Jim's Powerful Sound

Al M. said:

(cont.)

After coming back from a truly excellent sashimi dinner with great conversation, we continued listening. Jim cued up some Luther Vandross from digital, and just like the voices from vinyl playback his voice sounded phenomenal, with full, natural tone and an extraordinarily open sound. Just to make sure I asked Jim if it really was from digital and not from vinyl, but I should have known better, since no record was playing. I was like “8 dollar USB cable, huh?”.

We then did hear some vinyl, Running with the Devil from Van Halen’s debut album. Very large, powerful and dynamic, with weighty drums and bass that sounded really tight. Following up with a rousing presentation of Eruption and then You Really Got Me.

The bass performance on Pink Floyd’s The Wall (from digital) was excellent, very tight and punchy. The very heavy drums on Hey You sounded without even the silghtest overhang, even in dense licks, and again, with tremendous power. The most shocking, however, was David Gilmour’s voice at the beginning of the song. I have never heard it sound so open, present and real.

For solo violin I tested Hilary Hahn playing Ysaye (track 3 from streaming, third movement of sonata #1). It sounded very good but with a slightly more metallic tone that I like. I know that the metallic tinge can occur on this track with a slight excess of treble energy in the system/room and it confirmed what I had thought for a while, which is that there is just a *slight* excess of treble (as opposed to an actually tipped-up sound, which there definitely is not). This can probably be easily addressed with speaker positioning, specifically toe-in. Granted, the speakers are very heavy at more than 500 pounds each, but they are on rollers. Track 15 (sonata #6), however, sounded excellent. Also excellent (from digital streaming): Beethoven string quartet op 18/1 played by the Ebene Quartet, another reference of mine. Very detailed sound, and as Jim commented, “there is so much [wooden] body!”. Yes, it sounded amazing.

As for image size, it was believable for the violin, not too large. While I have to admit that I did not pay that much attention to the size of the string quartet playing Beethoven, it did not strike me as overly large either, otherwise I definitely would have noticed. It was certainly not like what I heard with a less well-adjusted system with speakers far apart in a large room, where the players sat at what seemed to be up to 30 feet from one another from left to right, which of course is ridiculous.

A saxophone duet (Sonny Stitt, Red Holloway) from vinyl sounded great too, even though also here I heard a slight edge in the treble. Yet overall, saxophone on this system is the best I've heard, when it comes to the combination of tone and energy. Not only was the tone very good, the system also portrayed the tremendous energy that the instrument can radiate convincingly, with hair-raising dynamics as well. You just don't commonly hear this life-like energy from sax in reproduction.

A track from Ben Webster, also from vinyl, confirmed the excellence of the sytem’s presentation of saxophone. As with the previous sax recording, image height of the instrument was convincing as well.

A few tracks from the band War confirmed the tight rhythmic prowess of the system – flawless.

Apart from the very slight excess of treble, at least to my personal taste, I found one other flaw that probably could be cured while keeping the same components in the system.

There is some distortion and a very slight hardness on very loud passages, both on vinyl and digital, so it was not any single source (vocals at a realistic volume, which is not that loud, however showed not the least bit of hardness at all). The distortion and slight hardness seem room related. I strongly suspect that from my own experience with my room, where it took a good amount of effort to remove room-induced hardness, harshness and distortion by room treatment, as I also play quite loudly. Part of the equation in my room was also speaker set-up in such a way that distortion-inducing speaker/room interactions were minimized. It is entirely unsurprising that there would be some room distortion in Jim's not extensively treated room: The sheer physical energy that these speakers put out into this large room must be massive, given the great projection of sonic power. Some more acoustic treatment to address the room excitement might go a long way.

There is no really deep bass, but with such bass power and definition the subjective need for deep bass becomes much less. Depth portrayal seemed limited, but that was also hardly a distraction given the tremendous performance of the system in so many other, musically important, areas.

Here is my summary on why I think this is the best system that I have heard:

1. It is the most transparent and open sounding system on vocals that I have heard (perhaps the relatively low crossing over ribbon tweeter plays a role here). The vocal timbres are excellent.
2. It can play all music with authority, be it large-scale classical, chamber, jazz or rock
3. The sound generally is of excellent tone, definition and detail, coming from an unusually calm, quiet background that seems entirely natural
4. Best saxophone in terms of combination of tone and energy, best drums
5. Importantly, like no other system that I have have heard it can portray the scale, the power and the energy of a large orchestra convincingly. This alone sets it apart.

