Very funny post.
I would suggest that if the speaker cables were taken out the Divin would be less impresive too!!!
Anyway Tripoint models used were Elite and Empress.
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5th AudioExotics Super Hi-End Show
- Thread starter Stereophonic
- Start date
I would suggest that if the speaker cables were taken out the Divin would be less impresive too!!!
Anyway Tripoint models used were Elite and Empress.
Spirit , AC ... Here you go .
The rooms in descending order of preference.
First on my list was the Trinity suite . This consisted of a complete Trinity chain , including the power filters and all cables . There was no Tripoint grounding applied in this room , as Dietmar believes that his good engineering practices help in noise not affecting the ground plane of his electronics.
The speakers were the Cessaro Carmen and the TT in residence was the Da Vinci Gabriel V3 with the Virtu XXL arm and Da Vinci cartridge . Premiering were the Golden Reference Series . So far the range consists of the Server , Pre amp and the soon to be completed Phono . A centralized PSU , fed the GR units. It was a huge room , as were all the three rooms . The sound was clean , clean , clean and fast without sounding hurried . The cumulative effect of a full Trinity chain does give the term zero distortion a meaningful connection to proceedings
Played at high dB levels given the acreage it was effortlessly room filling , finessed with a good holographic projection and absolutely no stridency, glare or hardness. While Vinyl was better in degrees of goodness , the gulf between analog and digital was not such that listening to digital made you long for the other . Maybe I am comfortable with the sound of the DAC , having one in my chain and that sort of alleviated the comfort factor. I did at times wish that that they had used a fully passive speaker design and let the Trinity mono amps full reign. There is no warming up of sound , nor elongated decay trails if that's your thing . The rise and fall of the note is as produced at the event, a clear glass less window . Tea without sugar .
Dietmar has produced a new range of cables , if they go up and are proved against other benchmarks , they sure will bust a lot of audiophile beliefs . They are the Scrawniest slimline cables ever . Be interesting if there's much more on them.
Second up the Qian Long and Engstrom room .... Coming from the Trinity room , it takes a while to acclimatize , to a more shall we say traditional sound . One which many might prefer given personal tastes . The Digital duties were carried out by the JMF 3.7 transport linked to the JMF DAC , while the TT in residence was the Disc Rotator Ultimate coupled to the Thales Statement arm and a Etsuro Cobalt Blue cart . The Robert Koda phono made an appearance , with pre amplification duties carried out by the Monica Ver2 pre amp . The power filter applied was the Trinity box. Cables were a mix of Dalby plus Tripoint . There was some serious Tripoint fire power here , with the now flagship Elite along with the Empress speaker grounding units and two other Tripoint Thor SE units .
The gulf between digital and analog was immense . I have not heard much about the JMF DAC nor had prior experience of it , but that's where I would be pointing a finger at . Am sure the new Koda phono further helped tilt the scales . Spinning vinyl gave it wings to spread and soar . The GIP paper drivers of the the Qian Long producing a tone that was organic and had good tone density . The balance was tilted mid range "down" and not tilted towards the tweet . This incidentally is the centering that I prefer , provided there is no loss of HF extension or detail. It scaled well to be room filling without any audible signs of mechanical stress , giving a sense of effortlessness . The sound was not tubey but had a clear tone with good control of the 18 inch field coil bass drivers . Apparently Timo Engstrom is an active choir singer , as was his father and I suppose he has voiced the amps using this sensibility .
Miguel from Tripoint is a fun guy , he mentioned to me that this level of sound reproduction is rarely if ever heard at the Axpona and other US shows . Nearing closing time , he unplugged the Tripoint Elite from the system ..... The sound-field collapsed shrinking from its glorious finessed self to one of mortal dimensions . Plug it back in and the boosters lit up , life was good . Normalcy restored . It would have been great , if the Trinity room employed a grounding scheme . In spite of Dietmar's belief , his products from personal experience do respond to "quasi "Grounding .
