (of Versalab turntable fame).

If I had to use a super automatic, like a Jura Capresso, I'd get the Nuovo Simonelli Microbar as it provides heavy duty boilers, grinder etc.

Very informative post, thanks. I noticed that Intelligentsia also recommend the GS3 - my goodness, very expensive. And my Krups delays pumping by 3 seconds after an initial 1 second pump (intentional, per the manual) - what's the thinking behind this delay? And then it extracts a double in 25 seconds; I read this is probably a very good result; what's so important about 24-28 seconds?
 

mimesis

New Member
Sep 26, 2010
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The most knowledgeable and dedicated espresso advocate I've come across on the Web is David Schomer of Espresso Vivace in Seattle. He apparently does consulting and has written a series of articles for the trade, in lay journals, newspapers etc. and he has a blog. Here is an article that covers the extraction time:
http://www.espressovivace.com/archives/lucidcafe/LC19.pdf

You can find a whole slew of information at his site: http://www.espressovivace.com/archives.html.

The time reveals the manner in which hot water is forced through the puck, extracting all the flavor; if it's too short it shoots through in crevices or channels and if it's too long, you over extract.
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
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Thanks, William. There was lots of very useful information even for a home brewer. I particularly liked his introduction.

"Espresso improvements hide within each other like nested Ukrainian Dolls. Refine one factor and others appear that were affecting you, but hidden within a larger defect. For me it remains some serious fun, this pursuit of perfection, like chasing a feather in a windstorm."
 

egidius

Member Sponsor
Feb 13, 2011
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coffee? cafè!

Hello,

what a great deviation!

I swear by http://www.caffemauro.com/mauro-en.php no idea, but somebody must import it

also exquisite are beans by treforze, quarta or veronesi - as you see, I am biased towards italian roasting.
I am sure there are great coffee roasters in the States, but Starbucks, I am afraid has to stay out of this quotation!

However; the real important point, just like with any good chain is the temperature control!
Nowhere better for home use than here (I am very happy owner of this machine, and it greatly added to our quality of life) So go and visit this link and be enlightened :)

http://www.absolute-clarity.com/butterfly.html

egidius
 

ack

VIP/Donor & WBF Founding Member
May 6, 2010
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Next question - what's the perfect water temperature for espresso? The Intelligentsia beans are "spec'd" for 198F and my Krups produces "only" 174F... thoughts?
 

RUR

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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Next question - what's the perfect water temperature for espresso? The Intelligentsia beans are "spec'd" for 198F and my Krups produces "only" 174F... thoughts?

174F measured where, Peter? While the group head should be controlled somewhere in the 190's F, by the time it hits the cup it's likely to be in the 160-165F region. At the boiler, temp's even higher e.g. mine is set for 216F.
 

mimesis

New Member
Sep 26, 2010
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Check this link: http://www.espressovivace.com/archives/9211col.html

If espresso, the temp of the water coming out of the screen should be 195F or above. If coffee, I think 174 is about right giving you a cup of coffee around 165F.
I have read that the best regular coffee maker is the Technivorm as it does a better job dispersing water to properly brew coffee in the basket. If I drank coffee I would consider one although the kitchen already has too many appliances.
 

garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
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www.genesisloudspeakers.com
Are expresso machines the "What's Best" brewer? :confused:

I like the taste of French Press - but may be that's just me??? Anybody have advice on the best practices for French Press? What about siphons? Being a Chinese tea drinker, I drink a cup or two of coffee a week - Sunday breakfast usually.
 

ack

VIP/Donor & WBF Founding Member
May 6, 2010
6,774
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Boston, MA
174F measured where, Peter? While the group head should be controlled somewhere in the 190's F, by the time it hits the cup it's likely to be in the 160-165F region. At the boiler, temp's even higher e.g. mine is set for 216F.

Hey Ken - excellent question. I guess I measured it at the wrong place, the cup itself (in fact, a very large cup). So the obvious next question is - on those fancy machines with the water temperature gauge, where do they measure the water temperature, if you happen to know?
 

RUR

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
647
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0
SoCal
Hey Ken - excellent question. I guess I measured it at the wrong place, the cup itself (in fact, a very large cup). So the obvious next question is - on those fancy machines with the water temperature gauge, where do they measure the water temperature, if you happen to know?
Peter, the one's I'm aware of measure at the boiler and compensate for the temp loss to the group head. 216 @ the boiler as regulated by my PID controller gives 198 @ the group head. Never measured the in-cup temp. It's possible there are machines which measure group head temp, though that wouldn't seem to be the best approach.....

Best espresso is all about controlling the variables - water temp, beans, grind, dosage, tamping, pull-time, scrupulous cleaning etc. etc. Get yourself a PID and you can permanently eliminate proper temp worries. :)
 

ack

VIP/Donor & WBF Founding Member
May 6, 2010
6,774
1,198
580
Boston, MA
Doc - yes, nothing but Espresso spoken here; and I guess Cappuccino if the guests request it.
 

ack

VIP/Donor & WBF Founding Member
May 6, 2010
6,774
1,198
580
Boston, MA
Peter, the one's I'm aware of measure at the boiler and compensate for the temp loss to the group head. 216 @ the boiler as regulated by my PID controller gives 198 @ the group head. Never measured the in-cup temp. It's possible there are machines which measure group head temp, though that wouldn't seem to be the best approach.....

Best espresso is all about controlling the variables - water temp, beans, grind, dosage, tamping, pull-time, scrupulous cleaning etc. etc. Get yourself a PID and you can permanently eliminate proper temp worries. :)

Forgive my ignorance, but what's PID?
 

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