Power Conditioning Advice

[dminches]

Balanced power is one way of power conditioning. Are you interested in balanced input , balanced output or both?

I don't really know since I am just starting to look at this. When you say balanced input or output can you explain what you mean? If I went to an Equi=tech unit doesn't that provide me with balanced output?

 

[Folsom]

Yes, Equi=tech makes balanced transformers.

Balanced means that on the Line and Neutral wires you instead have +60v and -60v, so both blades on a power cord plug become hot, and ground remains ground. On a normal power system only Line is hot at 120v, and neutral has no juice.

 

[dminches]

Yes, Equi=tech makes balanced transformers.

Balanced means that on the Line and Neutral wires you instead have +60v and -60v, so both blades on a power cord plug become hot, and ground remains ground. On a normal power system only Line is hot at 120v, and neutral has no juice.

Thanks. That part I read and get. I didn't know what was meant by balanced input or output. I assume what comes out of an Equi=tech unit, either a panel or shelf mount, is balanced out.

I have an opportunity to demo a model Q 2RQ which I think I will do.

 

[dan31]

Part of it is driven by my interest in balanced power which I realize isn't the same as power conditioning. There isn't any bad with the Dmitri so I am just exploring.

I am using the Mongoose right now. Who makes the X20 and X30?

CHacoustic designed and made the HZ. The X20 and X30 are better. I have the X20 and use it to feed my RSA unit.

http://chacoustic.com

 

[Folsom]

Yes, the balanced is output.

 

[microstrip]

I don't really know since I am just starting to look at this. When you say balanced input or output can you explain what you mean? If I went to an Equi=tech unit doesn't that provide me with balanced output?

Yes,Equitech is balanced output, but if you operate it in the US with 240V you also get balanced input. IMHO balanced input is more important than balanced output.

 

[dminches]

Yes,Equitech is balanced output, but if you operate it in the US with 240V you also get balanced input. IMHO balanced input is more important than balanced output.

Why is balanced input more important?

 

[microstrip]

Balanced input rejects common mode noise coming from two equal long lines, that can be significant. In your home the Equitech will be close (a few meters) of the equipment, the main advantage of the 60V dual supply is mainly reducing the ground leakage through equipment filters.

 

[Folsom]

If you use a wall mount one it may not necessarily be close. MikeL has his farther away, as does at least one other member, and at least one has it close. I would prefer farther away, and use my Lillies meant for them.

 

[Pb Blimp]

Why is balanced input more important?

If you go with balanced output just make sure you know how it works. I personally have a very bad allergic reaction to my cold being hot. It scares others too.

 

[dminches]

If you go with balanced output just make sure you know how it works. I personally have a very bad allergic reaction to my cold being hot. It scares others too.

Can you be more specific? Is there some danger you are referring to?

 

[Pb Blimp]

Can you be more specific? Is there some danger you are referring to?

As others have said, nuetral is hot in a balanced system. Just be aware that both will bite you not just the hot.

 

[Speedskater]

Yes, Equi=tech makes balanced transformers.
Balanced means that on the Line and Neutral wires you instead have +60v and -60v, so both blades on a power cord plug become hot, and ground remains ground. On a normal power system only Line is hot at 120v, and neutral has no juice.

In a normal US type system.
Hot has 120V when referenced to Neutral or Safety Ground.
In a balanced system, there is no Neutral so:
Hot #1 has 120V when referenced to Hot #2.
Either Hot has 60V when referenced to Safety Ground.

Unfortunately the transformers in hi-fi components are not balanced so they can't take full advantage of balanced power.
In fact the well designed units, take the Hot/Neutral imbalance into account.

 

[dminches]

There are clearly different camps here as to the ability for one's equipment to work with balanced power.

 

[Pb Blimp]

If you use a wall mount one it may not necessarily be close. MikeL has his farther away, as does at least one other member, and at least one has it close. I would prefer farther away, and use my Lillies meant for them.

Maybe but I think only bad things can occur the farther away the transformer lives from the system. I am not sure why you would prefer this if avoidable.

I have 5 equal-length, 10-gauge, ncf furtech, shielded lines that run only 15 feet each from my 75 amp wall mount Torus to ncf receptacles. The Torus is balanced 240V in and unbalanced 120V out. This ensures clean, high instantaneous current with voltage regulation and equal potential at each ground receptacle to mitigate ground loops. (The 75 amp transformer is of course wired as a completely separate electrical system with its own 1 inch by 8 ft copper ground rod and 400 lbs of grounding mix.) The noise floor is nil.

 

[es347]

..Nordost QB8/QX4..does it sound good?...I think so...just knowing it’s there it offers the warm and fuzzies

 

[microstrip]

Can you be more specific? Is there some danger you are referring to?

No danger if properly implemented - but you need ground-fault circuit interrupter (GFCI) protection on the output of the balancing transformer - it is mandatory.

In most european countries, as shucko plugs are symmetrical, normally we are not aware of what wire is neutral or live.

 

[dminches]

No danger if properly implemented - but you need ground-fault circuit interrupter (GFCI) protection on the output of the balancing transformer - it is mandatory.

In most european countries, as shucko plugs are symmetrical, normally we are not aware of what wire is neutral or live.

Thanks.

I am reading an old thread which compares Torus (balanced in) to Equi=tech (balanced out).

I am trying to understand if the non-wall mounted units are close to the wall mounted ones.

 

[Folsom]

Maybe but I think only bad things can occur the farther away the transformer lives from the system. I am not sure why you would prefer this if avoidable.

I have 5 equal-length, 10-gauge, ncf furtech, shielded lines that run only 15 feet each from my 75 amp wall mount Torus to ncf receptacles. The Torus is balanced 240V in and unbalanced 120V out. This ensures clean, high instantaneous current with voltage regulation and equal potential at each ground receptacle to mitigate ground loops. (The 75 amp transformer is of course wired as a completely separate electrical system with its own 1 inch by 8 ft copper ground rod and 400 lbs of grounding mix.) The noise floor is nil.

15ft isn't so bad, when I say longer I certainly don't mean over 50ft. Also I don't think or feel about why I would, I have deliberate measurable concerns when it comes to an Equi=tech. The Torus is probably a better unit. But I ultimately would not use a transformer anyway, personally.

 

[dminches]

The more I research the more options I am finding:

1 - Balanced in (Torus) vs.
2 - Balanced out (Equi=tech)
3 - Wall Panel
4 - Shelf unit

This is just supposed to be for my sources and pre-amp. I didn't plan on doing anything for my amps but I guess if I get a wall unit it would supply power to my amps too.