Ethernet cables to and from your switch?

[NigelB]

Don't have an answer for your directionality question. On directionality, all I can say was that when I swapped ends with the Supra, it was definitely much better one way than the other. I, like you, do want to understand why things happen or how they work, but in this case I really don't know. I guess contacting Supra may provide an answer?

Cable settling. I shall define what I mean by this. Cables don't like to be moved, so when you first put them in a system, they need time to settle. Even a cable that has 1,000s of hours on it like the Supra I mentioned above. It was fully burned in but had been out of the system for probably a year and so it needed some settling time to sound correct. I knew after a day or two, the newly inserted Supra 8+, that something was still wrong. And so I switched it end for end and after a little more settling, the sound was much better.

'My answer: nothing changes but your ears.' - I'd prefer if you not speak for me. I know my system quite well. I can hear any change I make and the one I'm talking about above wasn't subtle. That I can't explain why there was a change, of course also does not mean that it did not occur. Regards

We definitely have different experiences of cables.

I wasn't speaking for you, honest, I was suggesting a reason why you heard what you heard. Happy to learn from other directionality/"settling" theories, I just haven't seen or heard any yet.

 

[NigelB]

I've modified STP and S/FTP cables by removing the gold wrap from one end, leaving only the non-conductive plastic. I've modified CAT8 cables by replacing one metal RJ45 connector with a generic plastic connector. I had one of my Furutech cables modified, upgrading both connectors with Telegartners and lifting the ground on one end. In some cases I use a LAN Isolator to break the ground connection, a strategy also used by SOtM for their ethernet cables.

Hi @audiobomber , I found your list of 4 different ways of "de-grounding" (if I am allowed to make up a word) one end of a shielded cable most helpful.
I have a Melco C1AE here which for all intents and purposes appear to be the same as the C100 except for the latter being grounded at one end only. I could just buy a C100 and compare but I'm interested in seeing if I can lift the earth one end of the C1AE before I do that.
Most straightforward and most DIYable seems to be to either (a) remove the gold wrap from one end or (b) source a LAN isolator.
I don't yet have the tools to re-terminate an ethernet cable myself so I guess that rules out your second option. Getting someone else to re-terminate for me seems sensible for most folk though I think I'd need to be starting with something like a Furutech cable to justify the investment.
Great food for thought. Thanks again.

 

[Republicoftexas69]

He has, by me also, because the truth speaks through him!

 

[Republicoftexas69]

Manufacturers probably mark directionality to keep audiophools happy, and it makes it easier when you change equipment, you know you are keeping the direction the same.

Are you a happy audiophool?

 

[Republicoftexas69]

@Republicoftexas69 Don't you believe in keeping the directionality the same, the gentleman from Melco told us they mark one end of their C100 cable not because it sounds better one way or the other, but to enable the customer to keep it the same direction no matter how many times you remove the cable and then re-install.

If there is an indicator on a cable I will use it. If not oh well... not fiddle farting doing an A/B comparison on a bidirectional cable. If I tell the music will sound better with your finger up your gazeekee you going to try it?

 

[Antonio66]

Are you a happy audiophool?

I'm a happy music listener, I don't waste money on hifi when I cannot hear a difference. If I can hear an improvement I have to decide how much that improvement is worth, I may be better off saving my money an improving a different piece in my hifi chain.

 

[Antonio66]

If there is an indicator on a cable I will use it. If not oh well... not fiddle farting doing an A/B comparison on a bidirectional cable. If I tell the music will sound better with your finger up your gazeekee you going to try it?

I certainly do not waste my time changing the direction of my cable, if the manufacturer marks directionality then I will follow their guide. Sorry but I don't understand the term 'gazeekee', but I don't usually put my finger up anything whilst listening to music.

 

[Republicoftexas69]

I'm a happy music listener, I don't waste money on hifi when I cannot hear a difference. If I can hear an improvement I have to decide how much that improvement is worth, I may be better off saving my money an improving a different piece in my hifi chain.

So why do you have to make such a divisive comment calling people audiophiles?
It may be that your system is not that revealing.
Anyways enjoy what you have and maybe a little less name calling. Agon maybe?

 

[Antonio66]

@Republicoftexas69 I wasn't calling anyone names by using the word audiophools.
The system I'm looking at consists of Rossini Apex, Antipodes K50, Audionet Humboldt and Estelon speakers, I'll let you decide how revealing that is.

 

[b345t]

Theoretically Supra Is non-directional because both ends are grounded.

The C100 has the Melco name printed on the grounded connector. That end goes upstream.