The Third room was the Wadax /Zanden /Gobel room . While it had immense heroic potential , it only offered a glimpse of its grandstanding capabilities . For me it didn't come together, to be aurally convincing as a whole . I put this down to maybe a learning curve for AE on how to make the DIVIN sing , it being new to their stable . Figuring out the correct amp - speaker interface along with cable voicing and other such finer points . Given the above , I would like to reserve judgement on the DIVIN , until I hear it hopefully at a later date .
There is understandably a lot of cynicism about the AE badge . Given it's uber high price tags and proclamations to frequent advances in reproduction . Proofs in the pudding though , there is no denying the SQ on offer . Upper echelon without doubt . Maybe this is what it costs in terms of product development and to be challenging their designers to constantly push the boundaries . They are not bound as are other distributors to achieve target sales and lucky to have an affluent clientele , who it seems are willing to shell out for advances to the reproduced art . It can't get any better next year , I keep saying or can it ? We shall see .....
The rooms in descending order of preference.
First on my list was the Trinity suite . This consisted of a complete Trinity chain , including the power filters and all cables . There was no Tripoint grounding applied in this room , as Dietmar believes that his good engineering practices help in noise not affecting the ground plane of his electronics.
The speakers were the Cessaro Carmen and the TT in residence was the Da Vinci Gabriel V3 with the Virtu XXL arm and Da Vinci cartridge . Premiering were the Golden Reference Series . So far the range consists of the Server , Pre amp and the soon to be completed Phono . A centralized PSU , fed the GR units. It was a huge room , as were all the three rooms . The sound was clean , clean , clean and fast without sounding hurried . The cumulative effect of a full Trinity chain does give the term zero distortion a meaningful connection to proceedings
Played at high dB levels given the acreage it was effortlessly room filling , finessed with a good holographic projection and absolutely no stridency, glare or hardness. While Vinyl was better in degrees of goodness , the gulf between analog and digital was not such that listening to digital made you long for the other . Maybe I am comfortable with the sound of the DAC , having one in my chain and that sort of alleviated the comfort factor. I did at times wish that that they had used a fully passive speaker design and let the Trinity mono amps full reign. There is no warming up of sound , nor elongated decay trails if that's your thing . The rise and fall of the note is as produced at the event, a clear glass less window . Tea without sugar .
Dietmar has produced a new range of cables , if they go up and are proved against other benchmarks , they sure will bust a lot of audiophile beliefs . They are the Scrawniest slimline cables ever . Be interesting if there's much more on them.
Second up the Qian Long and Engstrom room .... Coming from the Trinity room , it takes a while to acclimatize , to a more shall we say traditional sound . One which many might prefer given personal tastes . The Digital duties were carried out by the JMF 3.7 transport linked to the JMF DAC , while the TT in residence was the Disc Rotator Ultimate coupled to the Thales Statement arm and a Etsuro Cobalt Blue cart . The Robert Koda phono made an appearance , with pre amplification duties carried out by the Monica Ver2 pre amp . The power filter applied was the Trinity box. Cables were a mix of Dalby plus Tripoint . There was some serious Tripoint fire power here , with the now flagship Elite along with the Empress speaker grounding units and two other Tripoint Thor SE units .
The gulf between digital and analog was immense . I have not heard much about the JMF DAC nor had prior experience of it , but that's where I would be pointing a finger at . Am sure the new Koda phono further helped tilt the scales . Spinning vinyl gave it wings to spread and soar . The GIP paper drivers of the the Qian Long producing a tone that was organic and had good tone density . The balance was tilted mid range "down" and not tilted towards the tweet . This incidentally is the centering that I prefer , provided there is no loss of HF extension or detail. It scaled well to be room filling without any audible signs of mechanical stress , giving a sense of effortlessness . The sound was not tubey but had a clear tone with good control of the 18 inch field coil bass drivers . Apparently Timo Engstrom is an active choir singer , as was his father and I suppose he has voiced the amps using this sensibility .
Miguel from Tripoint is a fun guy , he mentioned to me that this level of sound reproduction is rarely if ever heard at the Axpona and other US shows . Nearing closing time , he unplugged the Tripoint Elite from the system ..... The sound-field collapsed shrinking from its glorious finessed self to one of mortal dimensions . Plug it back in and the boosters lit up , life was good . Normalcy restored . It would have been great , if the Trinity room employed a grounding scheme . In spite of Dietmar's belief , his products from personal experience do respond to "quasi "Grounding .
