Sure, but if I have heard tons of vinyl in other systems, systems that I consider high quality, then an inherently greater realism of vinyl would have to jump out at me, no?
Why, oh why, does vinyl continue to blow away digital?
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Sure, but if I have heard tons of vinyl in other systems, systems that I consider high quality, then an inherently greater realism of vinyl would have to jump out at me, no?
This piece of information is not dispositive, but I find it highly probative. MikeL maxes out each of his three formats on a cost no object basis and on a time no object basis and on a tweaking no object basis. Importantly, this means Mike has no partisan bias, legacy preference, inertial preference or dogma in favor of any of the three formats.
He reports to us that the majority of his listening time is now via digital.
This tells me that digital truly has come of age, and can be competitive with analog formats on a sound quality basis and on an emotional engagement basis.
He reports to us that the majority of his listening time is now via digital.
This tells me that digital truly has come of age, and can be competitive with analog formats on a sound quality basis and on an emotional engagement basis.
The key word there is IF. The data shows higher dynamics. Distortion is largely low order and sonically innocuous and masks higher oder unpleasant distortion.
Yes, and you know what happens when the applied RIAA equalization that is applied/encoded in the recording doesn’t align perfectly with the RiAA equalization decoded during playback?
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Yes, so what? Stop changing the criterion. You said it would jump out of the groove with similar dynamics and this is simply not true due to the equalisation being applied.
For an LP to have the dynamic range of digital would require deeper grooves. Look it up.
Harmonic distortion for sure is a huge part of it. It is also reassuring to think about because anyone with a probe and an analyzer can quantify.
The very best of vinyl and tape is incommensurably noisy, from an electro mechanical stance. It is not pink noise you hear, but it is there and the same guy with an analyzer can measure it. I'm not talking about hash on the loudspeakers, pops and crackles etc. I'm talking signal correlated, low level noise. Just read the paper. No person heard noise but the results are pretty clear, the effects where better intelligibility of speech for example with some types of (not hearable!) noise.
The distribution is pretty much on par with what I'd expect from this type of suggestion based effect, the ritual of using a real, physical thing, based on this forums population. It is not universally worse, but also not universally better. Not evidence for it, but also not against it.
An LP made out of perfect vinyl LP would have a theoretical dynamic range of 70 dB. Measurements indicate maximum actual performance in the 60 to 70 dB range.
The lowly CD has a wide dynamic range as high as 96 dB.
Whenever I give an answer to one of your questions you tell me you meant something else. Thank you for clarifying again.
That was for Mike, but it also applies to you. What can we do with words like “completeness”, “natural” and so in when we are having a discussion to tease out things that can be validated and confirmed?
Peak dynamics. Also, they show that above 400 hz you can have 90dB from vinyl. If you won’t read the article…
That seems to correlate with my and others' observation that you rarely hear noise in your system directly, but you darn sure know when it's gone!
Actually, in the real world a 24-bit resolution does not exist at the output of a DAC, which seems to be at maximum 20 or 21 bit. A limiting factor seems to be the inherent noise floor of even the best power supplies, as discussed here:
On the other hand, manipulation of the signal in the digital domain during the recording process seems to benefit from 24 bit depth or higher, as this provides headroom for avoidance of losses during processing.
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Regardless, even 20 bit resolution is apparently higher than analog.
consistently from the same music played at the same volume i see decidedly higher peak watts on vinyl verses digital on my dart 468 readouts. digital smears peaks relative to analog. hundreds of occasions i've observed this. drum whacks, horns, vocals, electric guitar plucks.
look it up where according to who?
estimated dynamic range of vinyl by pro audio guys is not close. they don't know what they are talking about. and analog has no hard limits.
this is easy to hear and nothing new. where is @Atmasphere when we need him?
Its due to the extra bass energy impaired to analog vinyl playback by the combination of the recording/playback RIAA equalization misalignment and induced by low frequency modulations.
It’s from scientist not pro audio guys. These is simple mathematics.
Instead from calling out for Ralph, why don’t you post an audio recording of your system so that I can point out the excessive bass energy. I have been and will continue to be posting bass heavy songs on my thread and you and others can hear how beautifully my systems reproduce bass without sounding “muddy”.
Audio recordings go a longer ways to making a statement than a bunch of words, on this and other related subjects.
Post in thread 'Sharing a few system videos from last night‘s listening session'
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/sharing-a-few-system-videos-from-last-night‘s-listening-session.38539/post-973357
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I have gathered the same from reading Mike’s posts. But you left out one critical opinion of his vital to this very discussion. And that is that he prefers the sound of his analog to the sound of his digital in his room. How can you leave that out of your post? Mike’s preference is directly applicable to the original post of this thread.
There are many posters to attack Mike L is not one of them period
Even if we choose to disagree with him , clearly he is top of the league in many respects
I don’t think I would ever put the time into what many do here.
If anything learn from him and others like him
This is an advantage of this forums
I’m not saying you can’t either but compare at a min
we can’t learn anything if we stay where we are
Change is testing and confirming man I’ve done this hundreds of times over
Even if we choose to disagree with him , clearly he is top of the league in many respects
I don’t think I would ever put the time into what many do here.
If anything learn from him and others like him
This is an advantage of this forums
I’m not saying you can’t either but compare at a min
we can’t learn anything if we stay where we are
Change is testing and confirming man I’ve done this hundreds of times over