Dreaming About a New Cartridge

[flez007]

I listened to it again mep, and had a friend who was after my Avid so I took his offer and installed the EMT in my main system, now I remember why I liked it that much in the first place!

I am working in by-passing the internal MM preamo to use the EMT MC cartridge and further improve its lush sound.

 

[mep]

And to think you almost let it get away!

 

[JackD201]

Yeah. I almost jumped on it but it was withdrawn while I was counting the contents of my piggy bank.

 

[mep]

Jack-Fernando couldn't wait for the two years it would take you to count your money.

 

[JackD201]

Yeah pennies take way too long to count! Dang recession!

 

[flez007]

Yeah pennies take way too long to count! Dang recession!

Jack - nothing that you AMEX Centurion card can't take care of

 

[Nevillekapadia]

Jack- you mentioned an upgraded or new model over the My Sonic Ultra Eminent 'Bc' local Japanese model. Are you talking about the 'Ex' export model? Is there any difference between the two? Or is there a new one completely?

Please could you share with us what you've heard.

Thanks,

Neville

 

[JackD201]

Hi Neville,

I was mistaken. Apparently they are the same. Bc is the original and later they badged units for the export market Ex. Because of the price hike (in hindsight probably due to currency exchange differences) I wrongly assumed that the Ex was a new, higher model because aside from price, there was no Ex when I got mine.

Sorry about that I should have corrected this right when my brother set me straight right after reading the post of mine you referred to.

I also got the new Lyra cart's name wrong. I was told it was Apollo but turned out to be Atlas.

 

[JackD201]

See that's why I need to hear these new stone bodied Koetsus. I totally agree with everything you said about the wood bodied cartridges. Slow to the point of sound a beat behind. Not much in the way of upper octave extension and ill defined bass. A lot to pay for just some midrange---and esp. there are other cartridges with basically better overall sonics.

Another thing I noticed about Koetsus is they like more gain than their output ratings suggest. I have no idea why this is the case but the top end really opens up when you do give 'em more. It doesn't come at the expense of the midrange either. High sixties to mid seventies total gain recommended IMHO.

 

[Nevillekapadia]

Thanks for the info Jack. My thoughts to get a My Sonic Ultra is strong, after hearing one. Have not heard the Benz LP-S which is also raved about and priced more modreately.
Neville

 

[MylesBAstor]

Another thing I noticed about Koetsus is they like more gain than their output ratings suggest. I have no idea why this is the case but the top end really opens up when you do give 'em more. It doesn't come at the expense of the midrange either. High sixties to mid seventies total gain recommended IMHO.

I find that with most cartridges And the gain is better placed in the phono section eg. say 68 plus 10 then say 53 plus 25. The biggest difference is dynamics. Now one has to be careful about how the gain is derived, eg adding more gain stages to the circuit to achieve the goal is actually counterproductive.

 

[JackD201]

I totally agree Myles. I've had phono stages that sacrifice gain for a more silent backdrop. I'm sure this suits many a listener, particularly those that don't like rockin' the neighborhood much and hold a premium of shadings and what I call "the tinkles" over dynamic swing. I have this unhealthy compunction to approximate live levels when I'm feeling particularly frisky, which lately has been often! I have a strong bias for step up transformers over active MC stages and Headamps into robust and fanatically built tube MM sections with passive RIAA. I think it is because of what you mentioned about adding active gain stages. Deep down I am a SET lover after all. It carries over to my preference for zero global negative feedback designs, heavy Class A bias amplification. The ones that do excellent active MC stages, in my experience, have been far and few between and cost a lot more. Step ups have their problems, particularly their susceptibility to hum. There are a bunch of new step ups coming out of Europe that for some reason are not as sensitive. The ones I'm using now are pure silver toroids with extremely wide bandwidth and I find to be very low in noise and no longer have the erratic FR of the EI SUTs of the past. I find these more transparent to the source than one of my very well reviewed and ranked phonostages even if it is or even maybe because it is fully balanced in operation. The other downside is phono pres like this live and die by the tubes in them perhaps because the circuits are so simple. The challenge shifts heavily into the tubes, grounding schemes and power supply implementation. They are shall I say, in need of more owner involvement!