The Third room was the Wadax /Zanden /Gobel room . While it had immense heroic potential , it only offered a glimpse of its grandstanding capabilities . For me it didn't come together, to be aurally convincing as a whole . I put this down to maybe a learning curve for AE on how to make the DIVIN sing , it being new to their stable . Figuring out the correct amp - speaker interface along with cable voicing and other such finer points . Given the above , I would like to reserve judgement on the DIVIN , until I hear it hopefully at a later date .
There is understandably a lot of cynicism about the AE badge . Given it's uber high price tags and proclamations to frequent advances in reproduction . Proofs in the pudding though , there is no denying the SQ on offer . Upper echelon without doubt . Maybe this is what it costs in terms of product development and to be challenging their designers to constantly push the boundaries . They are not bound as are other distributors to achieve target sales and lucky to have an affluent clientele , who it seems are willing to shell out for advances to the reproduced art . It can't get any better next year , I keep saying or can it ? We shall see .....
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thank you Jazzhead, excellent write-up. I got the feeling for each system objectively but also a touch of the degree of soul and musical communication.
it's an object lesson on just how much synergy, as well as system tweaking, play such a role in the degree of listening enjoyment and ease.
there is no plug and play at the highest level as extreme's of performance also result in non-linearity's jumping out more prominently. and how an open mind is required to find the ultimate performance.....which is hard for any manufacturer. they need to be single minded to produce their products for us. as customers we are not so likely to be defensive in our approach.
it's an object lesson on just how much synergy, as well as system tweaking, play such a role in the degree of listening enjoyment and ease.
there is no plug and play at the highest level as extreme's of performance also result in non-linearity's jumping out more prominently. and how an open mind is required to find the ultimate performance.....which is hard for any manufacturer. they need to be single minded to produce their products for us. as customers we are not so likely to be defensive in our approach.
Fantastic report, Jazzhead
Ked and I have heard the Cessaro Liszt (from which the Carmen is a slight variation of), and have had varying experiences of/reactions to
It's interesting to hear that you felt it rely is up there as a stellar performer
Certainly Ked and I haven't heard it w anything approaching the superiority of Trinity electronics
Ked and I have heard the Cessaro Liszt (from which the Carmen is a slight variation of), and have had varying experiences of/reactions to
It's interesting to hear that you felt it rely is up there as a stellar performer
Certainly Ked and I haven't heard it w anything approaching the superiority of Trinity electronics
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Mike, have to agree
I've spent the last 20 years finding the components that "speak" to me
And the 21st year making the whole thing as intelligible as possible
Now w room acoustics and power grid uber neutral and linear, I'm getting real stripping of remaining veils and plunging noise floor w really open and quiet power cords and highly isolating platforms
By no means am I suggesting I'm getting anything like the SQ in your room or the AE rooms
But I'm sure the extra level of vividness, spookiness and realness at yours and AEs is down to getting not just the synergy of gear but the drive to eliminate mechanical and electrical noise, and I'm making really good strides here myself
I do feel blessed that my efforts, and spend, is really paying dividends
I've spent the last 20 years finding the components that "speak" to me
And the 21st year making the whole thing as intelligible as possible
Now w room acoustics and power grid uber neutral and linear, I'm getting real stripping of remaining veils and plunging noise floor w really open and quiet power cords and highly isolating platforms
By no means am I suggesting I'm getting anything like the SQ in your room or the AE rooms
But I'm sure the extra level of vividness, spookiness and realness at yours and AEs is down to getting not just the synergy of gear but the drive to eliminate mechanical and electrical noise, and I'm making really good strides here myself
I do feel blessed that my efforts, and spend, is really paying dividends
My pleasure Mike .
Spirit ... Given your listening tastes am pretty sure the Carmen -Trinity chain would rock your senses . Ked with his classical slant may wish to infuse a certain tube inner glow to proceedings . The fare played was a mixture ... Some audiophile staples ... Pop , jazz , blues , classical ( yes to Mahler) , Cantonese pop . Not much rock , but am sure the set up would blaze it .
