A2169 model.. A search on ebay for A2169 and setting a filter to "new" will bring up a lot of fact new A2169 models.
AppleTV X - I am playing with something new
- Thread starter Xymox
- Start date
You would think huh ? But Noooooo,,, the LGs can somehow find the HDR flag anyway and flip. Because of all that weirdness I have found its best to just give in on the LGs and do Dolby Vision... Plus the LGs seem to have a intentionally bad SDR setup,,, to maybe make Dolby look good ? hahaha..
Could they have something hidden in the service menus about that? Or possibly did they use a really cryptic (meaning Poorly Labeled) setting in the standard menus? On the Sony side, I've seen reports that changing a serial communications setting impacted HDMI, for the better. (I believe that disabled some CEC comms that were doing "magical" stuff.)
One thought might be to try one of these on the ATVX (I'm using one without any issue... though I have a Sony tv):
But even with that, I'd still set Match Dynamic Range to Off to make sure the ATVX doesn't send an HDR signal.
Oh cool. CEC Free ! hahaha.. Interesting..
The thing is,, if i set the ATVX to SDR and disable dynamic range content matching,,, you would think,, NO HDR/DV would get thru. But something does and the LG can see it. It is just metadata. So I was thinking that the ATV is just setting a HDR/SDR flag to SDR. And most displays adhear to this flag. But the metadata persists. SOOO if a display ignored the flag and just flipped modes when it saw the data and ignored the flag,, then that would explain what i saw.
Yes there could well be some deeply buried service menu setting on the LG. Dolby Vision was, ok,, on the LG. SDR would have required a serious calibration as it was no where near correct. SDR looked terrible. Like intentionally terrible. But Dolby looked great. Imagine that.
I would like to have hands on with the Panasonic OLED. I wish they would sell them here. That is so annoying.
I have a 2019 65" LG C2 OLED. Earlier with the Appletvx it did auto flip from the "Cinema" setting to the "Home Cinema" setting, which I noticed as the picture became too cartoonish and the tv was changing from 24 Hz to 60 Hz. But I put it back at "Cinema" and since then no issue and my LG has not on its own changed from 24 to 60 Hz or from SDR to HDR.
When I had my Lumagen 5348 in the system recently for about 2 weeks, I had no issue with the tv changing SDR to HDR or vice versa. Lumagen recently had a firmware upgrade which I could see improved its HDR tone mapping a fair amount. Nonetheless, SSR with the Appletvx still looks remarkable and better. Even with the Lumagen in the system. And also, perhaps even more so, with the Lumagen NOT in the system.
I suspect that when you watch different programs with different refresh rates, Dolby Vision, HDR, SDR, etc. that the LG may memorize what you have it set to for picture so when it next appears you get it again. Just my suspiction. Especially as I have had no reoccurence of the issue in quite some time.
I love the Lumagen 5348 for use in my theater (currently being upgraded/renovated), but I don't find visually any noticeable video improvement having it in my basement system with my LG OLED.
I have a Sony 83” Master Series A90j. The settings for the Apple TV is 4kSDR, RGB high and the match content settings set to on. Passes DV and HDR 10 through just fine. My set does have a full calibration. These settings are those recommended by the calibrator.
Awesome !.. I remember not long ago calibrators ALWAYS did 4KHDR.. I have done a bunch of posts in other forums talking about HDR and how it should be avoided. I am glad to see "These settings are those recommended by the calibrator."
I am happy to see the HDR myth is slowly fading away..
Good point.. Nothing like a Lumagen swiss army knife to sort out the mess and spit out the right thing.
A bit of caution tho. Maybe its just me being overly cautious, the electrical aspects of the HDMI coming from the ATVX is NOT normal and VERY low noise and its TMDS modulation levels are lab grade precise. The clocking on the TMDS is also way more precise then the HDMI std requires. Those signals are also long term stable with low drift. Feeding a Lumagen, or any device, makes it very happy. Ultimately tho the Lumagen produces a new HDMI signal on its output that is derived from its own source components. The Lumagen is great, no doubt, and fed crazy accurate signals is awesome, but, in my mind it would be better to feed a device directly. Of course this is nearly impossible as most systems would have a surround processor that does the HDMI switching. Like a Trinov or Datasat. So the HDMI again gets reclocked. The Lumagen would be the best way I suppose. The Datasat has a very well controlled HDMI board with super short traces and the Datasat rs20i uses a linear power supply.
