dCS Varese short review

[Lee]

i finally heard the varese yesterday next to vivaldi apex and can confidently say that it is not a better vivaldi. it is not even from the same family. it is something completely new and different esp when it comes to holography, dynamism and bass performance. 5 boxes are ridiculous for digital playback so it will be dcs challenge to bring it down to 2-3 boxes with 90% of the sound. imo vivaldi as it is today is already dead.

Agreed. Totally different from the Vivaldi.

 

[gleeds]

My impressions of the Varese after spending a couple hours listening:

Setup: Ethernet -> Varese -> VTL TL 7.5 SIII -> dAgostino M400 monos -> Wilson XVX (loom all Transparent Magnum Opus).

Impressions: I found myself comparing it to the Vivaldi Apex. It sounded like a better Vivaldi. I always felt that the Vivaldi did complex/transients without breaking a sweat. But, it also sounded analytical with such content - especially in the upper mid-range and lower high frequencies. Whereas the Vivaldi could, at times with such content, be detailed without grace the Varese was delicate and nuanced. The Varese somehow retained detail while adding a smoothness. Backgrounds/noise floor was spectacular.

Another comparison for me is the Wadax Reference. I felt the Varese was a more natural sounding DAC. While the Wadax is amazing in terms of how it ca be tuned when paired with the streamer, it can also start to sound maybe a tick artificial to my ears. The Varese did not sound artificial to me.

Finally, I think about the Varese in comparison to the Horizon, which I ended up buying. I don't think the Horizon has the resolution nor the transient handling of the Varese. But, the body, density and upper mid-range are better on the Horizon to my ears. Ron R insisted I have a tube somewhere in the pipeline and I think he was right.

I left the Varese audition with the following conclusions,
1) The Varese is an awesome dac - I am sure I would be incredibly happy with one
2) The 5 boxes is a bit much - it takes up as much space as many entire systems. And, I am sure that within months we will be pitched on cable upgrades that 'transform' the sound.
3) DACs are the fastest evolving components in hifi. I look at amps, turntables, speakers, etc - a great one of these today will still be top-notch years from now. Whereas dacs are still evolving at quite a fast rate imo.
4) $300,000 is a lot of money for a single component - ultimately, I did not feel the juice was worth the squeeze on this one. It just didn't move me like some things do. I recently bought Lyras - when I heard them I was immediately hooked.

Enjoy your Lyra's PK! I agree with RR; the Lampi was a good choice for your system, regardless of price. I hope to hear the system once everything is settled.

 

[oldvinyl]

I heard the Varese yesterday at Definitive Audio in Bellevue, WA. The system was Wilson speakers, D’Agostino preamp and amp, Shunyata power, Transparent cables. They had a Vivaldi and Varese that played streaming content. It was easy to compare/contrast by switching between inputs on the preamp.

The most impressive aspect of the Varese to me was the lower noise floor and portrayal of the acoustics of the recording’s venue. The Varese was a little more palpable, especially on vocals.

Not in my budget, but wow. Duly impressed.

 

[buzzlulu]

I’ve had the chance to hear it in a room by myself with DarTZeel mono blocs (I have DarTZeel pre + amp)

It definitely is impressive

Since you had a chance to compare it to Vivaldi, did you think it to be worth the price differential ($100k vs. $250k)

 

[oldvinyl]

Since you had a chance to compare it to Vivaldi, did you think it to be worth the price differential ($100k vs. $250k)

Short answer- not from what I heard.

I would like to hear it again when both DACs can play discs. For whatever reasons, streaming does not sound as robust on Vivaldi as what I hear from mine playing CDs or SACD.

I don’t play my digital enough to warrant that price difference.

I have over 10,000 LPs, mostly from the analog age or all analog reissues. My collection is a library of the music I enjoy and explore. No reason to chase digital to the pinnacle.

I think my answer might be different if I only had digital sources.

 

[buzzlulu]

Sort of the same here - 7000 lp’s primarily analogue and a Klimax level LP12. On the flipside, I actually play more digital than vinyl. After five years I just upgraded my Rossini to Vivaldi. Leagues better than Rossini, however, my Linn still beats it. While phenomenal I don’t know if the Varese is worth the significant price increase over my Vivaldi.

I recently was speaking with a friend who is crazier than I am for high-end stereo. I mentioned to him I thought something like Varese would truly warrant a purpose built, dedicated treated room to take full advantage of what it is capable of offering - at the price of admission required to obtain it. I’m not quite sure my non-purpose built non-treated room would do it justice

 

[HughP3]

the price is prohibitive, but, my dealer made a strong offer that i took him up on. call Scott Carpenter directly, owner of Evolution Home Theater in Atlanta Ga. I could be a one off but who knows. I have just stopped listening until mine gets here next week.

 

[microstrip]

Sort of the same here - 7000 lp’s primarily analogue and a Klimax level LP12. On the flipside, I actually play more digital than vinyl. After five years I just upgraded my Rossini to Vivaldi. Leagues better than Rossini, however, my Linn still beats it. While phenomenal I don’t know if the Varese is worth the significant price increase over my Vivaldi.

I recently was speaking with a friend who is crazier than I am for high-end stereo. I mentioned to him I thought something like Varese would truly warrant a purpose built, dedicated treated room to take full advantage of what it is capable of offering - at the price of admission required to obtain it. I’m not quite sure my non-purpose built non-treated room would do it justice

Just my own opinion - as long as you will own Dartzeel you will prefer analog. I owned Dartzeel and even hosted the top of them, but although I liked the sound and the great quality equipment, my preference for digital and particularly the long time owned dCS Vivaldi moved me away. I found the Dartzeel "tuned" to vinyl characteristics. Would the the Varese change my opinion?