Spirit ... Given your listening tastes am pretty sure the Carmen -Trinity chain would rock your senses . Ked with his classical slant may wish to infuse a certain tube inner glow to proceedings . The fare played was a mixture ... Some audiophile staples ... Pop , jazz , blues , classical ( yes to Mahler) , Cantonese pop . Not much rock , but am sure the set up would blaze it .
Finances aside, I'd have to say no to the Liszt/Trinity
I have the space for them, 800 sq ft and 5000 cub ft
Unfortunately my descending eaves means 7' high spkrs are out since my ceiling sweeps down from midline apex of 10' to 4' high side walls 18' apart
5' high is as far as I can practically entertain
And anyhow, a small fortune spent on achieving nirvana in open, airy acoustics and spooky quiet, pure power, means I have no desire to look past my current gear, it's truly over performing
My point is that's it's really not necessary to go to these AE levels of uber pricey gear
Find the combination of sounds you like at a level you can realistically afford, and then put a commensurate budget into maxxing room acoustics, power and vibn isolation
I can honestly say knowing what I have achieved with my new room, and how poor in comparison my last room compared, given the choice of my spend of $80-100k on my new room acoustics and power but sticking w current moderate gear, or keeping my old poor room and filling it w Cessaro, Trinity etc, I absolutely would pick my new room all day long
I have the space for them, 800 sq ft and 5000 cub ft
Unfortunately my descending eaves means 7' high spkrs are out since my ceiling sweeps down from midline apex of 10' to 4' high side walls 18' apart
5' high is as far as I can practically entertain
And anyhow, a small fortune spent on achieving nirvana in open, airy acoustics and spooky quiet, pure power, means I have no desire to look past my current gear, it's truly over performing
My point is that's it's really not necessary to go to these AE levels of uber pricey gear
Find the combination of sounds you like at a level you can realistically afford, and then put a commensurate budget into maxxing room acoustics, power and vibn isolation
I can honestly say knowing what I have achieved with my new room, and how poor in comparison my last room compared, given the choice of my spend of $80-100k on my new room acoustics and power but sticking w current moderate gear, or keeping my old poor room and filling it w Cessaro, Trinity etc, I absolutely would pick my new room all day long
Hi Jazz.
Thank you for your report.
It must be a big challenge to setup a crazy system as the Divin one.
I was told that there were a lot of cable combinations before the show.
Even the Trinity monos were on the main system.
Your description make sense. I doubt that they had enough time to undestand the hole chain.
An all brand system like Trinity is more predictable.
The Trinity cables are very intriguing. They are so different to the rest !!!
Trinity power cable on Wadax Transport.
Did you go to the Wadax MQA Demo?
Thank you for your report.
It must be a big challenge to setup a crazy system as the Divin one.
I was told that there were a lot of cable combinations before the show.
Even the Trinity monos were on the main system.
Your description make sense. I doubt that they had enough time to undestand the hole chain.
An all brand system like Trinity is more predictable.
The Trinity cables are very intriguing. They are so different to the rest !!!
Trinity power cable on Wadax Transport.
Did you go to the Wadax MQA Demo?
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Hi Stereo , although there seemed to be higher resolution on tap with MQA, it was far from convincing to be a open and shut case . I came away not yet a believer .
Thanks much Jazzhead. You are right - and Dietmar is wrong -: his Trinity components do (very clearly) benefit from grounding through Tripoint components. Pity Dietmar is so stubborn that he does not want to admit this.
Your description makes clear that the over the top descriptions of the Divin room should - in your view anyway - be taken with a (large) grain of salt.
Do I understand you correctly that due to the problems in the Divin room it is not yet possible to comment on the (real) potential of the new Zanden push pull amps and how they for example compare to the single ended Chouku Zanden amps?
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Wow nice write-up and pics are great.
Regarding the tube inner glow, my top 3 systems including Mike's, Apogee Grands, and Yamamuras are all SS. Other horns are tubes. As you know I have preferred Vitus to some tubes. So that's not a requirement. My problem with these kind of Cessaro models was that the closed cabinet, at least with the Liszt, was sounding like a different speaker compared to the mids.
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