The best solution, IMHO, is 2 ch. Like a high end stereo rig with a TV between a L/R speaker.. You plug the ATVX into the TV directly. Then optical out from the TV to a high end 2ch DAC. You set the ATVX to change format in audio and set it to 2 ch.. A lot of ATVX owners have done this and its amazing. I have also done this with super high end gear and its jaw dropping. The imaging and detail is stunning.. While I have access to Atmos, I really prefer the sound from a 2 channel setup. Its way more emotional and compelling.
ALL THAT SAID.. I have customers who have A/B/C/Ded all sorts of arrangements and told me that putting a Lumagen in-line made no difference. Or that a Datasat made no difference in pic quality.. SO... Maybe I am wrong
I could well be who knows..The source device determins a clock for a HDMI stream and so devices like a Datasat, Trinnov or Lumagen output is WAY better with the lab grade input as the clocking and stuff gets passed on.
I have seen a HUGE improvement over a std ATV even thru a Crestron DM 16x16 HDMI house distribution/switching system. So. Maybe the trick is for the source device to be just crazy good and that then gets passed on..
Steve has been fun
Like a press reviewer he has done all sorts of AB and AB against other gear and has taken tons of time and really looked at all this carefully.. Actually he has been more thorough then a press reviewer.
There is something new for the ATVX...
It turns out, even tho its hard for me to imagine why, but how you feed the ATVX with its network MATTERS to pic/sound. Others have mentioned this in this tread that, amazingly, ethernet cables seemed to matter. Its hard for me as a engineer to say there is a technical reason for this, but, I too have heard and seen it. So its hard for me to deny when I can tell differences even in a blind AB.
So.. Bill, my distributor, pushed me into making a ethernet switch. I complained and argued it can't really matter that much. BUT.. I made one. I decided to just max out every electrical parameter possible. Just go insanely overboard in every area. I focused on the technical aspects of TDMS signals used for ethernet, optical, SFP+, Direct attach SFP.. I made a switch just seriously lab grade in its output and insanely overboard in any way I could think of..
I sent this off to Bill and some others with super high end systems.
Well I will be damned.. Not only did they all like it VS other switches in ABs, they separately all described the same kind of improvements for high end audio server/DAC use. Not just streaming off the net, but using the switch between a local server ( like roon ) and a DAC. It even worked well to isolate a server DAC hooked up USB. I even created a special access point for audio use.
Recently, some of these same people plugged in the ATVX to it and said things like "OMG - Its twice as good"..
SO... Apparently... Feeding the ATVX with a super clean ethernet signal and doing it from a isolated "clean" network matters.
I have no technical reason I know of currently WHY a super cleaned up ethernet signal and switch chip would make such a difference, but, everyone so far who has played with it says it does. I admit, I saw it too.
Bill talked about the switch X and about the ATVX towards the end of this vid.
It turns out, even tho its hard for me to imagine why, but how you feed the ATVX with its network MATTERS to pic/sound. Others have mentioned this in this tread that, amazingly, ethernet cables seemed to matter. Its hard for me as a engineer to say there is a technical reason for this, but, I too have heard and seen it. So its hard for me to deny when I can tell differences even in a blind AB.
So.. Bill, my distributor, pushed me into making a ethernet switch. I complained and argued it can't really matter that much. BUT.. I made one. I decided to just max out every electrical parameter possible. Just go insanely overboard in every area. I focused on the technical aspects of TDMS signals used for ethernet, optical, SFP+, Direct attach SFP.. I made a switch just seriously lab grade in its output and insanely overboard in any way I could think of..
I sent this off to Bill and some others with super high end systems.
Well I will be damned.. Not only did they all like it VS other switches in ABs, they separately all described the same kind of improvements for high end audio server/DAC use. Not just streaming off the net, but using the switch between a local server ( like roon ) and a DAC. It even worked well to isolate a server DAC hooked up USB. I even created a special access point for audio use.
Recently, some of these same people plugged in the ATVX to it and said things like "OMG - Its twice as good"..
SO... Apparently... Feeding the ATVX with a super clean ethernet signal and doing it from a isolated "clean" network matters.
I have no technical reason I know of currently WHY a super cleaned up ethernet signal and switch chip would make such a difference, but, everyone so far who has played with it says it does. I admit, I saw it too.
Bill talked about the switch X and about the ATVX towards the end of this vid.
Chris, congrats on your DeJitterIt network switch. "Sounds" like it looks and sounds great!
