Apple's Market Share Now Worth $$ Half Trillion
- Thread starter Steve Williams
- Start date
A HUGE sum of money! I wonder how long it'll be before Apple just buys the US? 
The USA can even keep their name, except the A will stand for Apple!
The USA can even keep their name, except the A will stand for Apple!
I just saw on CNBC that Apple is worth more than
1. The GDP of Poland
2. All of the naval airfleets and warships of the USA
3. All of the value of the highways in the USA
1. The GDP of Poland
2. All of the naval airfleets and warships of the USA
3. All of the value of the highways in the USA
It is a remarkable rise, based on old fashion economics of selling widgets for a profit as opposed to pure hype of a company. Question is way down the road, can there be troubles given the fact none of the current management is remotely the same as Jobs in skills, insight or attitude. If there is no discontinuity in the technology or marketplace, they can ride this for a long time. But if there is, you only need to look at Microsoft and evolution of tablets and phones to know that all it takes is one second and you are a "has been" rather than the new darling.
I was talking to one of my ex employees who used to work at Apple. She says Cook and crew are classic managers with none of the things Jobs had. So while my portfolio manager has Apple stock now, I would want to look at this a few years down the road.
I was talking to one of my ex employees who used to work at Apple. She says Cook and crew are classic managers with none of the things Jobs had. So while my portfolio manager has Apple stock now, I would want to look at this a few years down the road
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It is a remarkable rise, based on old fashion economics of selling widgets for a profit as opposed to pure hype of a company. Question is way down the road, can there be troubles given the fact none of the current management is remotely the same as Jobs in skills, insight or attitude. If there is no discontinuity in the technology or marketplace, they can ride this for a long time. But if there is, you only need to look at Microsoft and evolution of tablets and phones to know that all it takes is one second and you are a "has been" rather than the new darling.
I was talking to one of my ex employees who used to work at Apple. She says Cook and crew are classic managers with none of the things Jobs had. So while my portfolio manager has Apple stock now, I would want to look at this a few years down the road
Time to sell then? I've been holding since the mid 90 s.
Tim
Not if they are going to give dividends. With $100B in the bank, that should be a good number as they may give out a chunk of that to start. And right, according to my banker, dividend paying stocks are the place you want to be ("paid to wait").
iPad3's comin' too.
* And front projectors (60" size screen) from a cell phone (Samsung); comin' this year!
And no, I'm kidding you not.
* And front projectors (60" size screen) from a cell phone (Samsung); comin' this year!
And no, I'm kidding you not.
Hi
I am always leery of these valuations. I am trying simple Arithmetics here. What was Apple last year total revenues? about $65 Billions .. Huge number but let's assume half of that is pure profit (I know HUGE assumptiona and certainly false) So Apple made a profit of $30 Billions last year .. And we expect this to go on for 5 to 10 years ? Well several people will make a lot of money based on this but I do remember that in march 2001, Cisco reached these exhalted number for a few days ... Shades of the valuations during the dot-com era ... True, Apple , at least makes real money ... but 500 Billion valuation !!!???
I am always leery of these valuations. I am trying simple Arithmetics here. What was Apple last year total revenues? about $65 Billions .. Huge number but let's assume half of that is pure profit (I know HUGE assumptiona and certainly false) So Apple made a profit of $30 Billions last year .. And we expect this to go on for 5 to 10 years ? Well several people will make a lot of money based on this but I do remember that in march 2001, Cisco reached these exhalted number for a few days ... Shades of the valuations during the dot-com era ... True, Apple , at least makes real money ... but 500 Billion valuation !!!???
The article says the multiple is 15 or something close to it which is inline with the average for the market. That said, yes, the law of big numbers is a big concern. The only thing offsetting it is the dividend.
Am I missing something or is the value simply calculated by the value of a share at market close multiplied by the number of shares.
That's right. They have 932.37M shares outstanding. So if you multiply that by $542 share price you get $505B or so.Am I missing something or is the value simply calculated by the value of a share at market close multiplied by the number of shares.
They have $100B in cash so the rest of the company is valued at $400B.
I was responding to Frantz' post so you took my reply out of context. Frantz was trying to suggest market value is miscalculated. I was just doing the math
I do understand how the valuation of a company is calculated. I simply find the value of the shares themselves extremly unrealistic ... My education on the value of shares came sometimes around 1997 ..Ascend Communications was (one of) the darling of Wall Stre.. They were the leaders in making high density 33.6 Kbit/s modem for ISP... (The famed TNT) AOL announced they were going to add 15,000,000 more customers or some crazy numbers... The Contract was awarded to Ascend .. the value of Ascend shot up threefold upon announcement of the award of the contract ... The only problem was that if Ascend were to produce those 15,000,000 (don't remember the exact number) modems in a year, virtually all manufacturer of modems would have had to be working for Ascend to the exclusion of all other companies ... an impossible scenario ...Value went down rather quickly and Ascend was later acquired by Lucent which was later acquired by Alcatel .... All this to say that this valuation supposes a lot of things that are not yet clear .. That Apple in this game of software will retain its technical leadership (not a given .. Android is moving fast) .. That the market will never be saturated ... (approaching saturation in market such as the USA and even some underdeveloped countries) ...etc...