***

The experience confirms that you need a large room for obtaining the best sound. Yet then you also need speakers that can convincingly energize the space, as is the case here.

If I had such a large room and the budget, I would very seriously consider buying those speakers and from there tailor the sound to my taste.

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Ron Resnick said:

I've heard the Audio Research pre-amp! I want Jim to keep it!

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Jimford said:

Ron, you didn’t hear it with the Mark Levinson. They match so well!

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Al M. said:

Sonic Impressions

This will be a somewhat long read for those willing to dive into it. Here are my conclusions upfront:

This is by a considerable margin the very best system that I have ever heard. Like every system it has its imperfections, yet this is my basic take on it. I'll detail the reasons below why I think so highly of it.

Jim played some male voices from vinyl. I was immediately struck by how full-bodied the voices sounded, yet without any bloat – just right. They also sounded open, dynamic and emotionally expressive. As representative of female vocals, Patty Smith’s voice on “Twelve” (digital streaming) sounded natural and engaging. The acoustic guitar heard on one song sounded just right.

Jim also played some dynamic pop which sounded authoritative and, well, very dynamic. Some large scale orchestral movie music showed off dynamics as well.

Then I asked to hear “War Pigs” from Black Sabbath (digital streaming), one of my rock acid tests for a system. It sounded very similar to what I hear on my system, with great weight and with grungy, fiery, very impolite (as it should be!) guitars. Two key differences: While the drums sound very good in my system, they just don’t have that definition that I heard on Jim’s system which makes them sound that more life like. As they say, there is no replacement for displacement – in this case, driver surface area. Second, the scale was much bigger, making the impression of an actual band playing in front of you. My system is in a much narrower room, just 12 feet, which is less than half the width of Jim’s room, so no surprise here.

At this point I was already impressed. Then I asked if I could hear some large-scale symphonic music. My choice was the first movement of Bruckner’s Symphony #3, played by the Berlin Philharmonic with Barenboim conducting. The sound, from digital streaming, was phenomenal. The massed violins of the string section sounded highly resolved, with a beautifully silky tone, woodwinds sounded gorgeous, and the sound of the brass, played by the musicians of the Berlin Philharmonic with abandon while not losing precision, was highly resolved as well. As Jim at one point commented, “You can hear all the different elements of the brass section so clearly”, separate from each other, and with that he took the words out of my mouth because I was just about to say the same thing!

Dynamics were incredible. Yet beyond that and the beauty and resolution of the sound, what was striking was the massive scale and power of the orchestra projected by the system. The sheer energy of sound through all the dynamic surges and climaxes was unbelievable. The scale and power was something that I had never heard from a system on orchestra, and it really was a close second to sitting in an actual live concert with a large orchestra, less than 10 rows back from the players. Yes, we played the recording loud, but not too loud; peaks were about 96 dBC or just a bit higher. Thus, the impression of power was not derived from just blasting the system beyond limits reasonable for maintaining your hearing. It is clear that the speakers make great use of the relatively large listening space by tremendously energizing it.

Additionally, the sheer authority of the projection was also supported by the fact that the presentation was so calm in quiet and in moderately loud passages. This calm was reminiscent of the calm of great analog tape. It also highlighted an important characteristic of Bruckner’s music, which is what I call “stillness in motion”.

All in all, this was by far the most convincing facsimile of a real orchestra playing that I have ever heard from a system.

After 6 or 7 minutes, following the presentation of the third, “rhythmic” theme in this first movement of the symphony I asked Jim if he was fine continuing with the 20-minute movement until the end, because I was just too much into the music and how it sounded. Jim said that he really liked what he heard and that he was happy to continue listening. From that point on we really didn’t much talk about the sound, but about the music and how majestic it was in all its facets.

Then I suggested that we continued with the wonderful second, slow movement of the symphony, and so we did. The music sounded so emotional, both in the playing of this wonderful performance and in the presentation by the system. Again, all the emotional glory associated with the beauty and the majesty of the music, with its quiet passages and its powerful, energetic surges towards breathtaking climaxes came through in an uncanny manner.

We continued by briefly exploring the sonics of my favorite recording of the Fourth Symphony by Bruckner, with the Vienna Philharmonic conducted by Karl Boehm, which were also presented impressively by the system.

