Can You Believe This-The Government Wants Us To Go EV but In So Doing They Will impose a gas surcharge

[DaveC]

I'd add a big 5. here, and that is that in every teardown, Tesla's circuit boards and other innards are thought to be some years ahead of their competitors. Audi basically acknowledged this at one point.

No doubt the Germans, etc. at some point will catch up, but at least at this moment, they are in first gen with the attendant problems of that vs. Tesla at gen 3 or 4.

Longtime owner of Tesla stock here (so take above as you will), though recently sold some. It's a volatile stock (in a shaky market IMO), and I will likely rebuy if/when a good drop occurs.

Tesla also has a big head start in autonomous driving. The new autopilot with nav can change lanes and exit the highway by it's self.

 

[DonH50]

Cost & all of installing an EV charger in your garage ...

• 2 levels /// https://www.realtor.com/advice/home-improvement/installing-electric-vehicle-charger/
* There is a 3rd level but I'm not sure if it is implemented yet.

• 2 voltages // https://homeguides.sfgate.com/can-electric-car-plugged-home-electricity-outlet-78896.html
_____

? https://www.greencarreports.com/new...r-electric-car-charging-what-you-need-to-know

"Installing an electric car station in the home can cost several thousand dollars. However, it's important to note how much money electric vehicle owners save just by driving a car that does not require gas. A typical electric vehicle owner will spend about $300 per year on electricity to charge their vehicle, versus the $1,000 to $2,500 they spend per year on gasoline.

This savings can build up over time. Once the charger installation and the electric vehicle itself are paid for, electric vehicle owners may spend far less on transportation than people who own gasoline-powered vehicles."

It is this line in the first article that my electric co-op is saying: "The installation process could cost more if your main point of charging will require major electrical upgrades. " They are assuming I will need 11.5 kWhr all the time, which is of course not true, but I am having a hard time figuring out exactly what I do need. But I have not spent all that much time researching; I thought there might be an easy-to-find clear white paper on the Tesla site but did not find one in my first look.

As I said before, the cost is not just to run the line in my house, it is adding the capacity to my electrical service, and I need to provide a reasonable estimate (unless I want to fork up $30k~$50k or so). I am in a rural'ish area so they basically want to charge me for a new dedicated service, i.e. cost of running a new line to the substation or whatever. Installing the line would be a little more for me as I have a backup generator and transfer switch but that is not the big hit.

 

[NorthStar]

Don, it was a general info on the subject of EV chargers in a garage.
Some friends have it here and it was relatively easy and inexpensive.
I don't have the specifics of which level they selected.

I would suggest you call your local EV expert electrician for your specific enquiries.

 

[johnjake]

I drove trucks (4x4) for over 40 years, I needed them for work and where I lived.
Zero macho thing here, they were essential to my line of work and living.
I worked in the forest industry, higher altitude, off roads and on very rough terrains and from almost inaccessible roads in some cases.
I used to live where no cars could drive up, and in the winter time I had to put heavy duty chains on all four wheels of my 4x4 pickup truck.
When not working I drove convertible sports cars. Two of my trucks were also convertible, one 2x4 and the other 4x4 but I rarely removed their hard tops. Instead I switched to the sports cars.
I could put my skis on the rear rack of my smaller sports car.
I could put my canoe on top of my trucks, not on top of my sports cars.
My trucks (crewcabs) were essential for contracts in the mountains that could last months.
I needed enough space for all my gear. I could write few books but I simply won't.
____

Now, forget macho and and all that crap; in California yesterday they cut power to half million people.
The ones who drive electric cars where are they going to plug their cars in order to recharge them?
https://www.fastcompany.com/9041533...o-charge-their-cars-before-the-power-goes-out

And say you live in a zone where power can be out for days, weeks, and your only transportation is electric. I guess electric is out of the question in such zones, and now that climate change is creating more power outages caused by CO2 from gas cars. It sounds a little ironic isn't it?

This amazing and difficult work that you have done in past, all of your work was good experience that can help you to prepare for future. I think solar will also a good option for those people who have electric car and truck to recharge them. Why people not use car and truck that can be convert on gas and patrol and electricity.....? I hope people also know about this option but not using so their will be good reason that you know because you have much experience......?

 

[NorthStar]

The times they are changing. Yesterday I've read this super short article:
? https://electrek.co/2019/11/30/tesla-model-s-1-million-km/amp/

And couple days ago:
• https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-...rice-Plunge-A-Sign-Of-Things-To-Come.amp.html

 

[DonH50]

An engineering view of the problem and what needs doing to solve it -- basically, a breakthrough.

https://spectrum.ieee.org/energy/re...vZ3EzQnNLV1dkQndMVlpoSzFIRXBMd2VNMGNSQlAifQ==

 

[Empirical Audio]

An engineering view of the problem and what needs doing to solve it -- basically, a breakthrough.

https://spectrum.ieee.org/energy/renewables/what-it-would-really-take-to-reverse-climate-change?utm_source=techalert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=techalert-12-12-19&mkt_tok=eyJpIjoiTjJGaFpUbG1ORGhpWW1FeSIsInQiOiJReHd0SGtCRzkxTlR6T3dzZDhkUThWUVgzTzFYVm42UGpERHV6VW1rTEVcL1ZEY1lxRkJlbWRZT1wvNHE4T1R3QmZiQktDVjVcL0dzMG0waDNJWjJ4RjY2WnVCVUVMXC93QTBKMVVvZ3EzQnNLV1dkQndMVlpoSzFIRXBMd2VNMGNSQlAifQ==

Very sobering graphs. I think we are screwed. It's hard not to give up on the cause.