Is it critical? Every audiophile has some amount of OCD, so sure, direction is critical. Some may want to try both directions and there's nothing terribly wrong with that.

Could you possibly clarify what you mean by upstream vs downstream? I am waiting for my C100 to arrive today. From what I understand, it is better to connect the side with the Melco name printed on the first router and the 'un-named' side on the switch? Thanks

 

[Antonio66]

@b345t This statement came directly from Melco:-


The RJ45 connector carrying the Melco logo is the end that the shield (screen) is connected to and this should be connected at the product that is grounded, normally indicated by the presence of a 3 pin plug socket such as a IEC "kettle socket".

If neither end is grounded then simply connect the Melco logo at the source end (start of signal flow).

 

[Geoffkait]

Hope I don’t stir the pot too much but all wire is directional, at least wire that is pulled through a die. I realize they have cast copper wire now which I imagine are not directional. So, with that in mind we have a big problem, no? Internal wiring in electronics is directional, too. And internal speaker wiring is directional. Transformers, capacitors, fuses, even stock fuses, and of course speaker cables, interconnects, digital cables, HDMI cables and drum roll… power cords.

 

[Republicoftexas69]

Hope I don’t stir the pot too much but all wire is directional, at least wire that is pulled through a die. I realize they have cast copper wire now which I imagine are not directional. So, with that in mind we have a big problem, no? Internal wiring in electronics is directional, too. And internal speaker wiring is directional. Transformers, capacitors, fuses, even stock fuses, and of course speaker cables, interconnects, digital cables, HDMI cables and drum roll… power cords.

I do not think you are stirring a pot stating facts. Some may disagree but will be civil about it.

 

[MarkusBarkus]

...I believe the continuous-cast single crystal wire is *still* pulled through a die for final profile/size.

 

[Geoffkait]

Thanks

 

[Tuckers]

In my sonic experience, hearing directionality lessens or dissapears with use. A cable that is plugged in the 'wrong way' for 2 years, may sound better than a newer cable that is the 'right way'. Also knowing which direction a wire is pulled is more an act of faith than objective reality, you can't really depend on the cable markings on the majority of cable, as the manufacturers don't generally believe its a thing. Especially for ethernet cables etc.

I do however pay attention to directionality as far as its possible.

 

[Republicoftexas69]

I certainly do not waste my time changing the direction of my cable, if the manufacturer marks directionality then I will follow their guide. Sorry but I don't understand the term 'gazeekee', but I don't usually put my finger up anything whilst listening to music.

Your rearend.

 

[Republicoftexas69]

@Republicoftexas69 I wasn't calling anyone names by using the word audiophools.
The system I'm looking at consists of Rossini Apex, Antipodes K50, Audionet Humboldt and Estelon speakers, I'll let you decide how revealing that is.

So you do not own it, just tire kickin?

 

[NigelB]

Hope I don’t stir the pot too much but all wire is directional, at least wire that is pulled through a die. I realize they have cast copper wire now which I imagine are not directional. So, with that in mind we have a big problem, no? Internal wiring in electronics is directional, too. And internal speaker wiring is directional. Transformers, capacitors, fuses, even stock fuses, and of course speaker cables, interconnects, digital cables, HDMI cables and drum roll… power cords.

What do you mean by directional though? Yes, most (all?) wire will have been through a directional process eg extrusion but it has ever been thus. Do you mean this has an impact on sound quality? That a signal moves better/faster/quieter or something else in the direction of manufacture than in the opposite direction?
I guess there are at least a couple of questions buried in that:
- how do we know which is the "right" direction?
- what do we do about it if we do know? I think most of us here would draw the line at unwinding and reversing transformer wire... or reversing internal wires in a component...

I suggest generally not worrying about this unless we know for certain there is a mechanism by which installing wires in the "right" direction improves sound quality.

There are notable exceptions though. Some manufacturers designate cable directionality not just as an adornment but because there is something structurally different in the cable. For example, Townshend speaker cables use a (Zobel?) filter at one end, and - back on topic - the Melco C100 has its shield grounded at only one end. These are structurally directional, we're not talking molecular alignment or whatever.

 

[Geoffkait]

“Directionality” refers to the concept that wire and cables sound better in one direction than the other. It’s because wire is electrically and physically asymmetrical. Due to the metal crystal structures being deformed during manufacture, when pulled through a die. Like quills on a porcupine as, it were. Some cable companies, relatively few, most notably AudioQuest, control “directionality” during manufacture. This “directionality” is separate from the shielding issue. For optimum results shielded cables should be controlled for both types of “directionality.”