I have 3 systems in my home. Dedicated theater being renovated, will be done in 3-4 months, with 14' wide screen, Sony GTZ-380 projector and Lumagen 5348 video processor, ISCO x 1.25 anamorphic lens, Trinnov Altitude 32 SSP, a 11.7.12 system! And of course Trinnov is ROON Ready for music. Family room system Exasound s88 7.1ch DAC, but its a 5.1 system Totem Acoustics on wall system (super high vaulted ceiling, can't do more speakers) with PS Audio Stellar monoblocks and REL subwoofers and a 65" tv with a Marantz SSP, and of course ROON for music. Basement 5.2.4 system with Totem Acoustiics on wall, NAD amplifiers, REL subwoofers, 65" OLED, Marantz SSP, and Kaleidscape movie players.
Appletvxs in basement system and one going in dedicated home theater! In my family room system, I use a Sonore OpticalModule Deluxe prior to the Exasound s88 DAC. In my basement system, I am using DJM Electronics Gigafoil, one for Appletvx and also one each for each Kaleidescape player (4k player, and blu ray disc/quality player); also a modified Cisco network switch (Fidilizer Ethernet 2), which feeds an Uptone Audio Etherregen network switch, then the Applietvx connects to the clean side of Etheregen and the Kaleidescape connect to the other side of the Etherregen, of course each with a Gigafoil v4 (converts from ethernet to optical and back to ethernet) inbetween. I tried taking out the Etheregen but darn ,Appletvx looks even better with it in. I tried taking out the Gigafoil v4, same, looks better with it in. And yea, sound is quite amazing!
Note that I have my ROON server, an Exasound Delta, and my network server, a 64 GB WDMyCloudPR4100 in my master bedroom. Everything is hardwired ethernet.
Of course, scary, if I add good linear power supplies for the Gigafoils may well improve even more. PLEASE STOP ME!
Of course I am interested in the Dejitterit switch. But with multiple audio and video systems just don't know how this could be accomlished effectively. And the Gigafoil v4s in basement (and planned for theater), and Sonore Audio Deluxe Optical Module in family room, do work well.
When you purchase a switch X does it also come with the Aruba?
The video wasn’t completely clear on that point. Bill seemed to indicate the Aruba WAP was being packaged with the Switch X.
Can you clarify? Other than the picture on the homepage, The Aruba is not noted on the dejitterit.com website.
Can you elaborate on the modifications and or upgrades being made to the Aruba WAP or will there be a separate page elaborating on those details?
Do the power supplies for the AppleTV X and the switch have multiple rails that could power a separate main router forexample that would sit next to the Switch X?
Go to Chris' Appletvx youtube channel fo rmore info on stuff:
AppleTV X - YouTube
I watched the video and Bill simply got into different but related subjects. I didn't get the impression that Chris sells or modifies the Aruba for wi-fi - simply that he recommends it. And Chris has a video on his Appletvx youtube site evaluating several wi-fi routers and explains why he recommends the Aruba.
In my case, my AV systems are all hardwired back to the cable modem in my theater room; and my wi-fi routers are all a good distance away from my audio components so I'm not concerned about pollution/noise in my av systems.
The Appletvx linear power supply has one very short connecting cable built into it which connects to the Appletvx. You can't power more than the one Appletvx with the power supply. My understanding from Chris (also over at the Audiophile Style Uptone Audio Forum, discussions by John Swenson who designed and built my Uptone Audio Etherregen network switcher) is that connecting more than one component to a LPS defeats somewhat the noise reduction benefits of using LPS in the first place.
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At 21:25 in the video by Bill Parish his statements sure sound like he both sells the Aruba and some modifications are done to it. He then talks about plugging it into the LPS that looks like the one from the AppleTV X. So he gives the impression this is a product being sold
Per the debit Eric.com website, The switch X and LPS are $3500. Not sure whether the Aruba is included in that cost or not
The Aruba is a add-on for the Switch X. Talk to Bill about cost for the whole system including it as a package. For the Appletv X, and for some installations, wifi is not needed. So its a add-on. I don't sell it separately.