 

[NorthStar]

I too read that article yesterday. Thanks Don for posting it.

 

[DaveC]

Very sobering graphs. I think we are screwed. It's hard not to give up on the cause.

What we need to realize, as I've said repeatedly, is EVs don't matter in the face of reality. We need bigger, faster change.

Here's a new VICE video, this may give you hope. IMO we need to implement all of this stuff on a relatively small scale NOW, and if it works quickly scale up. I'd put energy into this rather than advocating for questionable tech like Li-battery powered EVs.

We need to work on multiple solutions, which includes conservation and reforestation, along with changes in the way we work and farm.

Maybe we won't need to use geoengineering "full scale" but we need to use it to some degree as we've already dumped so much CO2 into the atmosphere that we need to reduce it, not simply cut back on emissions.

 

[Empirical Audio]

What we need to realize, as I've said repeatedly, is EVs don't matter in the face of reality. We need bigger, faster change.

Here's a new VICE video, this may give you hope. IMO we need to implement all of this stuff on a relatively small scale NOW, and if it works quickly scale up. I'd put energy into this rather than advocating for questionable tech like Li-battery powered EVs.

We need to work on multiple solutions, which includes conservation and reforestation, along with changes in the way we work and farm.

Maybe we won't need to use geoengineering "full scale" but we need to use it to some degree as we've already dumped so much CO2 into the atmosphere that we need to reduce it, not simply cut back on emissions.

What is faster than trading in your car for an EV or just purchasing one if you are a first time buyer??

Changing power sources and heat sources takes a decade.

 

[the sound of Tao]

What we need to realize, as I've said repeatedly, is EVs don't matter in the face of reality. We need bigger, faster change.

Here's a new VICE video, this may give you hope. IMO we need to implement all of this stuff on a relatively small scale NOW, and if it works quickly scale up. I'd put energy into this rather than advocating for questionable tech like Li-battery powered EVs.

We need to work on multiple solutions, which includes conservation and reforestation, along with changes in the way we work and farm.

Maybe we won't need to use geoengineering "full scale" but we need to use it to some degree as we've already dumped so much CO2 into the atmosphere that we need to reduce it, not simply cut back on emissions.

Thanks Dave, some really amazing science going on, some of it seems as amazing as it also potentially seems a bit scary.

The carbon recycling for energy looks an extraordinary potential, as does the cloud brightening project.

The replicating volcanic process and releasing sulphur into the atmosphere does sound perhaps the scariest of all the earth engineering ideas presented and even the guys researching it as a concept seems to have some very serious concerns if it were to go bad on us.

Large scale reforestation for sequestration and protection of diversity and species and soil loss normally would (and if it had been done in an effort to reverse land clearing 40 years ago it would have perhaps even have solved the issue in the first place) be the most immediately obvious way of responding to sequestration with a key ecological process for carbon capture.
It clearly needs to be a long term goal I’d have thought to renormalise the planet but given the current forest fire intensive impacts of 1 degree c temperature rise (and it’s potential impacts for the next century given the sustained presence of current carbon in the atmosphere) I’d have thought we very much need to look at many and all other carbon harvesting processes. Harvesting carbon may be the most important human activity for the century ahead.

Sequestration into soil via mycorrhizal fungi to create more viable agricultural soils is also potentially a big picture win win (carbon reduction as part of food security) if it is shown to be viable. Using sea weeds as a source of agricultural feed as a process to minimise methane is also very interesting.

Regenerative agriculture as a replication of natural processes to maintain biomass and a return to a less chemically additive and ecologically natural process to ensure food productivity and high quality land usage is also an important area of agricultural earth sciences research.

Any change to our directions for transport technology that captures rather that largely casts aside current infrastructure and involves carbon recycling is also a high win in terms of maintaining a low embodied energy and carbon production as we transition to low operational energy and carbon emission. Recycling carbon then further wins in terms of potentially sustainably reducing the significant end of life issues for all carbon intensive products and processes by being cradle to cradle in approach and in terms of long term goals of transport energy demand management.

As the report says there will not be any one single simple solve here. No universal panacea, we’ll need to explore every option and apply precautionary principles including both carbon and ethical accounting to find sufficient and safer ways ahead for us to shift into a new phase of less resource intensive human activity that can allow us to fit into a resource and carbon budget that actually fits our current circumstances. We certainly can’t afford another Pandora’s box at the moment as our margin for error is virtually zero given the current vulnerability of the planet and its state of ecological imbalance and the tipping points into the biofeedback and system failure.

The sustained model of linear growth is absolutely gone now that we are well beyond maxxed out in terms of renewable biocapacity and the current atmospheric carbon concentrations. We have to shift across now into a new phase and a new way of sustaining the system in how much and how we use and not just finding new ways to consume even more than this planet can possibly hope to cope with.

 

[magichifi]

In the UK road tax for all EVs is free to encourage the take up of cleaner vehicles