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I recently was speaking with a friend who is crazier than I am for high-end stereo. I mentioned to him I thought something like Varese would truly warrant a purpose built, dedicated treated room to take full advantage of what it is capable of offering - at the price of admission required to obtain it. I’m not quite sure my non-purpose built non-treated room would do it justice

i think you make a good point. to rationalize super-spendy tip top digital one has to make sure it's in a context to succeed. the considerable cost of a Varese or Level 4 Wadax demands that the system is capable of featuring everything it can do. it's an end game product needing an end game system and listening culture of lots of listening. a cherry-on-top sort of thing at the end of a long journey.

that is how i viewed my Wadax investment is that it is optimized in my system. no it does not quite have the realism of my better vinyl pressings on my high level turntables. but the Wadax is 70% of my listening, and i listen to a lot. hours and hours a day. were i considering the Varese i would be thinking along those same lines in terms of the question of serious consideration. am i at a place where my commitment will be fully rewarded? do i have more system/room work to do to get more from the level of digital i already have or not? or am i at that place where i am happy and hitting my system references?

not sure there are any qualifiers in terms of dedicated room, or particular acoustic treatments, or signal path choices. it's more overall system development and performance. great sounding systems come in all shapes and sizes. i just would not put limits of how one finds great system performance. YMMV.

not trying to claim any spend like these makes sense to many people. but if it's on your radar then it's how i saw it.

 

[microstrip]

(...) I mentioned to him I thought something like Varese would truly warrant a purpose built, dedicated treated room to take full advantage of what it is capable of offering - at the price of admission required to obtain it. I’m not quite sure my non-purpose built non-treated room would do it justice

I can't speak for the Varese, but will give my perspective about the Vivaldi.
IMO it does not need a purpose built - treated room to sound excellent and rewarding. The level of musical information and enjoyment it gives me fully justifies the crazy price, independently of room.

Room issues mainly limit the type of loudspeakers and oblige us to make a judicious choice of equipment and compromises. But this is a subjective hobby and the listener is also part of the system. If by any reason I had to make a downgrade now, the Vivaldi would be the last one to go.

Surely I am discarding extreme cases of rooms that are completely inadequate for stereo - I would not put a Vivaldi in a bathroom!

 

[Barry2013]

Earlier this evening I read the review of the Varese in the current issue of HiFi+.
Reviews are reviews of course, but Allan Sircom was completely bowled over by it.
Definitely a must listen to at Munich in May!

 

[oldvinyl]

the price is prohibitive, but, my dealer made a strong offer that i took him up on. call Scott Carpenter directly, owner of Evolution Home Theater in Atlanta Ga.

Too much money in someone else's retirement account for the very limited time I listen to CD/SACD versus beaucoup time listening to LPs. My view of these expenditures is do I want the money in my retirement account or someone else's.

Let's see:
-- $150K just for DAC, controller, etc
-- $XXX for new transport
-- $30K for new rack, shelves, footer
-- $30K for additional power cords
-- $400K - $1.5M for new listening room (wouldn't wanna miss out on anything)
-- $20K loss selling unused digital cables from Vivaldi

Honestly, I enjoy the CD/SACD playback I have when I use it. Just fine for me. Done chasing such "upgrades" or "improvements". It never ends, so might as well enjoy today and what I already have.

 

[HughP3]

I was done chasing too, until Scott volunteered to bring it over just to see…. And that was that. as i am all digital and i could not unhear it well i caved.

 

[buzzlulu]

-- $150K just for DAC, controller, etc

Sorry……it’s $250k

 

[oldvinyl]

Sorry……it’s $250k

$150K is the approx delta to trade in my Vivaldi transport, Apex DAC and clock.

I’m happy with what I have.

 

[thedudeabides]

it's an end game product needing an end game system and listening culture of lots of listening. a cherry-on-top sort of thing at the end of a long journey.

Interesting how many who can afford such a product or for those who have made their last, must have "end game" product / system upgrade claim it is "the end". In the vast majority of cases, it proves to be untrue. Not criticizing and I am envious. Music and passion are indeed powerful forces.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Interesting how many who can afford such a product or for those who have made their last, must have "end game" product / system upgrade claim it is "the end". Not criticizing and I am envious of those who can still pursue their passion but as witnessed on this forum and in the vast majority of cases, that simply is not true.

i had an end game 'retirement' plan. in my case my next big purchase after the Wadax.......was......a.......motor home. not hifi.

This certainly applies to me who can no longer accommodate a nice audio system due to practical space limitations and found my perfect "end game" speaker at a price I could justify. Music and passion are indeed powerful forces.

i hear you. my thoughts are if anything downsizing my home and possibly my hifi footprint. we do live in the real world. time will tell how that all goes. ask me in a year or two.

but the Wadax is a big part of my hifi enjoyment and no regrets on the commitment i made. there will not be a next even-better digital product in my future. although i expect that there will be better out there at some point. that is inevitable.

 

[Lee]

i had an end game 'retirement' plan. in my case my next big purchase after the Wadax.......was......a.......motor home. not hifi.

i hear you. my thoughts are if anything downsizing my home and possibly my hifi footprint. we do live in the real world. time will tell how that all goes. ask me in a year or two.

but the Wadax is a big part of my hifi enjoyment and no regrets on the commitment i made. there will not be a next even-better digital product in my future. although i expect that there will be better out there at some point. that is inevitable.

It’s already here. It’s called a dCS Varese.

 

[Al M.]

It’s already here. It’s called a dCS Varese.

While perhaps that may be, have you heard a direct comparison of Wadax and Varese to make that claim?

 

[Lee]

While perhaps that may be, have you heard a direct comparison of Wadax and Varese to make that claim?

That’s why I winked. They seem to not want a direct comparison so I can only assume they are nervous.