It has a lot of tweaks. Its not off the shelf. First its a specific model. The IAP-325-US. The reason for this model is the wifi chipset. Its wifi 5. Wifi 6 introduced new modulations and some additional stuff and the chipset used end up with more wifi based jitter as a trade off for higher speeds. So wifi 6 is bad for our use, so the sligtly older IAP-325-US is best. For audio GUIs to do things like roon, speed is not important. I also tested out a bunch of firmware versions. I had to use a TFTP server and flash various firmware into it and test things like RF spectrum stuff, latency and jitter thru it. So I am flashing them with a specific firmware. I do a BUNCH of specific config changes that tailor it to audio GUI use and to reduce RF output so the wifi does not get picked up by other audio gear and interconnects. This involves using only 5 Ghz and a narrow channel and turning off a number of optional things to clean up its transmission characteristics. Wifi is very bursty and these mini blasts of RF could end up inducing low frequency modulations into interconnects and gear like phono preamps. The narrow channel only does 90 Mbps but that is more then enough to do a audio GUI on a ipad as that is ALL that should be hooked to it if your doing the super clean audio thing.. The Arubas are mil-spec shielded for use in places like the FBI/CIA/NSA/Military to handle classified material and so they don't emit any other RF but the wifi, so they are very low RF noise. I then use one of my 4 pin sensing/noise cancellation R-core transformer based linears and make a custom cable so the sensing leads go out to the jack that plugs into the Aruba. So this vastly lowers power supply noise and vastly improves regulation right at the tip of the DC plug at the Aruba. I also put on some neoprene feet and supply it with 90 degree ethernet cable. I refurbish the Arubas and warranty them and ten stuff them with the right firmware and config. Add the linear, interconnects, feet and box it all up.
This is a important add-on if your using the Switch X for audio use and using the clean networking. You need a wifi access point to hook to the clean network and your dedicated ipad. This makes for a very clean way to do wifi for audio streaming.
The way a wifi connection kinda rumbles can rumble sensitive audio gear, like a phono preamp or line level interconnects going from a preamp to a amp. This bursty, bump, bump, bump and various kinda continuous bumps at higher rates that it does could affect sensitive gear. You can see this pattern in this vid.
For AppleTV X use tho of the Switch X you dont need a access point. If you plan on doing audio streaming and control this thru a GUI on a ipad tho, then you do. Just be sure you understand how a switch X fully isolates everything plugged into the clean side before buying a Switch X.
It has a lot of tweaks. Its not off the shelf. First its a specific model. The IAP-325-US. The reason for this model is the wifi chipset. Its wifi 5. Wifi 6 introduced new modulations and some additional stuff and the chipset used end up with more wifi based jitter as a trade off for higher speeds. So wifi 6 is bad for our use, so the sligtly older IAP-325-US is best. For audio GUIs to do things like roon, speed is not important. I also tested out a bunch of firmware versions. I had to use a TFTP server and flash various firmware into it and test things like RF spectrum stuff, latency and jitter thru it. So I am flashing them with a specific firmware. I do a BUNCH of specific config changes that tailor it to audio GUI use and to reduce RF output so the wifi does not get picked up by other audio gear and interconnects. This involves using only 5 Ghz and a narrow channel and turning off a number of optional things to clean up its transmission characteristics. Wifi is very bursty and these mini blasts of RF could end up inducing low frequency modulations into interconnects and gear like phono preamps. The narrow channel only does 90 Mbps but that is more then enough to do a audio GUI on a ipad as that is ALL that should be hooked to it if your doing the super clean audio thing.. The Arubas are mil-spec shielded for use in places like the FBI/CIA/NSA/Military to handle classified material and so they don't emit any other RF but the wifi, so they are very low RF noise. I then use one of my 4 pin sensing/noise cancellation R-core transformer based linears and make a custom cable so the sensing leads go out to the jack that plugs into the Aruba. So this vastly lowers power supply noise and vastly improves regulation right at the tip of the DC plug at the Aruba. I also put on some neoprene feet and supply it with 90 degree ethernet cable. I refurbish the Arubas and warranty them and ten stuff them with the right firmware and config. Add the linear, interconnects, feet and box it all up.
This is a important add-on if your using the Switch X for audio use and using the clean networking. You need a wifi access point to hook to the clean network and your dedicated ipad. This makes for a very clean way to do wifi for audio streaming.
The way a wifi connection kinda rumbles can rumble sensitive audio gear, like a phono preamp or line level interconnects going from a preamp to a amp. This bursty, bump, bump, bump and various kinda continuous bumps at higher rates that it does could affect sensitive gear. You can see this pattern in this vid.
For AppleTV X use tho of the Switch X you dont need a access point. If you plan on doing audio streaming and control this thru a GUI on a ipad tho, then you do. Just be sure you understand how a switch X fully isolates everything plugged into the clean side before buying a Switch X.
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