Then again, Wall Street lives in its own parallel universe which only coincide with ours when they are about to blow the planet and need to be bailed out ...
Then again, Wall Street lives in its own parallel universe which only coincide with ours when they are about to blow the planet and need to be bailed out ...
Frantz,
you may be right in your feeling that it is unrealistic, but in terms of stock market it is pretty reasonable as their P/E ratio is under 15 and this is not bad; the higher the number the more "overheated" a stock share is.
So in market terms it is a pretty good stock.
My only concern is that without Steve Jobs it will lose direction in another 3-5 years from now; I remember the days when Apple went through a very bad patch many years ago.
Cheers
Orb
you may be right in your feeling that it is unrealistic, but in terms of stock market it is pretty reasonable as their P/E ratio is under 15 and this is not bad; the higher the number the more "overheated" a stock share is.
So in market terms it is a pretty good stock.
My only concern is that without Steve Jobs it will lose direction in another 3-5 years from now; I remember the days when Apple went through a very bad patch many years ago.
Cheers
Orb
What's unrealistic about it?
The OS platform for computers and mobile devices is becoming ubiquitous and is the preferred platform for users of digital content, in both professional and private contexts, whether you are just enjoying it, working with it, need to share it, sell it.
The app-revolution has opened up a large new economy for developers, who are improving upon the delivery of the platform much faster than a company's own R&D could, further enhancing the worth of the products.
I've registered that every product I use that can be enhanced by integration with app's, or other integration with Apple computers, has released an app or integration solution - from kitchen appliances to my car manufacturer.
All challengers have failed, and Apple has invaded field after field, dropping "Computer" from its name (2007) as a signal of its intent, and utilizing the strength of its platform and its control over software/hardware integration to expand exponentially.
That share is going to rise a lot more, for the very simple reason that Apple has a very small portion of the total number of devices used, and therefore ample room for growth. They're selling ten times as many tablets as Samsung, for a while they couldn't make them fast enough.
And the fact that people know they become part of the Apple experience at a premium certainly helps the share price.
The OS platform for computers and mobile devices is becoming ubiquitous and is the preferred platform for users of digital content, in both professional and private contexts, whether you are just enjoying it, working with it, need to share it, sell it.
The app-revolution has opened up a large new economy for developers, who are improving upon the delivery of the platform much faster than a company's own R&D could, further enhancing the worth of the products.
I've registered that every product I use that can be enhanced by integration with app's, or other integration with Apple computers, has released an app or integration solution - from kitchen appliances to my car manufacturer.
All challengers have failed, and Apple has invaded field after field, dropping "Computer" from its name (2007) as a signal of its intent, and utilizing the strength of its platform and its control over software/hardware integration to expand exponentially.
That share is going to rise a lot more, for the very simple reason that Apple has a very small portion of the total number of devices used, and therefore ample room for growth. They're selling ten times as many tablets as Samsung, for a while they couldn't make them fast enough.
And the fact that people know they become part of the Apple experience at a premium certainly helps the share price.
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As far as thes kinds of numbers go, this is one of the more realistic big ones I recall. Many of them have been based on short-term market activity, or things much less substantial. This is based on long-term strategic activity that has simply paid off. The lesson here, for every other company in the world, is put the customer experience first. Worry about earnings later.
It will be learned by few.
Tim
It will be learned by few.
Tim
Soundproof no disagreement but I feel a balance is required.
I remember in the past the very same sentiment for Sony, Nokia, Cisco, IBM, Intel, Microsoft, HP, Google (who were starting to look in trouble until they did a business model shift to include Android) , etc.
The problem is sustaining market share and growth once one becomes a behemoth (meant in a good way) of a business.
That said I am in the camp thinking its mkt cap is pretty good and Apple is a strong/very good company, but I am under no illusions the challenges facing Apple in the future from competitors and maintaining a good business and product model.
Cheers
Orb
I remember in the past the very same sentiment for Sony, Nokia, Cisco, IBM, Intel, Microsoft, HP, Google (who were starting to look in trouble until they did a business model shift to include Android) , etc.
The problem is sustaining market share and growth once one becomes a behemoth (meant in a good way) of a business.
That said I am in the camp thinking its mkt cap is pretty good and Apple is a strong/very good company, but I am under no illusions the challenges facing Apple in the future from competitors and maintaining a good business and product model.
Cheers
Orb
In terms of online retailing, what is Apple's rank? If I were to buy Apple stock today, it's the store and not so much the devices I'd be looking at for growth.
It would be interesting to see the breakdown between the different Apple revenue streams.
Just to clarify, personally I think growth requires a good business model and also products or services ; those other companies I mentioned when sentiment was at its height for them had both (excellent business model and also excellent product-marketing model) and then lost either the business model aspect or future product-services strategy.
Cheers
Orb
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