In any case, in my experience Koetsus benefit more from the added gain than every cartridge that I own. The others improve bass pitch and solidity but benefit little elsewhere save for a we bit more midrange texture. The Koetsus on the other hand benefit at both extremes and not just in the bass. Yes Koetsus are colored and the added gain doesn't change that. It does make the colors prismatic rather than a monochrome overlay. ARC PH series phonostages in particular have problems bringing the Platimum Koetsus to life, perhaps with the exception of the Hybrid PH3. Something they don't seem to have any problems with with any other carts.

Boy, are we nuts or what!? LOL!

 

[MylesBAstor]

I totally agree Myles. I've had phono stages that sacrifice gain for a more silent backdrop. I'm sure this suits many a listener, particularly those that don't like rockin' the neighborhood much. I have this unhealthy compunction to approximate live levels when I'm feeling particularly frisky, which lately has been often! I have a bias for step up transformers over active MC stages and Headamps into robust and fanatically built tube MM sections with passive RIAA. I think it is because of what you mentioned about adding active gain stages. The ones that do excellent ones are far and few between and cost a lot more. Step ups have their problems, particularly their susceptibility to hum. There are a bunch of new step ups coming out of Europe that for some reason are not as sensitive. The ones I'm using now are pure silver toroids with extremely wide bandwidth and I find to be very low in noise and no longer have the erratic FR of the EI SUTs of the past. I find these more transparent to the source than one of my very well reviewed and ranked phonostages even if it is or even maybe because it is fully balanced in operation. The other downside is phono pres like this live and die by the tubes in them perhaps because the circuits are so simple.

In any case, in my experience Koetsus benefit more from the added gain than every cartridge that I own. The other improve bass pitch and solidity but benefit little elsewhere. The Koetsus on the other hand benefit at both extremes and not just in the bass. Yes Koetsus are colored and the added gain doesn't change that. It does make the colors prismatic rather than a monochrome overlay.

Boy, are we nuts or what!? LOL!

Yes but I want it all: both high gain and low noise!!! (OK I know there are solid-state phono sections that do that )

I've grown weary lately of phono stages that sacrifice gain. And there are several high gain phono stages out there as you said, it's more often than not uses either rare a SUT or hybrid tube/ss. And there are a few of the latter, the most notable being the Doshi, that really sound excellent and would be hard to tell that they're a hybrid design eg. that residual transistor zing, and loss of low level resolution and 3D.

 

[JackD201]

I'm not willing to sacrifice the tubes, well except maybe for rectification only. It does burn my butt that that means one less opportunity to tube roll. I try to go all out for neutrality everywhere else and the front end is where I give myself all the latitude to salt and pepper to taste.

 

[XV-1]

yummy

 

[MylesBAstor]

yummy

I assume it's painted since I remember them saying it was a solid Ti body?

 

[mep]

Yes but I want it all: both high gain and low noise!!! (OK I know there are solid-state phono sections that do that )

SS pre-preamps/phono stages are the standard for low noise and high gain. Any tube phono preamp that has high gain and low noise are exceptions. That's why lots of *tube* phono sections with high gain either use SUTs or FETs for the input stage in order to step up the voltage of the cartridge output before handing the signal over to tubes. Pure tube high gain phono sections are a train wreck waiting to happen. They are going to go noisy, it's just a question of how quick, and that assumes they were ever "quiet."

 

[microstrip]

SS pre-preamps/phono stages are the standard for low noise and high gain. Any tube phono preamp that has high gain and low noise are exceptions. That's why lots of *tube* phono sections with high gain either use SUTs or FETs for the input stage in order to step up the voltage of the cartridge output before handing the signal over to tubes. Pure tube high gain phono sections are a train wreck waiting to happen. They are going to go noisy, it's just a question of how quick, and that assumes they were ever "quiet."

Mep,

You were reading the data sheet of the Audio Research Phone REF2 ...
It is true. It uses high-gain, extremely low-noise FETs in the input stage. And it is really noise free.

 

[mep]

Micro-ARC has been using that trick for awhile. I had an ARC PH-3SE and it was quiet as a church mouse. Boring as a church mouse too. The phono section in my Yamaha C2a sounded much the better which surprised me (another expectation bias shattered on the rocks of reality).

 

[jadis]

yummy

I have always wondered what that white tape at the bottom of the body is there for? I once had a Lyra modified nude Koetsu and it also had a tape under the body. Good thing it does not fall off in time.