At this point we both were very much into Bruckner’s music on the system, and I suggested exploring the power of the first movement of Bruckner’s Eighth Symphony, again with the Berlin Philharmonic conducted by Barenboim (still from digital streaming), a favorite interpretation of mine when it comes to that symphony as well. As the system was so good at portraying the sheer power of an orchestra, I expected it to shine on this music, and it did. Not just the immense power of the music, but also its beauty and its forceful drama were presented in a manner that was simply intoxicating.

At 5:21, towards the beginning of the development section, a solo oboe plays a very slow version of the main theme, over a faint string tremolo. This passage struck both Jim and me, and we talked about that sound of loneliness. It was very much aided by the large space around it, much larger than on a typical system in a smaller room (including mine). In addition, the perceived loneliness of this oboe was made possible only by the very quiet, calm background, devoid of any digital or other noise. It was just this pure, quiet sound from that lone oboe, without any “electronic” interference or hash.

Between about 9 and 10 min, as well as later on, before eventually (at 13:13) the trumpets and French horns blast out just the rhythm of the main theme on a single chord, there are these giant waves of sound rocking back and forth in the music with tremendous force. The visceral weight and power of these passages were simply astounding on Jim’s system.

Jim and I loved all the music and its presentation through the system, and after the monumental, in part dark forces of the first movement of Bruckner’s Eighth Symphony (it is in C minor) I suggested contrasting this with the light of Bruckner’s Seventh Symphony in E major. Also hear we listened in full length to the entire first movement, with the same performers.

There is this beautiful sunrise at the beginning, coming from a soaring melody spanning over more than 20 bars – one of the most beautiful melodic inventions in all of music, I dare say. Jim’s system conveyed the radiant intensity of the presentation of the melody by the orchestra in a breathtaking manner.

As for the coda (concluding passage of the movement), Jim aptly commented that it starts out as the blossoming of a beautiful flower. Yet as it rises and rises in volume and density it inexorably expands into a majestic, radiant tree of glory and light.

Also here, the intensity and power with which Jim’s system presented this passage made it an event in itself.

All of Bruckner truly becomes an event through this system. Several times during the session I had goosebumps. My skin literally stood up in those moments.

Funny, it turns out that these recordings with Berlin Philharmonic/Barenboim were in 16/44.1 format (Redbook CD), not “hi-rez”. It just takes a DAC that decodes very well and a system that is able to reproduce all the information as well as the power of the music to create all this magic.

That such an, in high-end terms, relatively cheap DAC (at $ 2,700) can be so highly resolving and musical does not quite surprise me. In direct comparisons I have heard my own Yggdrasil DAC, now in its LIM version (at $ 2,200), compete well with DACs that are multiple its price, so I am used to the idea. Both Jim and I play our DACs into preamps that are worth multiples the price of our DACs.

The DAC was just 2 days into break-in, thus more gains are still expected. What did blow my mind, however, was that Jim played with a USB cable from the streamer that cost 8 bucks and it sounded so good. He hadn’t gotten around yet to playing with his cable collection.

Also surprising was the fact that the Aurender streamer sounded so good and natural even though it is relatively cheap, too.

The other big surprise was of course how good the Mark Levinson 23.5 sounded. This 33 year-old, refurbished beast of an amp put many a modern amp to shame. It made you think.

(cont.)

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Al M. said:

After coming back from a truly excellent sashimi dinner

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bonzo75 said:

I assume this was at the restaurant Dakara sushi?

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Jimford said:

Unfortunately not! They are closed for now due to their beautiful daughter Maya fighting brain cancer. Prayers her way please!

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Al M. said:

The experience confirms that you need a large room for obtaining the best sound.

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Ron Resnick said:

I have found there to be a strong correlation between room size and believability and enjoyment of the sound (hence my "system + room" tiering).

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Al M. said:

Thanks.
Clipping: At 400 W/ch into a 95 dB sensitive speaker?

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Ron Resnick said:

I have found there to be a strong correlation between room size and believability and enjoyment of the sound (hence my "system + room" tiering).

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Al M. said:

Oh, ok. Yes, it's a keeper!

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bonzo75 said:

Your room tiering had to do with purpose built rooms plus systems

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Ron Resnick said:

No, not independent from size. I'd much rather have a large non-purpose built room than a small purpose built room.

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Al M. said:

Thanks! Hmm. I thought you didn't even like classical music...Half of it was about Bruckner

Hey, just teasing

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